USB driver hangs

[socalezrider]

I uninstalled all LOR software the USB drivers and ran the regwipe application and then rebooted. I installed 1.5.0 from CD and upgraded straight away to 1.16.15 and then upgraded drivers to the version indicated in prior post. The show ran perfect for the past 4 nights and then crashed unexpectedly tonight which brought me back to the message boards.

I stumbled across this thread, ran the test and sure enough, it crashed.

[LightORamaDan]

socalezrider wrote:

I uninstalled all LOR software the USB drivers and ran the regwipe application and then rebooted. I installed 1.5.0 from CD and upgraded straight away to 1.16.15 and then upgraded drivers to the version indicated in prior post. The show ran perfect for the past 4 nights and then crashed unexpectedly tonight which brought me back to the message boards.

I stumbled across this thread, ran the test and sure enough, it crashed.

This USB problem apperas to be a combination of the USB drivers from FTDI and our software. We are not sure which is to blame but the result is that on some machines drivers/software hang. We are trying to come up with a solution but the problem is difficult to reproduce here... (it is obviously not hard to reproduce on some machines).

We are looking into the problem and trying to understand the exact error that is occuring and what can be done to prevent or handle this error in a way that the software does not hang.

The latest versions of the FTDI drivers seem to handle things better and reduce the occurance of problems but it is not perfect yet.

[socalezrider]

What can I use in place of the USBRS485B? My first LOR box is 95' from the PC running the LOR software. The 4 subsequent boxes are mounted right next to the first one.

[lkinsey]

Please see my previous posts for the following to make any sense.

I've done more testing since I can create the problem with little effort. (I also owe the LOR team a favor).

It does not fail on my desktop which has the same software and is almost identical hardware wise. Desktops are well shielded and grounded as opposed to laptops. It would seem like there's a RF problem with extraneous electrical noise that's picked up by the signal cables and then propagated to the laptop which can't handle it.

The failure occurs even when all electrical power is removed from everything (still grounded) and the laptop is running on battery or plugged in. My laptop and I suspect most or all others are not grounded through the power plug.

The failures occurred when I removed the FM transmitter power plug (transformer) and then reinstalled it. Interestingly, it failed less often if the speaker wire was disconnected between the two.

The other consistent failure occurred when I removed the power plug outside (about 6 ft away from the laptop) to the lights for my flag. This drives some electronics that control when the lights come on via a photo cell so this unit is capable of creating RF noise as well.

An electric drill caused a failure but not consistently. again, an electrically noisy device.

As I said in an old post, I first ran into this problem using a 1/4 hp motor.

I could not make it fail with a simple light (100 watts) turned off and on repeatedly.

I grounded the laptop and moved it away from the noise makers as far as the signal cable allowed (about 30 ft) and it still failed.

No, I didn't build a Faraday cage for testing.

It failed using the Sequencer or a show. I did most of the testing using the Sequencer for expediency.

It's hard to tell from most of the posts if a laptop or desktop was used during a failure.

Please signify which in future posts. If it only fails using a laptop, that might afford a workaround for those that don't have a serial adapter and have access to a desktop.

[socalezrider]

I am using a Dell desktop. I have everything sitting on a table in close proximity to each other (the monitor, the fm transmitter and the USB485 adapter). I also have a small radio on the floor next to the table.

Whenever I turn the switch off, you can here the popping noise through the radio over the music playing in the show. I am wondering if I should plug the FM transmitter into a different outlet from the rest of the equipment. Problem is I need it to be close to the computer for audio out connection.

[lkinsey]

socalezrider wrote:

I am using a Dell desktop. I have everything sitting on a table in close proximity to each other (the monitor, the fm transmitter and the USB485 adapter). I also have a small radio on the floor next to the table.

Whenever I turn the switch off, you can here the popping noise through the radio over the music playing in the show. I am wondering if I should plug the FM transmitter into a different outlet from the rest of the equipment. Problem is I need it to be close to the computer for audio out connection.

I'm a little confused here. If you mean you've turned the transmitter power off, your going to hear a pop or click and then nothing on your radio other than static. That's to be expected.

I'm disappointed to learn that your problem, if it's the same as mine, occurrs on a desktop. That shoots down some of my theories.

The transmitter causing problems when powered off or on is only symptomatic of a bigger problem. I could create the problem without the transmitter used at all so I know, in my case, it is not the primary cause.

Having said that and without a real fix for the problem, I can't suggest that moving the transmitter further away via a longer audio cable is going to help you but it wouldn't hurt. Long audio cables are fairly cheap.

Is there any possibility that your Dell isn't grounded? A simple multimeter or a friend with one could quickly determine that. Even going through a UPS, there should be a good ground.

In my case, using different outlets didn't make any difference. At one point, I had power off of everything and my Laptop still crashed.

One more question, is your adapter a USB485 or USB485B?

[socalezrider]

The adapter is the USB485B.

The show is running and the lights are flashing and the music is playing and being transmitted with the FM transmitter. I turn the radio on, very low, so that when the light show hangs, I am alerted right away. Don't really have front windows on my house to see the lights.

When the light switch in the room next to the room where the system is is switched on and off is when you can hearing a popping noise over the shows music. The light switch is on the same wall as the outlet where the system and transmitter is plugged into. So the electrical interference is being picked up either by the computer or by the FM transmitter and being heard through the radio receiving the signal.

[lkinsey]

socalezrider wrote:

The adapter is the USB485B.

The show is running and the lights are flashing and the music is playing and being transmitted with the FM transmitter. I turn the radio on, very low, so that when the light show hangs, I am alerted right away. Don't really have front windows on my house to see the lights.

When the light switch in the room next to the room where the system is is switched on and off is when you can hearing a popping noise over the shows music. The light switch is on the same wall as the outlet where the system and transmitter is plugged into. So the electrical interference is being picked up either by the computer or by the FM transmitter and being heard through the radio receiving the signal.

Thanks for the clarification.

What kind of lights do you have in the next room? Are they incandescent or flourescent?

I don't have a portable flourescent light to test with but a simple 100 watt light produced no sound at all from my transmitter.

If your lights are flourescent, that is another matter as they are subject to a lot of problems.

[lkinsey]

socalezrider wrote:

The adapter is the USB485B.

The show is running and the lights are flashing and the music is playing and being transmitted with the FM transmitter. I turn the radio on, very low, so that when the light show hangs, I am alerted right away. Don't really have front windows on my house to see the lights.

When the light switch in the room next to the room where the system is is switched on and off is when you can hearing a popping noise over the shows music. The light switch is on the same wall as the outlet where the system and transmitter is plugged into. So the electrical interference is being picked up either by the computer or by the FM transmitter and being heard through the radio receiving the signal.

Other questions I forgot to ask. Do you have any light dimmers in this next room or is there any other device that is automatically turned on with the light switch?

Is it only the room next door or can you duplicate the problem (noise on the radio or system crashes) with any light switch in the house?

[socalezrider]

Just the room next door, the laundry room switch, no dimmers either. And as one would expect the light controlled by the switch in question is flourescent. You think that is what the problem is?

[lkinsey]

socalezrider wrote:

Just the room next door, the laundry room switch, no dimmers either. And as one would expect the light controlled by the switch in question is flourescent. You think that is what the problem is?

Flourescent lights are always suspect. They must definately be grounded at the least and many are not. Check for the proper grounding first and then look at the light closely to see if it's flickering. I can't tell from here what the next step would be depending on what you find but consider replacing the tubes or balast or the whole light fixture if the noise dosen't subside.

As an as-side, I can't tell you how relieved I am to have my show now bullet proof using my old serial adapter. The only reason I went with this new USB adapter was because I use linkers and linkers require the power boost this adapter supplies when there is not a controller driving the linker and I thougth that that may be the case but it no longer is.

I strongly suggest getting a serial adapter and putting these problems behind you. Pay LOR anything they ask for specail delivery and get the feeling I now have that I can leave the show running and feel confident that when I return, it'll still be running. It's a great feeling.

Maybe, after this all blows over, LOR will give you some credit for shipping when they finally resolve the problem. It's the least they can do.

[socalezrider]

I was feeling good Friday when the show ran from start to end without a single glitch. By Monday night (4 consec. nights w/o fail) I was feeling great. Then Tuesday crash!

I do not use linkers, I am CAT5 from the USB485B to the first box and the next, the next and so on.

What exactly do I need from LOR to move away from using the USB485B adapter? Can I get it at a radio shack?

[lkinsey]

socalezrider wrote:

I was feeling good Friday when the show ran from start to end without a single glitch. By Monday night (4 consec. nights w/o fail) I was feeling great. Then Tuesday crash!

I do not use linkers, I am CAT5 from the USB485B to the first box and the next, the next and so on.

What exactly do I need from LOR to move away from using the USB485B adapter? Can I get it at a radio shack?

Good questions, Radio shack is not going to help. (Think Sony and Betamax)

From LOR, you can go with the USB serial adapter for $19.95 and then add the rs232-rj45 adapter for 24.95 for a total of $44.90 which is what I have. Instead, You could attempt to go with the lower powered adapter WSB-RS485 but I can't attest to the veracity of this device as this is what you (we) have but the none powered version. It would certainly be cheaper but your on your own here.

Personally I have more than $4K tied up in this endevor and I'll pay a lot for reliability at his point.

[LOR Girl]

Try this thread to see if it helps.

http://lightorama.mywowbb.com/forum72/15669-2.html

[disneyman]

There was really no solution on that tread either.

[MS_Mike]

I have a computer that just runs my Light-O-Rama system. It does have Norton protection on it.

It has Windows XP, Media Edition. It is configured to download and install Windows updates. I am running LOR 1.61.

Everything has been working properly until recently. A few Windows updates were installed (only change that I can determine) and a problem has begun.

During a show at around the same time frame each night, the computer crashes and the infamous "blue screen" appears. Once I reboot, everything is OK until the next night when the same thing happens.

I think it might be a conflict with Norton, since I have since uninstalled Norton and it did not crash last night. However, now on reboot, Windows gives me a notice that a "serious error has occurred" wanting me to forward the log of the error to Windows. However, I am now without anti-virus protection on the machine which is connected to the net.

This is the same machine with no configuration changes or software changes (other than the Windows updates) that ran all last year and so far all during this season without problems.

Could this be this same issue with the USB drivers? The problem seems to be a driver conflict. I was thinking it was Norton, but it could be the USB driver.

Mike

[lkinsey]

MS_Mike wrote:

I have a computer that just runs my Light-O-Rama system. It does have Norton protection on it.

It has Windows XP, Media Edition. It is configured to download and install Windows updates. I am running LOR 1.61.

Everything has been working properly until recently. A few Windows updates were installed (only change that I can determine) and a problem has begun.

During a show at around the same time frame each night, the computer crashes and the infamous "blue screen" appears. Once I reboot, everything is OK until the next night when the same thing happens.

I think it might be a conflict with Norton, since I have since uninstalled Norton and it did not crash last night. However, now on reboot, Windows gives me a notice that a "serious error has occurred" wanting me to forward the log of the error to Windows. However, I am now without anti-virus protection on the machine which is connected to the net.

This is the same machine with no configuration changes or software changes (other than the Windows updates) that ran all last year and so far all during this season without problems.

Could this be this same issue with the USB drivers? The problem seems to be a driver conflict. I was thinking it was Norton, but it could be the USB driver.

Mike

Hey Mike,

I'm currently running ZoneAlarm (firewall and virus protection) on my laptop that's driving my shows but tomorrow I'll run a quick test on my desktop which uses Norton as a firewall for a test for your benefit. I suspect that Norton is innocent here but will run the test and probably ask for more details afterword on your failure. Strongly suggest that you at least turn on the Windows firewall so you're not too exposed.

[MS_Mike]

I took Dan's advice and installed the updated RS485 driver but also took Norton completely off the machine for now.

The only reason that I suspected Norton is that it was crashing at the exact same time each evening. I checked for automatic updates, and auto running processes and could not find them.

With the new driver and the lack of Norton, I had no issues last night. Will again evaluate the situation and report back.

Was able to figure out that one of the error codes indicated a driver problem, so that might have been it.

Anyway, keeping my fingers crossed and will report back.

Mike

[lkinsey]

MS_Mike wrote:

I took Dan's advice and installed the updated RS485 driver but also took Norton completely off the machine for now.

The only reason that I suspected Norton is that it was crashing at the exact same time each evening. I checked for automatic updates, and auto running processes and could not find them.

With the new driver and the lack of Norton, I had no issues last night. Will again evaluate the situation and report back.

Was able to figure out that one of the error codes indicated a driver problem, so that might have been it.

Anyway, keeping my fingers crossed and will report back.

Mike

Ran a test of my show using Norton's NIS 2008 with no problems.

[MS_Mike]

Ok, think I have my problem diagnosed. It was not the Norton, it was falsely accused. It was indeed the USB RS486 driver. The new (updated) driver seems to have solved the problem. Two nights, no problems, after the driver upgrade.

Thanks for everyone's help. If there are any new developments, I will let you know.

Mike