A Specific Question For LOR Software Developers

[harrison0550]

I see we are back to the hardware discussion. Its not hardware, I converted the 65 universe sequence to an xlights sequence last night. The result was a file size less than half of the original LOR sequence and it played back perfectly outside with no lag. Same exact hardware, hooked up the same exact way.

I should probably add that I tested it with xlights on unicast. The show stops in 15 minuets so I will try and switch it to multicast and see if xlights will play it back in multicast smooth as well.

[jeffl]

I have been doing some testing with LOR, HLS and xLights running and its hard to believe most of you are so excited with the DMX output from LOR. After watching my Amazing Grace sequence out of HLS I'm amazed at what I was missing and didn't notice. I'm certainly not promoting either xLights or HLS, but I can tell now that LOR is not optimized for outputting DMX unless you're only expecting events at .05 and above.

Then again, maybe you are all running your LOR gear with the LOR protocol still and just using DMX for RGB channels.

[WilliamS]

Xlight and HLS dont sell hardware based on thier outputs either. LOR has a stake in keeping the software most compatible with LOR hardware. 1.31 came about most likely because most of us wanted it. Im sure it was with a hard grin as it will reduce the sales of the CCR/CCB products but it keeps the software side going. I do believe they are working on it behind the scenes to implement more options for us. Only people that know that are Dan and who ever he has working on it. I personally love the software, there are options I wish I had but nothing thats crushing me that causes me to use LSP or others.

This is the first season we had1.31 and as much DMX as we have used this year. LOR in the past has fixed what did not work, does anyoone think they wont now?

[thebaronn]

I mentioned xlights above earlier.

But at the time it wouldn't help me cause I didn't have a finished sequence to load into it. I emailed that guy Matt (I think it's his name) and asked for a copy cause the link I had on the Dropbox was incorrect. I hope he gets back to me soon.

And yes, RGB with DMX everything else is LOR protocol.

And well, the rendered video at 15fps comes in a hair above .05 so I can't imagine it gets better with xlights. I would also be interested in what you were missing? From HLS vs LOR. Did you notice items not coming on in the right spot? Or dropped commands? When I used LSP I had super lag and completely dropped sections of lights.

When you say LOR isn't optimized for DMX, are you referring to the output or the sequencer as well? And how fast are these songs that u sequence <.05sec? Wow! I would be interested in that sequence!

I hope to get a good camera, take video. Then run the show throught xlights and see what I see.

Do you have a copy of xlights 2012e available?

[harrison0550]

http://dl.dropbox.co...setup-2012e.exe

[thebaronn]

Sweet! Thank you sir.

Download when I get home.

Hope I don't need a degree to understand it!

I was thinking, I only have one song that warrants timings less than .05sec. But I always us the tapper to create my timings.

It is roughly 150BPM so with 16th notes that's only .025 so I guess it could be a factor, but I only have 1 song that fast. It's at the end of my carol of the bells medley now (DJ Demonixx version)

That is one thing good about video, it is very forgiving!

[jeffl]

I did some testing today with sACNViewer using LOR S3, xLights and HLS from a "FPS" standpoint and my results are below. Now granted I'm not a DMX expert so my finding could be in error. The results of my visual sequence testing in the packages however is good.

• 15.6 - 16 xLights
  
• 42.8 - 43.6 LOR S3
  
• 40 - 40.40 HLS
  

Based on the FPS data alone I would think that:

• HLS and LOR should be very responsive.
  
• xLights would be jerky
  

What I actually think that is happening "Compared to if this were a LOR protocol controller is":

xLights - Is outputting data at 16fps and the output may be missing some commands

LOR - Is outputting a "high" rate of DMX packets, but some are probably 0 instead of good data

HLS - Somehow converted the LOR sequence and optimized the sequence to output a "near" LOR experience

I don't think it's a matter of FPS, or I think S3 in DMX would look almost the same as running LOR controllers using the LOR protocol.

I do hope that LOR can find a way to optimize DMX channels the same as they have done with LOR channels. To do this however I think will require sending out "good" data at the rate it is currently sending out data.

Like many. I have no plans to move away from S3. I only use these other tools for testing and hopefully helping LOR make their product and my experience better.

Edited January 2, 2013 by jeffl

[thebaronn]

Xlight and HLS dont sell hardware based on thier outputs either. LOR has a stake in keeping the software most compatible with LOR hardware. 1.31 came about most likely because most of us wanted it. Im sure it was with a hard grin as it will reduce the sales of the CCR/CCB products but it keeps the software side going. I do believe they are working on it behind the scenes to implement more options for us. Only people that know that are Dan and who ever he has working on it. I personally love the software, there are options I wish I had but nothing thats crushing me that causes me to use LSP or others.

This is the first season we had1.31 and as much DMX as we have used this year. LOR in the past has fixed what did not work, does anyoone think they wont now?

I am a little less optimistic. I had an issue this year when I purchased the CCPixels. They did not do what I wanted. http://forums.lighto...cp-santa-house/ I had several emails with LOR and at one point I was told I expected too much of them... Then they were working on the "superspeed" and I was toying with them and I was hopeful. Eventually after a ton of emails, it was forgotten (It was in july when they did the forum changeover and the summer sale so I am sure that one person's problem wasn't a priority). At the time I was really pissed, but it was during that time that I was introduced to my good friend E1.31!! Donny Carter and Mark Schell showed me the way! I bought 4000 pixels from Ray wu and 6 E682 boards and now my display is a 100 times better than what I originally had planned. youtu.be/HxBs7TuT81Y

Don't get me wrong, I still love LOR. I love the sequencer, it is great (as long as your file isn't over 1GB, LOL!) but I also love the LSP, matrix animator, it is top notch. Just don't limit yourself to one company.

Next year I am sure this will be my way of sequencing.

1. Sequence in S3

2. Export to LSP and sequence my matricies

4. Export to xlights or RJ's conductor

I will do whatever I need to make my show look they way I want.

[jeffl]

I will do whatever I need to make my show look they way I want.

Unfortunately after all the work I did this year to get "good" but not "great" results, I'm tired. I do have a better understanding of what is possible with the LOR protocol and DMX and know that DMX will never fade, shimmer or twinkle as nice as LOR, but I know it can be close and we are not there yet.

[thebaronn]

I did some testing today with sACNViewer using LOR S3, xLights and HLS from a "FPS" standpoint and my results are below. Now granted I'm not a DMX expert so my finding could be in error. The results of my visual sequence testing in the packages however is good.

• 15.6 - 16 xLights
  
• 42.8 - 43.6 LOR S3
  
• 40 - 40.40 HLS
  

Based on the FPS data alone I would think that:

• HLS and LOR should be very responsive.
  
• xLights would be jerky
  

What I actually think that is happening "Compared to if this were a LOR protocol controller is":

xLights - Is outputting data at 16fps and the output may be missing some commands

LOR - Is outputting a "high" rate of DMX packets, but some are probably 0 instead of good data

HLS - Somehow converted the LOR sequence and optimized the sequence to output a "near" LOR experience

I don't think it's a matter of FPS, or I think S3 in DMX would look almost the same as running LOR controllers using the LOR protocol.

I do hope that LOR can find a way to optimize DMX channels the same as they have done with LOR channels. To do this however I think will require sending out "good" data at the rate it is currently sending out data.

Like many. I have no plans to move away from S3. I only use these other tools for testing and hopefully helping LOR make their product and my experience better.

Honestly, that is all way above me. Which is better? xlights? I have no clue how any of the protocols work. guess I wil have to google sCANviewer also, yikes!

[thebaronn]

Unfortunately after all the work I did this year to get "good" but not "great" results, I'm tired. I do have a better understanding of what is possible with the LOR protocol and DMX and know that DMX will never fade, shimmer or twinkle as nice as LOR, but I know it can be close and we are not there yet.

I don't understand when you say DMX doesn't fade as as well as LOR. My RGB light seem to do those well. Do you have video? Maybe I have seen the same thing but I don't notice it. I did read that DMX doesn't "fade" s to speak, but it is just a quick series of intensity shifts. But if the effect generation is quick enough (in LSP I had mine set to 30ms, I have no idea about LOR) it should be the same, correct? I don't know. Next round of testing in 1 month!

[friskybri]

Any update on the S4 that will be able to handle 100k channels.   

[friskybri]

any update on s4

[jeffl]

That would be a game changer.

[friskybri]

For next year, we do plan to increase the number of channels we can efficiently handle. The goal is to be able to edit 100K channels with reasonable response times. To me 5 seconds is a long time and is way long to wait for things to happen.

Dan

Here we go. I was having issues with quoting in IE.  Had to use firefox to get this to work.