Configure Network and S6 for Your Pixel Store Matrix 50,000 foot level questions

[stevehoyt]

@k6ccc and others

I have spent some more time reading LOR info and various other posts in the forum. In addition @MattBrown mentioned in another post, that LOR will be releasing documentation some time in the future to do what I am considering setting up. Until that is available, I am posting this to get input on the entire process. Also I am a bit unsure of all the pieces, hardware wise, between my show PC and the Your Pixel Store matrix. It comes with a colorlite controller card and says it is FPP compatible. I have not decided on the size of the matrix yet but and tending toward their 6 by 4 panel prebuilt on a stand for 24 panels total. I may add one more row of panels but need to talk to them about this. 

My current configuration consists of a high end win 11 computer, I do the sequencing on, and a lower end PC i use for the show. They are both on my home high speed mesh network. I have an additional router that I am not using and a gigabyte switch.

Step 1. Take the show computer off the home network 192.168.0.xxx and create a new network e.g 192.168.1.xxx using the extra router and the switch. 

Step2. All existing LOR networks remain the same. I have 1 LOR regular, and  4 LOR Enhanced. Then add a new E.1.31 network using the control panel,  in unicast mode, with an IP address that will be for the new matrix and the correct number of universes. 

Step 3. Run gigabit ethernet cable approximately 100 feet to the new matrix.

Step 4. Adjust the props accordingly to reflect that they are now on the e1.31 network and their current universes. TBD somehow when setting up the matrix via a connection to it and some config software. 

Step 5. This is the part I am still unsure of. Do I need a Rasberrt Pi in the matrix? Hard to buy now I believe. Is the gigabyte ethernet connection to the colorlite card all I need. Or do I need something like a Pi or BBB running FPP.

Last question. I know that you can't comment on the particular matrix I am considering buying. But my fear is I go to all this work getting it running and on the roof only to have a P5 panel fail and it look like XXX. Our weather is not bad here in Northern CA, 40 at the lowest but we do have rain and winds. Say a panel goes bad, am I out of luck or can they be repaired easily.

Thanks for any comments to get me started on this path. 

Steve

 

[k6ccc]

4 hours ago, stevehoyt said:

Step 1. Take the show computer off the home network 192.168.0.xxx and create a new network e.g 192.168.1.xxx using the extra router and the switch. 

That's the way I do it.  I have a dedicated "show" E1.31 network - happens to be192.168.131.0/24 (makes it easy for me to remember).  Both my file server (which runs the show during the off-season), and the show computer (runs the show from mid October till early January) have LAN connections on the E1.31 network and also my "primary" home LAN - which happens to be 192.168.201.0/24.  It is not required to do so, but I do.  Everything on both of those LANs is wired - my Wifi is a separate LAN.  I will point out that my home network is FAR more complex than the vast majority of home networks.

4 hours ago, stevehoyt said:

Step2. All existing LOR networks remain the same. I have 1 LOR regular, and  4 LOR Enhanced. Then add a new E.1.31 network using the control panel,  in unicast mode, with an IP address that will be for the new matrix and the correct number of universes. 

Correct.  In my case, for off season, all the E1.31 is going to the same controller, but for Christmas, there are six 1.31 controllers in use - so six different IP targets for the different universes:

192.168.131.81  Universes 101 - 136  FPP instance for P10 matrix (gonna change to 72 universes next year)

192.168.131.82  Universes 201 - 272  FPP instance for P5 matrix

192.168.131.91  Universes 11 - 39  Falcon F16v3 for pixel tree

192.168.131.92  Universes 41 - 44  Falcon F16v3 for eves and roofline

192.168.131.93  Universes 46 - 47 & 51 - 53  Falcon F9v3 for ground level stuff in yard

192.168.131.99  Universes 1 - 7  Falcon F4v3 for Planter, walkway, roses, & arches

4 hours ago, stevehoyt said:

Step 3. Run gigabit ethernet cable approximately 100 feet to the new matrix.

Does not need to be Gig.  Almost all the E1.31 controllers run 10/100 Mb/s  The exception is if you have a huge number of universes being fed via a single cable, (think either really large matrix or a bunch of E1.31 props in the yard plugged into a switch in the yard), then gig might be needed.

4 hours ago, stevehoyt said:

Step 4. Adjust the props accordingly to reflect that they are now on the e1.31 network and their current universes. TBD somehow when setting up the matrix via a connection to it and some config software. 

Correct.  Assuming the matrix is built as a single prop in the Preview, changing it from LOR network to E1.31 will take just a few seconds.  Then add the IP (or IPs) for the universes in Network Preferences.

4 hours ago, stevehoyt said:

Step 5. This is the part I am still unsure of. Do I need a Rasberrt Pi in the matrix? Hard to buy now I believe. Is the gigabyte ethernet connection to the colorlite card all I need. Or do I need something like a Pi or BBB running FPP.

Currently yes.  Right now, the only way to drive the P5 / P10 matrix panels is via Falcon Player (FPP).  The FPP instance will run in bridge mode and as far as LOR is concerned, it wll just appear to be a large E1.31 controller.  From the hardware end, that requires one of three options:

A Raspberry Pi with a Pi-Hat that connects to the panels

A BeagleBone with a Cape that connects to the panels

A Raspberry Pi driving a ColorLight card which connects to the panels.

I have used all three of those methods.  Currently I am using a PocketBeagle with a PocketScroller on each of my matrix panels.  For large panels, the RasPi and ColorLight is the best.

If you are using a ColorLight card, the connection from the RasPi to the ColorLight MUST be Gigabit.  Generally you will have a second Ethernet connection on the RasPi to your E1.31 network.  For people running xLights and locally storing the sequences on the FPP instance, some people run WiFi as the connection from the the E1.31 network to the RasPi.  However, in our situation, I HIGHLY recommend against using WiFi.  Generally what we do is use the built in Ethernet for the E1.31 network and a USB adapter for the connection to the ColorLight.  Strongly recommended to use this adapter:  https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00FFJ0RKE/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o07_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

4 hours ago, stevehoyt said:

Last question. I know that you can't comment on the particular matrix I am considering buying. But my fear is I go to all this work getting it running and on the roof only to have a P5 panel fail and it look like XXX. Our weather is not bad here in Northern CA, 40 at the lowest but we do have rain and winds. Say a panel goes bad, am I out of luck or can they be repaired easily.

You likely can't repair a panel, but they are usually easy to swap out.  Buy spares along with the original purchase.  Just like pixels, panels from different batches may not look exactly the same color.

 

[stevehoyt]

@k6ccc

Thank you very much Jim for the info. Thats exactly what I needed. I am going to contact the "your pixel store folks" tomorrow and see what they think is the best option size wise and pedestal wise for me. Since the panel comes with the colorlight controller it looks like the Raspberry Pi is my preferred option. I assume they will spec out which one I need and that it is available.

I assume that if I had to swap a panel. or even if the original panels  look different that there is some color correction software that comes with them to address these issues.

I really appreciate your help

[k6ccc]

Pi3 or Pi4 is fine.  You will need at least an 8GB uSD card for it, but I recommend a little bigger.  I have 32GB cards in my PocketBeagles, but since in our case we're not storing sequences on the FPP instance, it does not need much (mine are using 12% of that).

I don't remember if the ColorLight config software has any ability to correct colors on a panel by panel basis.

 

[stevehoyt]

@k6ccc

Hi again.

My pixel matrix fron "your pixel store " got delivered. There are still some pieces that need to arrive the Pi etc.

I have a gigabit usb ethernet connection, so I tried to connect to it. I was successful however the display is not displaying correctly.

I have changed a couple settings panel size etc. that looked wrong but it still is a mess of colors though I can see it is getting closer.

I have played with intelligent setup too but can't get it right.

I suspect I need the proper RCVBP file. I have contacted them but thought I would ask here anyway. 

Does anyone have a display from them and have this file or any other ideas to get it set up right.

Thanks

[k6ccc]

If I remember right, you are going to use a RasPi and ColorLight..  VERY IMPORTANT.  Get the display looking correct on the ColorLight test pattern before worrying about anything else.  If that's not right, nothing earlier in the chain will fix it.  Once the ColorLight test pattern is right, then get FPP set up and make sure the test pattern from there works right.  Again, if that is not right, nothing earlier in the chain can fix it.

I can't help you on the ColorLight setup.  The one year I ran ColorLights, it was black magic to me and I only got it working with help in the Falcon Zoom Room.

FPP, I can help you with.

 

[stevehoyt]

@k6ccc

I got the colorlight running… whew you are right took a bit of black magic but all in all looks to be very powerful and reasonably priced for what it does.

Tomorrow I am going to try to setup the raspberry pi and fpp.  Wish me luck and I may have some questions as I have never used a raspberry pi or fpp before. 
 

I am optomist.
 

anyway to my question of the day 
 

the display panel and color light controller will be on my roof connected by a cat 6 outdoor Ethernet cable about 100 feet long connected to my lor compter in my garage. I prefer access to everything and had originally planned on the raspberry pi being in the display on the roof.  
 

I am wondering if I could keep the raspberry pi in the garage and just connect it to the color light card or should I keep them together on the roof 

thanks

steve

[k6ccc]

1 hour ago, stevehoyt said:

I am wondering if I could keep the raspberry pi in the garage and just connect it to the color light card or should I keep them together on the roof 

Off hand, putting the Pi in the garage should work OK.

 

[stevehoyt]

@k6ccc

Good Morning and thanks for any input you may have. I seem to have hit a roadblock and was wondering if you had any suggestions.

I have configured my color light card and all appears to be working as it should. 

I have installed FPP 7.3. It appears to see packets from my router OK. Though I have not tried anything with LOR yet, as I can't get the color test to work. I have defined my matrix and panels in, I believe, the same way as they are configured in the color light. and it shows the right number of {Pixels...49152., 147456 channels}, connectors, set via auto layout.....

I have FPP plugged into my router ( not connected to the internet) on eth0 and the FPP address is the static address defined in my router. The matrix connected to eth1 with a USB Giga ethernet adapter..  If I run a test ( from the setup panel tab ) I see data being sent out on eth1  to the matrix, but the screen is black. Thinking perhaps the panel was defined wrong I randomly tried other sizes and refresh rates. A couple gave me a straight green line on the screen, so I believe FPP is talking to the panel. I must have something else set wrong, but for the life of me I can't figure out what. 

I did watch a video that appeared to imply, I need to set up something under the e1.31/artnet/ddp/....OUTPUT turning on DDP. I have no clue if I need to or how to set that part up. I am getting the message when I look there, that says something to the effect "universe outputs active but primary channel output is disabled.

Do you have any idea why just the simple test would not work. 

Under the e1.31/artnet//... INPUT side I have 384 universes all defined to multicast and enabled. I know this is wrong and at least I need to change them all to unicast . That wii be quite the task. I saw another of your posts about being able to define them all in  one line, but would I have to go and disable all the other 383 of the entries.

 

[k6ccc]

16 minutes ago, stevehoyt said:

I did watch a video that appeared to imply, I need to set up something under the e1.31/artnet/ddp/....OUTPUT turning on DDP.

No.  The only output will be the panel tab.

17 minutes ago, stevehoyt said:

Under the e1.31/artnet//... INPUT side I have 384 universes all defined to multicast and enabled. I know this is wrong and at least I need to change them all to unicast . That wii be quite the task. I saw another of your posts about being able to define them all in  one line, but would I have to go and disable all the other 383 of the entries.

Yes, delete the extra lines and rebuild as a single line.  Much easier to deal with.

More later, but busy at work...

 

[stevehoyt]

@k6ccc

I thought you might be interested in the resolution on this.

After 5 days of troubleshooting.... multiple raspberry pi installs of FPP V6 and V7, and trying everything else you could imagine, finally getting to the point of being ready to throw it all in the trash, I found the issue.

It was the firmware in the color light card.

I had to back it down to V11.04. It was at V 13.39. Now everything runs like a champ. 

The display has a hard time keeping up with some effects, but all in all pretty cool.

Just need to move the beast onto my roof this week now. 

 

 

[k6ccc]

Glad you got it.  I only used the ColorLight cards one year and pretty much hated having to deal with them.  My two matricies are small enough that the ColorLights were not needed.  Using a PocketBeagle on each one now and they work fine.

1 hour ago, stevehoyt said:

The display has a hard time keeping up with some effects, but all in all pretty cool.

I believe that!

 

[MRLV]

50,000 foot question???? It looks like I may have to go back to college to refresh my Electrical Engineering and Network knowledge to set up a light display.  Please tell me you are doing this for the White House, Capitol Building and the Pentagon, not your individual residences.  It sounds extremely complicated.

[k6ccc]

What's wrong with have 66K channels at home?

 

[Orville]

10 hours ago, MRLV said:

50,000 foot question???? It looks like I may have to go back to college to refresh my Electrical Engineering and Network knowledge to set up a light display.  Please tell me you are doing this for the White House, Capitol Building and the Pentagon, not your individual residences.  It sounds extremely complicated.

Nope, not really as complicated as you might think. 

Challenging at times? YES! 

Frustrating at times? ABSOLUTELY!

Complicated at times?  Depends on each user and their preferences.  Possibly Yes, Possibly No. Sometimes, Maybe.

But you really don't need an engineering or networking degree, although I wouldn't say it wouldn't hurt to have one.😉

[TheDucks]

17 hours ago, MRLV said:

50,000 foot question???? It looks like I may have to go back to college to refresh my Electrical Engineering and Network knowledge to set up a light display.  Please tell me you are doing this for the White House, Capitol Building and the Pentagon, not your individual residences.  It sounds extremely complicated.

There are 2 parts to a light display: 1) the hardware and 2)the artistic sequences.

The first part is simple. Ohms law (mostly voltage drop), current calculations' Basic RT(suppliers)FM 😛 for design limits and proper settings.

EXPERIENCE tells you when you can push on those limit numbers without damage or show fails. 

Basic electric assembly skills (mount in cabinets, attach wires, build cords as needed) and tools are helpful if you don't go the Ready To Go route .

I find the second part: Sequencing a smart RGB show (artistically) the hard part.

[MRLV]

Thanks!! You have been very helpful addressing the complexity issue.

So the news are that the bullet was bitten (hardware and software were purchased).

I am working on the physical installation and the tree requires a topper to tie the 32 light ribbons/strips and a star.  Does anyone know if the Holiday Coro topper (thinking about using their QT3 - QuickTree™ Pixel MegaTree Topper V3 (10 to 64 Strings) is compatible with the LOR 16 feet tree light strips? If not, any recommendations? 

It seems that doubling the height of the LOR 16 feet tree is a possibility regarding the modification of the sequences, the adding of pixels (waiting on confirmation from LOR).  The issue would be if the extending of pixels from 4" to 6" apart and dimming them would preclude having to address the issue of power injection.  I think we would need to do this since I am considering this for the 2024 Holiday season.  I have a 35 feet structure (ham radio tower) that can be used to lift the tree with a manual winch without the need of a central metal pipe support and guy wires. Your thoughts?