Lor With Multiple HolidayCoro 3 Channel DMX Controllers

[strungUP]

Hello everyone! I am very new to the Madness and I like to move ahead slow when I get myself into a new hobby. I purchased the sample kit from HolidayCoro and have been playing with the lights and honing my soldering skills. I managed to hook up the programming cable and get it working in Xlights. I found that I can use this programming dongle to hook up the lights in LOR. I want to use LOR so I will be purchasing the program and 1 AC Controller. I want to add 6 RGB elements also (for now!). I understand I need the full version of LOR for DMX. My plan is to build a rough model of my yard on my desk and sequence using this setup. My questions are,

1. I want to add 6 of those 3 channel dmx controllers and eventually use them inside display items. Can I use my ONE programming cable, give each controller a different start address and daisy chain ALL 6 of the controllers and have it ALL controlled in LOR as 6 DMX channels along with the 16 channels from the AC Controller?

2 If I can, what would be the best way? CAT5 splitters?

I hope I am thinking in the right direction! Thanks

[Ken Benedict]

Looks like you will have TWO networks; one for LOR stuff and one for DMX stuff.

The LOR network will have an LOR USB485 unit that plugs into your computers usb port and connects to your 16 channel AC controller using Cat5 network cable.

The DMX network will need a usb-DMX unit that plugs into a different usb port on your computer then on it's way to the Holidaycoro controllers; to the first one, then the second one then the final one. Most people use Cat5 network cable here also, only because it's cheap.

Just remember to NOT connect them together.

From Holidaycoro, you should get one of their controller programmer things so you can change their DMX addresses.

In the LOR software, everything can be easily put together without you having to worry about which network your lights are on.

People have had good luck with this LOR adapter to connect to your computer: http://store.lightorama.com/uscoad.html

I'd recommend this "dongle" from Holidaycoro: http://www.holidaycoro.com/Enttec-Pro-Compatible-DMX-Dongle-p/53.htm

And their programmer (to change DMX addresses): http://www.holidaycoro.com/product-p/54-2.htm

There's also lots of online videos on the LOR website, Youtube and Holidaycoro.com to help you get things going.

It's usually best to search yourself for what you're looking for first, then if you can't find the answer, get back onto this LOR forum.

You're in for a little bit of work, and a LOT of fun when you start creating your own personal lighting show that you design.

[MCas4380]

Ken What about E1.31 as a solution I'm still reading on it But i believe he could run his DMX universe from his nic card straight to his DMX devices. also if you really want only one cable to your display you could run your LOR controlers in DMX on this network as well but that maybe opening a can of worms for no reason.

[strungUP]

Thanks Ken for your help. Let me clarify a couple things,

I understand that the LOR controller and DMX need separate networks. At the moment, all I have is the programming Dongle that you linked to and some dumb lights, power supply and 1 3 channel controller. I was just wondering how many 3 channel DMX controllers could I use with just the programming Dongle. I have since found out that people really don't recommend using the programming dongle to control lights due to many issues but in theory it should work, right? I did not find any video's with people daisy chaining these little controllers but the video on the rainbow floods made me think its possible and your answer confirms this. The enttec compatible dongle from HolidayCoro you linked to isn't available right now. When I order my LOR stuff should I just get a second rs485 adapter because I will need it with whichever DMX converter I get? Does the DMX converter you linked to do the timing itself like the enttec pro? If so, that is a much better deal than 180 bucks and would be worth waiting for. (I am not trying to run everything off one cable. I understand that DMX will be separate from the AC channels and will be using its own wiring.)

mcas4380, I was looking at E1.31 stuff, and I am not afraid of opening up cans of worms but for now I just want 16 channels of AC control and 6 RGB Floods and to emulate this on my desk with a mock up of my front yard. Until I can afford everything I need I'm just trying to get the most out of what I have. Thanks guys!

Edited January 20, 2013 by strungUP

[scubado]

You don't need to build a model of your yard on your desk. The software has a visualizer that you create to simulate your yard.

You mentioned you want to have 6 3channel controllers, thats 18 channels out of 512 available in one universe.

I use a Fusion Pro DMX adaptor from Holiday Technologies. Works identical to Enttec Pro only cheaper.

I have 13 DMX controllers tied together at one point and works flawless for me. The distance is very short from the adaptor.

[strungUP]

I know I don't have to build a model of my yard but being a sheet metal fabricator, I know I could make a cool test and sequence setup on my bench. I'm sure you guys do testing using your lights right?

That Fusion Pro DMX sounds great and I like cheaper. I am going to check that out. Sounds like the rs485 adapter gives people trouble in DMX mode so I will spend the money where I need it most and it sounds like this isn't the place to skimp too much. Thanks guys.

Well if I'm going to have a full universe anyway...........................lost in thought

[Shubb]

My first year I set my entire display up in my back yard and ran sequences for testing. The second year I just used the Animation, and set up about a week early so I could test the sequences. After 7 years and months in front of the sequencer I can see it all in my mind. Sometimes in my sleep.

You will get used to what it will look like pretty quick.

Scott

[k6ccc]

Remember that the AC controller can be controlled by DMX so you could run it all on a single DMX network if you want to save a couple bucks.

For what you are doing, I would not worry about E1.31 It would just add a layer of complexity for you that is not needed. I did use E1.31 for this past Christmas, but I also had 1,803 DMX channels (601 RGB pixels) in use.

[strungUP]

k6ccc, I welcome all saving money ideas! I guess I missed that information somewhere. Before I bombard you with questions on that I am going to do my homework on running everything in DMX. Thanks for the info, the light bulb over my head is lit again! 4 Days until I put in my LOR order, Starter AC 16 channel package + full version software package + Enttec usb open OR a Fusion Pro DMX box. I assume this order would be the same if I ran it all in DMX mode correct? Where would I save the few bucks?

I would love to do pixels and I might still but I am trying to not get too far ahead of myself and to not over think things which I have a tendency to do. I think I'm going to like this hobby, always different ways to get something done. Thanks for your reply's. -Steve

[Ken Benedict]

The Fusion DMX Adapter is a great device ($125); I have one that I'm very happy with. Also have a DMXKing unit ($50) that's more compact, and an Enttec Pro unit ($150) that's pretty much the standard in the USB-DMX world. The Enttec Open unit is cheaper, but relies on your computer to send the DMX packets out; some people have reported sluggish performance with them. Maybe they have slow computers. Hopefully you have a fast enough one that you can dedicate to running your show.

Although the LOR controller will run on DMX, you might lose the ability to Twinkle and Shimmer, which is only available on the LOR type of network.

As far as pixels, I'd suggest you wait and drool over other people's shows and read a bit; it can get overwhelming quickly and there's some new pixel-related products coming out in the March timeframe, according to several sources. Supposed to be cheaper and better and easier. Like the DMX-Pixel controller from Holidaycoro.com, stuff from J1sys and maybe from Sandevices and of course there's rumored to be some new products from Light-o-Rama too.

From Dan Baldwin, April 3, 2012: "...the release of E1.31 hardware (4 port DMX gateway and Cosmic Color Matrix (CCM) a multi-port pixel controller)."

So get yourself settled down with your new setup, try the programming part and have fun with this new hobby.

[Shubb]

Steve,

Jim (k6ccc) is one of the LOR users that will be at my BBQ. Very well knowledged when it comes to computers and networking.

If you do ask him some questions, have a voice recorder or a note pad handy!!!

Scott

[strungUP]

Ah, yet another option, the DMXKing, and the price is right. I did read about issues regarding using the Enttec open which was why I was leaning toward a "smarter" dongle. On the other hand, my computer is fast and my channel count low, for now, which would mean I probably would be fine. (Sounds like I've done this before huh?)

I like the twinkle and shimmer effects and would hate to lose them. I was planning on running my icans on the AC 16 channel LOR controller and using those effects. Would the effects still be available just different? Would the differences be horrible with icans or would a newbie like me even notice? I found a great pdf on running LOR in DMX mode and I think I understand. If I need to, I have no problems with running separate networks to keep the LOR effects.

Can't wait to see what they come out with in march! By then I should have my floods built and a LOR controller blinking something.....

[daveo150]

I haven't seen this mentioned yet, but keep in mind if you're going with the usb485 dongle for your dmx universe, you're going to need an adapter to correct the dmx signal to the right cat5 pins. you can make one, or seasonal entertainment sells one.

[k6ccc]

Steve,

Jim (k6ccc) is one of the LOR users that will be at my BBQ. Very well knowledged when it comes to computers and networking.

If you do ask him some questions, have a voice recorder or a note pad handy!!!

Scott

Gee thanks Scott. You might give me a swelled head! And I considered you to be the E1.31 expert...

Yes, I plan on being at the BBQ and by then I will have E1.31 in daily operation. It worked very well for me for Christmas. I do want to get the E1.31 onto it's own LAN before I put it into daily operation so I should be able to talk about that if needed.

[Ken Benedict]

As I understand it, there are no shimmer or twinkle effects when running native DMX like you plan to.

There are limited versions of the twinkle and shimmer in the LOR iDMX1000 unit, and then it's only for the first 128 channels or so.

Also, I would discourage the use of the LOR USB485 as a DMX driver because the addressing is not accurate; it's off by +1.

It works GREAT driving an LOR network, though.

Last year, the LOR folks hinted about an upcoming DMX adapter that runs off the LOR network and is cheaper than the iDMX1000.

There are some wonderfully experienced people here on the forum that have gotten E1.31 running with the E682 pixel controller from Sandevices, like K6CCC, Shubb, and others.

I have a friend (Shaggyss) that got it working on his display after a couple of weeks of working out the addressing details.

Here is everything I used to do my strips

Controller - http://www.sandevice...m/E681info.html

Strips - http://www.aliexpres..._568458133.html

Main Power Supply - http://store.creativ...PS-12V-360W.htm

Injector Power Supply - http://store.creativ...-PS-12V-45W.htm

Enclosure - http://store.creativ...ure-CG-1500.htm

Waterproof Connectors - http://www.aliexpres..._601833823.html

Cable - http://www.amazon.co...words=18/4 wire

[strungUP]

Was out testing my hybrid coro flood I made with the sample kit I purchased. I was just playing with the one flood in different positions and some idiot turned left in front of a on coming driver and ........honk....screech and they missed by about 3 feet! I wonder how many accidents are caused by home lighting displays? Anyway,

I guess I will keep the native LOR network for my icans due to the effect issue. I am aware of the crossover cable needed between native DMX and LOR DMX networks but I appreciate this and ALL reminders. I have been reading about the DMXKing and am leaning that way, at least for right now, due to the nice price and that it does its own timing.

Wow, with 2 experts in E1.31 fighting over the other one being better, how could I pretend to call myself a blinky head one day if I didn't attend this BBQ? Since I can't seem to stop researching this hobby, (my one track mind is fully engaged!) and the fact I will have a full universe anyway, I came across those DIY Coro Candy Canes that are controlled by 8 pixels each. I was thinking if I had 4 of those x 8 pixels x 3 channels for a total of 96 channels + my 6 Corofloods x 3 channels = 114 channels and it all would fit into my one universe, correct? So much for staying with the basics first! That didn't last long!

K6ccc, you mentioned daily operation, are you using these setups for landscape lighting?

[k6ccc]

When the landscaping project is completed I will have quite a bit for my every day landscaping. See my signature below. I added the 600 RGB pixel tree and star for Christmas.

I do need to update the signature a little bit as a couple things have changed a little.

Edited January 22, 2013 by k6ccc

[strungUP]

I guess I just skip over the signature area. They need to flash and change colors......

[bob_moody]

Technically, there are shimmer and twinkle effects when running LOR in pure DMX mode.. the caveat is that LOR's twinke and shimmer are offloaded to the controllers.

The issue is that the software has to generate the shimmer and twinkle effect which does put more load on your PC or show machine.

I cant say that 10 controllers would work perfect, or 100 or 500... but in my limited testing.. I cant really see the difference.. I'm not saying it isnt there, but if you have a strong machine ....

Your milage will vary of course..

I went with the 2 network solution.. LOR and a J1Sys D2 DMX bridge .. just ordered a P2 pixel controller to add for 2013..

Bob

[strungUP]

Well, it amazing how things change. I just picked up a renard ss24 kit and it will work in DMX mode with LOR. That will control my 16 channels of AC icans plus 8 extra channels. The floods have the built in controllers which I forgot about in an earlier post. I'll see if I can use 8 channels in a couple coro-canes somehow. This should all fit in one universe if I am thinking correctly. I'm still leaning toward the dmxking, Just waiting to find out exactly what the renard needs to connect.

Its nice to know there will be some version of shimmer and sparkle as I did like them. However I won't miss what I never had!

I left my flood outside and it started raining. It's waterproof but I couldn't leave it out there. Its my very first blinky flashy thing.