LEDs per meter strips

[beeiilll]

I am looking at using my CMB16D controller and getting some "dumb" RGB strips to use around my windows and doors on the house so that I can get a straighter look rather than the 4 seperate color strings of Leds that I use now.

I came across some info on eBay for these and wanted to ask if anyone sees any reason to use the 60 LEDs/M strips:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/320772498429?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

verus using the "standard" 30 Leds/M strips:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/220888921557?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

I would think that the 60 Leds/M would give a better density look to the strip although it does require slightly more power and costs more. Seesm that it would make the window look more evenly lite as well?

Anyone using the higher density strip that can give me any info on them?
Thanks

[Donny M. Carter]

Bill, I have not used the high density strips, but I bet them dudes are BRIGHT!! I'm also thinking of running some "dumb" strips and plan on just using the 150 led version because they are plenty bright!

Donny

[Ken Benedict]

Technology is constantly changing; the RGB strips started out as 30 LEDs per meter, then 60 and now 144 per meter for those of you who want blindingly bright displays.

I use the 60/meter and am very happy with the look. Uses 3 amps per strip, fully on.

These are the 5050 type of chips, not the smaller and less powerful 3528 chips.

[beeiilll]

Yes it is a constantly changing scene with this stuff so that is why we have to ask I guess.

Thanks guys.

Ken, do you feel that the 60/meter gives you a "fuller" look to the line of these? I just thought that they would look better being a higher density than the 30 as well as being able to cut the strip into shorter sections will allow them to fit to existing window sizes a little easier?

Besides, aren't our displays supposed to be seen from space - LOL?

And there is always the intensity control if things get too way bright out there right?

I mean yes 60 versus 30 per meter is going to be brighter without a doubt but does everybody except me run the lights at full on all the time? I tend to use intensity settings more and more to get less brillance and better overall look from things.
I find that my display actually looks a lot better with things toned down a bit rather than tryng to see how fast I can get the electric meter to spin.

Or am I being too concerned about this and should just use the 30 per meter strips instead?

Since I have seen neither one I have no reference to go by in this case and that is why I am asking.

[David Rise]

I'm curious as to how bright the 30 and 60 are compared to LEDs. I wouldn't want one prop to be brighter than the others

[WilliamS]

How hard is it to fade a dumb strip is my question. Sure the 60 or 144 would be brighter but would I have the ability to tone it down. I know some have trouble with fading curves. Would this be the example of where 1 will either win or fail. If you cant drop them to match the rest will they just overpower the display?

As for seeing from space, why not make that a goal?

[edvas69]

One thing that people should be aware is how bright the 60 LEDs per metre is, it is very bright and will definetly outshine anything else in your display. I use the 30 LED/M and find that to be more than enough and it looks fantatstic. So more may not be better.

fading dumb strip should give you 8 bits of dimming which is 256 steps per colour

[Ken Benedict]

The 60 leds/meter. dimmed down, gives a look like a rope light.

If you need the brightness for a musical punch, then yes, all three channels full, then dim two of the channels on a 1 second fade down, leaving the remaining color to ramp down a short while later.

Good effect.


Later on, LOR G3 controllers will have custom LED dimming curves, which should match incandescents.

[beeiilll]

Okay so I am beginning to think that maybe some of this is starting to sink in.
Or else my brain is too befuddled and some of the other stuff is leaking out. Hmmmm

See this is why I had to ask about these since I have no experience with either 30 or 60 per meter strips (or any strips yet for that matter) and I hate to spend money on things I can't use.

Thanks FastEddy (slow Bill here) on pointing out the 256 steps of dimming.
See this new stuff takes some time to take hold and for all to understand that these strips and pixels are not like dealing with incandescent bulbs or even the LED bulbs that we use now as far as controlling, dimming, driving, whatever.

I was fixated on using "more LEDs per meter" so that it would look like there were more bulbs per meter than on the important issues such as brightness and controlling them.
Also is the issue of more power demand from the 60/M strips as well and the capability of a CMB16D as to how many it can run.

I was somewhat also thinking that how bright can this one strip be compared to the 4 seperate LED strings I am using now but that also is a deceptive issue that I can't really put them side by side to compare.
If I were to try and run the 60/M strip dimmed down to make it have a similar brightness to my LED strings, there will be other problems to consider.

I suppose the only real way to look at this problem will be to buy a strip of each and connect them up next to each other with some regular LED strings on the floor or wall and see how they look side by side and how well they operate with the LOR software.

Ah, the marriage of older software/hardware and the newer hardware can be a rocky road to travel me thinks! Argggggh!

[GaryMartin]

I've received a number of PMs asking about these so I thought I'd just put this out in a public post. Here are some very good options from Ray Wu on non digital strips, 12 volt. These are epoxy coated for their weatherproofing. I prefer that over the silicone tubing as the tubing can get condensation inside if it develops a hole.

The 30 LEDs per meter are about $20 and the 60 LEDs per meter are about $40

30/meter: http://www.aliexpress.com/fm-store/701799/209843764-288949036/5m-flexible-LED-Strip-5050-SMD-30LEDs-m-waterproof-by-epoxy-coating-RGB-color-DC12V-input.html

60/meter: http://www.aliexpress.com/fm-store/701799/209843764-288945652/Flexible-LED-Strip-5050-SMD-60LEDs-m-waterproof-by-epoxy-coating-RGB-color-DC12V-input-with.html

Hook those up to your DC controllers and go to town!

[beeiilll]

Thanks Gary

You don't happen to know what the power consumption on the 30/M is do you?
I see on the site that it looks like the specs for both listings are the same (the specs for the 60/M), which is listed as 14.4W per meter.
I guess just take it as a guess and say that the 30/M is around 7W per meter would be a best guess on those?

I am curious as to the type of epoxy coating these would use? Epoxy is not noted for its flexiblity so what they would be using is a mystery.
Also how easy is it to get the epoxy off the connection areas if you cut the strip for different lenghts to make good connections?

Just wondering if you have personally seen or dealt with these strips?

Again thanks for the links though.
Bill

[flogger7]

I have a variety of 30/m and 60/m dumb strips and will respond to a variety of questions from the thread. These are all 12v, from a few different sources.

The 60's are super bright, and from a distance looks different than normal fixtures because of the density. They are closer together than any of my rope light led's. Its noticable as 'something different' around a window, but I like the look.

The 30's are plenty bright. Their spacing is similar to rope light and looks like perfectly straightened rope light strips when you make frames or otherwise outline a window with them.

The 60's i have run at 72w for a full 5M when run at full intensity white. Have not had any issues driving them with the cheap $7 boxed dmx controller.

The 30's run at half that - 36w for a 5M roll at full white.

My opinion is that it really ends up just being a question of the look you are going for. Try them out and see!

[GaryMartin]

Bill, you have the power consumption right.

I have NOT had one of these in my hands yet. Everything I have are the silicone tube, aka CCR style. I'm not a fan of weatherproofing this way as I like to cut things up and add splices so they fit around corners nicely. I have some of this epoxy model on the way and can answer those other questions in a week or so.

beeiilll wrote:

Thanks Gary

You don't happen to know what the power consumption on the 30/M is do you?
I see on the site that it looks like the specs for both listings are the same (the specs for the 60/M), which is listed as 14.4W per meter.
I guess just take it as a guess and say that the 30/M is around 7W per meter would be a best guess on those?

I am curious as to the type of epoxy coating these would use? Epoxy is not noted for its flexiblity so what they would be using is a mystery.
Also how easy is it to get the epoxy off the connection areas if you cut the strip for different lenghts to make good connections?

Just wondering if you have personally seen or dealt with these strips?

Again thanks for the links though.
Bill

[beeiilll]

Thanks Gary

I will be very interested to hear what you think about the coating after you have had a chance to look them over for a bit.

Also if you come across any accessories for this stuff like connectors to do 90 degree corners or splicing, that too would be nice to know.
I am not worried about them since I figure that I can just use some 14 awg solid copper romex wire to make the jumpers for corners and then coat it with epoxy, caulk, or potting compound to make a seal for it.
But it is always helpful to have links or sources for this stuff if someone who is not handy wants to get into it as well.

[GaryMartin]

Bill I don't think you could get 14g solid copper to attach to a strip. The solder tabs on these things are very *small* You would need a 20 or 22 gauge stranded to make corner connections. The whole strip is only a 1/2" wide and there's four connections there to make. If I'm making something that will never flex, I just chop up Cat5 and use the strands from it to make jumpers. Windows, I'd use a 22g stranded most likely.

beeiilll wrote:

Thanks Gary

I will be very interested to hear what you think about the coating after you have had a chance to look them over for a bit.

Also if you come across any accessories for this stuff like connectors to do 90 degree corners or splicing, that too would be nice to know.
I am not worried about them since I figure that I can just use some 14 awg solid copper romex wire to make the jumpers for corners and then coat it with epoxy, caulk, or potting compound to make a seal for it.
But it is always helpful to have links or sources for this stuff if someone who is not handy wants to get into it as well.

[beeiilll]

Well I guess I won't need my Mig welder for this then - LOL

I was not even thinking of the size of this stuff.


But luckily I do have a couple of 1000 foot boxes of Cat 5 cable here that I can use for it !!
Looks like this stuff will be more finesse and less brute force work.

[Ken Benedict]

There are 90 degree corners, T corners and 4-way cconnectors for the standard 4-pin strips, but that assumes you are using the factory end connectors.

See http://www.superbrightleds.com/cgi-bin/store/commerce.cgi?action=DispProds&product=BARS&utm_source=googlebase&utm_medium=base&utm_content=NFLS-4CPTH&utm_campaign=GoogleBaseChild#NFLS-4CPTH


Custom lengths mean cutting (at the cut marks), scraping the flexible epoxy away, soldering small flexible wires and using hot glue or silicone to pretty things back up. This takes patience, since the four solder pads are very small.

Every so often, someone on Ebay will offer a cheap strip that you can get to play with; I've gotten 1 meter strips for $4 and 5 meter strips for $15 in the past. These are all 60 leds/meter.

I've set up a test rig with a power supply and LOR DC controller and shown it to other LOR users in my area that had the same questions. Too bad we're not closer. I also brought a spare CCR that they can plug into their computer and play with. A few hours of fun, for sure.

[bdeditch]

Ken Benedict wrote:

There are 90 degree corners, T corners and 4-way cconnectors for the standard 4-pin strips, but that assumes you are using the factory end connectors.

See http://www.superbrightleds.com/cgi-bin/store/commerce.cgi?action=DispProds&product=BARS&utm_source=googlebase&utm_medium=base&utm_content=NFLS-4CPTH&utm_campaign=GoogleBaseChild#NFLS-4CPTH


Custom lengths mean cutting (at the cut marks), scraping the flexible epoxy away, soldering small flexible wires and using hot glue or silicone to pretty things back up. This takes patience, since the four solder pads are very small.

Every so often, someone on Ebay will offer a cheap strip that you can get to play with; I've gotten 1 meter strips for $4 and 5 meter strips for $15 in the past. These are all 60 leds/meter.

I've set up a test rig with a power supply and LOR DC controller and shown it to other LOR users in my area that had the same questions. Too bad we're not closer. I also brought a spare CCR that they can plug into their computer and play with. A few hours of fun, for sure.

Those are the best prices I seen on Connectors yet.

[beeiilll]

Well I guess the only way I am going to really get to see what this stuff will do and how it works is to go ahead and buy a strip or two and play with it.

So for those of you who have been researching and have played with some of this stuff already, I am thinking that I will pick up a reel or 2 of this:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/220888921557?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

and play with it.
Is there anything else that I should get to help with playing with it?
I do have a CMB16D and several 12VDC supplies already so I am set there.

The only thing I thought might be helpful to play with would be:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/220871222768?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

a remote to make it easier to run some testing on the strips rather than have to use LOR with them?

Does that sound like a reasonable idea to get me started with this stuff?

[flogger7]

I Have 2 strips from that seller and they are decent. The solder joints aren't great and they probably need additional weather proofing to be out in the real rain but they are inexpensive and good for starter strips to play with this stuff.

I also have two of the Ir remote kits and they are a quick way to get the strip fired up, but aren't really useful after the first 5 minutes unless you are going to use them for a permanent cove lighting installation or something like that. They are limited in color choice, and (at least the cheap chines ones i have) don't do any useful dimming