Vendors

[LightORamaDan]

Did I miss anything today?

Didn't miss anything special. Decided we would put some restrictions/control over vendors in the forums. Vendors that are considered competitors will not be allowed. Those who are not, we will come up with an area were we will have tigher control, users will have a clearer view of feedback on vendors, etc...

Dan

[Guest wbottomley]

Didn't miss anything special. Decided we would put some restrictions/control over vendors in the forums. Vendors that are considered competitors will not be allowed. Those who are not, we will come up with an area were we will have tigher control, users will have a clearer view of feedback on vendors, etc...

Dan

Thank you for responding in a civil manor. It seems that Don Teague wanted to be a little [Foul Language Used] with a PM. One simple damn question has to be so complicated. I was not aware of the things that happened today.

[scubado]

I don't know what the heck happened either. I know a couple members had some angst against one vendor that had problems last year. The Vendor also tried to help lesson the pain from the late shipments. The vendors don't really need to advertise here, they get plenty of mention of them from our discussions. LOR had problems in 2011 that were beyond their control too, nobody is immune. Stuff happens.

[LightORamaDan]

I don't know what the heck happened either. I know a couple members had some angst against one vendor that had problems last year. The Vendor also tried to help lesson the pain from the late shipments. The vendors don't really need to advertise here, they get plenty of mention of them from our discussions. LOR had problems in 2011 that were beyond their control too, nobody is immune. Stuff happens.

Look,,, Nothing happened today except it was the day I decided to change things. Nothing more than that. Trying to read anthing else into is a waste of peoples precious neural energy.

On another note, I have repeatedly seen people mention that LOR had problems in 2011 and this gets compared to pre-sales where vendors change the rules and delivered late if at all. Please note that when we had supply problems we did not sell anything, we did not collect anything. We provided updates as to when stock would be available for sale, we were not telling people when stuff that they had already, partially paid for would be delivered.

Light O Rama has never collected a dime from a person until the order paced was shipped (unless they asked us to because of currency conversion rates, etc..)... So I do not like to be lumped into some of these other groups.

Just another reason I like to keep arguments about outside vendors off the forums as we see LOR's name sucked into it. We make mistakes but we do it in our way and in our own style. Perhaps not the best but it is not the same as the others.

Dan

[Jeff Messer]

I would like to have the watch on the shelf third from the right. How much?

[hdracer]

I for one agree with Dan on a level. Ive seen where a light vendor had issues last year on delivering goods as promised. Then as he posted this year about his presale a not so happy customer of his from last year, started bashing the vendor over the issue in public view. I believe there needs to be a respect factor held for ALL parties on both sides! It is simple (PM)......

On the other hand I like simplicities. Aslong as the vendor isn't selling controllers and is basically lights ONLY and are willing to hold a good reputation/respect for customers, then sale on. But we as a community must understand. That LOR isn't responsible AT ALL for other companies/vendors behaviors or buisness tactics!

This all is a grey area for buisnesses. It would be easier if everyone had just a little kooth.

I have a ton of LOR equipment too & need other things to buy more of. To buy more LOR stuff....

Then I have other components that I go to other sites to research for.

It usually not a good thing when you mix religions in a since.

I say if you sale lights ONLY then lets celebrate!

other than that it is Dan's soap. He can stroke it the way he wants...

Edited January 9, 2013 by hdracer

[WilliamS]

I can see where this is coming from and going and to a business owner makes plenty of sense. Having direct competition on your own site is self destructive. The only way that works is if the prices were regulated by LOR. They cant have a pricing war against thier own product they sell in their own store.

There are plenty of LOR autorized dealers and they can sell LOR products and Im sure there is profit in the prices they have. Like any business LOR can do some of the work, but if your opening your own store, you need to do some of your own work to drive sales. This doesnt sound easy, but not much is.

As for the light vendors. Again this may not be LOR driven sales but can have a sever backlash onto the name. If you purchased something based on the LOR forums ad you would like to believe LOR would be able to backup lost, broken, stolen, shipping, or any other problem coming from that store. Regardless it be lights, wire frames, sequences. This is in no way LORs fault for but you will light up the forum with bad things about the vendor and perhaps carry over bringing LOR into the debate. Again scenarios that not every one will do but still it drags the LOR name into the mud. If you search google and find these threads by chance how does this look to a potential buyer? People are so attached to other peoples opinions of little to no evidence on the internet its almost funny yet sad.

Im sure there will be a middle gound but as Dan said there will be a need to monitor and keep track of whats going on. This protect him as a business owner, the companys good name, and keeping the money honest. We all know LOR stands behind thier product, they have quick customer service, and they are here to help us create smiles for countless people. Let them do this as they feel it needs to be done. The word fair isnt what its about, the fact is they want to keep the Light O Rama name clean to continue doing what they do. The more they do of what they do best, the better the products we get to use gets better as well.

Group Hug!

[Shubb]

I think most people are forgetting this is not a public forum. It is run by Light-O-Rama, for Light-O-Rama.

Not for CDI, MITS, HLE or LMNOP.

The fact that Dan has allowed others to profit from his company's forum for this long goes to show his attitude toward his customers.

If the vendors want a place to advertise, they can start their own forums or stay with public forums.

Just my 2 cents.

[kelly jett]

you know i have to agree with most of comments on this issue. the way i understand it that this is the LIGHT O RAMA forums. this isn't the "well lor is a really good product so i'm gonna put my stuff out there and everyone is gonna think i'm as good as they are" forum.

i think alot of businesses have benefited from the openness that these forums have had for many years. i really think the issue isn't just the vendors. don't get me wrong if you make controllers or other items that compete with lor than there is no reason why you should be allowed to advertise your items on the lor site. it would be like walmart letting target advertise on their website and offering the same items.

the problem seems to be buyers having issues with vendors and instead of dealing with them personally they jump on the lor forums and bash them and anyone whoever dealt with them. just because vendor x didn't get you your lights fast enough or had some issue then that has nothing to do with lor and its really nobodies business but your own. you know it would be one thing for members to say "be careful because i had an issue with this vendor." instead of making a big scene on the lor forums that don't have a vested interest with that vendor.

maybe their needs to be a location where you (i.e. business or person) can put out a post stating...."i'm selling this or i'm having this sale." and then the post is frozen. the post has a link on it where the people that may be interested can go to and do their own research and make their own decision. just cause joe is selling his items and you don't like joe it doesn't mean you should bash joe in front of everybody. everyone should have the opportunity to find out if they like joe or not. or joes business.

i have dealt with many vendors that i have learned about from these forums as well as the pc forums as well as from the expo and if i've had a good relationship with them then i will help them out by telling people to look at them for their products. i've done that many times with people that came to my display and i promote the crap out of lor.

i have had issues with a couple of vendors and if i see someone asking about them then i will (pm) them and give them a heads up. its still their decision on whether do deal with them or not.

if you mention 10 different vendors then it doesn't matter if you get 100 great reviews its always the 1 bad review that your remember. if you pry around your gonna find that out with any company you deal with. there is no company ever that didn't have some issue that made some customer mad. its the good companies (lor included) that go that extra step to make sure you have a good experience and will come back to them in the future.

i agree with quite a few of the posts....the more lights and things we buy then the more we will use lor.

it just needs to be if your competeing with dan then your not welcome. if your products are additions or accessories to dans then you can having a sale come see what i've got. its up to the person to do their homework.

every business has issues and hiccups from time to time, its how that business owns up to the issues and solves the problem. its also how understanding the customer is to the situation. i've had hiccups with many vendors and those that wanted to keep my business did what needed to be done to take care of me and my situation. if your not happy then don't deal with them again.

to the vendors......never make a promise you can't keep. if circumstances beyond your control come up then grow a pair and man up and let your customer know about the issues. we all understand that your dealing with other people and other countries too. its amazing how understanding people can be with just a little communication.

to the customers.....buyer beware of course. also i've noticed guys getting all bent out of shape over delivery dates for pre-orders. if you order it in jan/feb does it really matter if you get it in june or july? if you don't get it at all then thats different but does it really matter if you get those cases of lights for your christmas display a little later in the summer? i'm all about saving some money and getting the most for my buck but i'd rather pay a little more to a vendor that i know will treat me like they would want to be treated.

dan.... thanks for all your do.... thanks for putting out a quality product....thanks for helping out when needed.....and thanks for treating people they way you would want to be treated.

[rainyoregonchristmas]

People are so attached to other peoples opinions of little to no evidence on the internet its almost funny yet sad.

Hey,

I'm married to a French Model. I know its true, wow, 'cause I said it and now its on the internet. And as EVERYONE knows, I can't put anything on the internet that isn't true.

[magish01]

I wondered who ended up with my ex-wife!

[james campbell]

I am a member of pc,imho I think they have too many sections and you don't really know where to help or check out next. not to say that would happen here

[edvas69]

my 2 cents worth

Its very simple the LOR forums are provided to give additional support to the LOR community, the forum is payed for and managed by LOR which is a company that needs to make a profit and stay competative. So why would LOR allow competitors to advertise something that competes with them on their own forum.You cant compare the LOR forums to other community based forums.

Ive actually been amazed at the level of tolerance that Dan and his crew have shown over the years so its no surprise that Dan has taken this action.

[gc75067]

doesnt hurt my feelings. sure i have to look around more for pre-sales on lights and or decorations... but hey, i came here to learn how to use LOR products

[TGabriel]

All everyone has to do is get on the vendors email list and they will email you anytime when a presale or sales are going on.

Its that easy or not.

Thomas

[shfr26]

Maybe Lond winded so stand by.

So where does Dan cut the line? These people sell this and you need more LOR stuff,LOR sell"s more [Foul Language Used], so he makes out in the end. These people sell this, and so does LOR, LOR losses money.

As far as, what is a "vendor", I think that is a very open question.

This guy can advertise his stuff here and he has this,email or whatever as their website, so is that a vendor ?

Every year this forum takes a very huge crap with the influx of people just prior to show time, just wanting to have everthing handed over to them to get their diplay runnning. I have no problem helping a new person to get started, but do just a little research first.

And then you get the over jeolous admin, deleting and cleaning up post so you nobody really knows what was posted or not.

This year I did notice some people did the research first, and then asked questions, some people ran with the new techology, and made a great show. I also saw that "Admin" was getiing rid of post way too much, I saw very knowledable people go away because of the BS that went on here.

I my view, this is a very fine line that needs to be crossed and I hope that LOR does the correct thing. If I had to say one major concern, if I pm or ask "admin" why this or that was deleted, then man up and tell me why, or do not delte it.

Off my soapbox, going to start planning next years display. Happy lighting.

If I get warning points or banned because of this post, I do not care!

[TitusCarnathan]

All everyone has to do is get on the vendors email list and they will email you anytime when a presale or sales are going on.

Its that easy or not.

Thomas

Yes, but not all new people know of the different companies that sell led's. And other items that are needed to run a display. When I started into this hobby back in 2008 I did not know about CDI, or any of the other companies, until I came to this message board. Which also means I did not know that they had sales that made these strings cheaper. I agree that lor should block competitors that make similar items that they make. But companies that sell wireframes, parts for mega trees, Lights etc... are not competiting

Edited January 10, 2013 by TitusCarnathan

[MikeyRo]

Just a thought for Dan... Maybe somewhere where a vendor can be listed, by sending Dan their info, such as things they sell, website, etc. for each vendor, there could be a voting system, where each registered member can vote once positive or negative and have the ability to change their vote.

That way, people can find vendors who sell what they need, see a cumulative score from the members here and not have the hassle of the snide comments and arguments that seem to ensue whenever people ask for opinions.

I am sure this software probably does not have that ability, but maybe it can be done.

[John (oldandslow)]

I have been in retail for decades and found that less than 1 percent of the customers are really scam artists that cause most of the trouble on this site. We have all been screwed in a transaction one time or another in our life time. The question is who do you blame, certainly not yourself and certainly NOT LIGHT_O_RAMA.

Light-O-Rama stands behind and fixes their problems and they shouldn't have to fix other vendors problems.

They sell CCR's, and the new rage is Pixels and to me that is taking business from them and might be a concern to them on this forum. I think it's the grief that they have to deal with when a vendor and a user on this forum don't agree and want Dan to fix their problems.

This forum has helped me become a better user of their equipment, as well as where to get good deals on where to buy things on sale. This intern makes my social securty check go a little farther so I can buy another controller for this year's show.

I was sad to see Jeff M leave our board as he helped me on several occasions.

So let's have a cool down session and wait for Dans next move before you leave these boards. We need you all, vendors and posters alike, to improve our skills.

John (oldandslow)

[LightORamaDan]

Maybe Lond winded so stand by.

So where does Dan cut the line? These people sell this and you need more LOR stuff,LOR sell"s more [Foul Language Used], so he makes out in the end. These people sell this, and so does LOR, LOR losses money.

As far as, what is a "vendor", I think that is a very open question.

This guy can advertise his stuff here and he has this,email or whatever as their website, so is that a vendor ?

Every year this forum takes a very huge crap with the influx of people just prior to show time, just wanting to have everthing handed over to them to get their diplay runnning. I have no problem helping a new person to get started, but do just a little research first.

And then you get the over jeolous admin, deleting and cleaning up post so you nobody really knows what was posted or not.

This year I did notice some people did the research first, and then asked questions, some people ran with the new techology, and made a great show. I also saw that "Admin" was getiing rid of post way too much, I saw very knowledable people go away because of the BS that went on here.

I my view, this is a very fine line that needs to be crossed and I hope that LOR does the correct thing. If I had to say one major concern, if I pm or ask "admin" why this or that was deleted, then man up and tell me why, or do not delte it.

Off my soapbox, going to start planning next years display. Happy lighting.

If I get warning points or banned because of this post, I do not care!

I will agree that from a business point of view it would make sense to allow some vendors who's products exhibit a synergy with LOR products to post here. It is good for customers and for LOR. We are looking into a way to organize such a thing.

Judgments as to the nature of posts are made and posts are edited or removed based on those judgments. Sometimes (such as with your post), the post is hidden while it is being reviewed. No one here (or anywhere else in the world) is perfect thus our monitoring of this forum is not perfect but history has shown that due to the character of some users on this forum we must actively intervene to maintain an atmosphere that I consider acceptable.

As far as deleting post or threads that do not meet the forum guidelines, we do not need to provide an explanation as to why a post is removed. It gets very busy here during the holiday season. We may sometimes error and overreact and other times under react to things. That is the way it is. Sometimes a thread is so intertwined with inappropriate posts that the best thing to do is just delete the entire thread rather than take to time to clean it up. Other times individual posts are deleted as they are considered inappropriate or not germane to the subject of the thread.