USB Extender and USB Hub experience

[heystew]

I am hoping that I can use a USB extender with a USB hub at the end to extend my LOR PC's USB connections. I'm planning to use the new raw DMX capability and don't want to have to run every DMX line all the way back to the PC.

See the below picture for what i want to do. If it works well I may add my traditional LOR controllers to it as well.

Does anyone have any experience with this and how well it does or does not work?


thanks,
dave


Attached files

[jeffl]

I use a cat5/USB extender with my BetaBrite sign but it's at the max range of 150'. I'm not sure how stable using it would be for this much activity. I'm curious what others think.

[heystew]

well.. judging by the relative silence, i guess i'm going to buy some hardware and do some testing. I'll report back what i find.
if anyone has any other experience.. please do reply.

thanks,
dave

[gizmomkr]

Dave -

I use a lot of cat 5 USB extenders at work.
2 noteworthy items :

Most of the cheap extenders don't play nice with hubs.
cheap extenders only run at 1.1 speed

So make sure you get one that's rated 2.0 and has built in hub
http://www.l-com.com/familylist.aspx?id=405 lcom makes good stuff

It's going to run yu close to 300.00

Cheaper to put the pc outside.

There is another device that uses software on the pc to sort of emulate the device. The hub then connects via ethernet to the pc. I have used one with a scanner, and it worked fine, but I never tried with lor, and not sure what the bus speed is.

[heystew]

Update on this experiment:
I purchased the ICR2104 extender http://www.l-com.com/item.aspx?id=10618
from L-Com and have done an initial test.

I only have 1 USB-485B connected to it, but i'm running a full DMX universe over it and it seems to be doing well. I have a 200' cat5 cable in-line with it.

So far i'm happy but the real test will be when I load it with 5-6 universes.

[Max-Paul]

Just remember, and unless I am mistaken. Each LOR network is limited in speed. Much below what a USB 1.1 is capable of. So, with your 5 networks off of the hub are going to be seriously starving for data.

[heystew]

First test went fairly well. Running 5 universes on a Cat 5 USB extender, and all seemed to go well. Will report back with exact config and results after I put some more time on the setup as well as add the other 7 universes.

dave

[heystew]

Finally a bit of time to breathe.. so here's a bit more info on how the setup went. All in all, i'm very happy with how it is working. Just realized I had posted this at PC, but not here on LOR.. also finally have a video done of a portion of the show at:
http://www.rockyrunchristmas.com/2011video.html
We definitely didn't use the RGB to it's potential.. probably the most taxing on the LOR network was at the end of the last song (Christmas Medley) in the video and it held up very nicely.

Setup information:

PC USB port 1 - LOR USB adapter for Regular Network - controllers 1-30
PC USB port 2 - LOR USB adapter for Aux A - controllers 31-40
PC USB port 3 - LOR USB adapter for Aux B - controllers 41-49
PC USB port 4 - USB 2.0 Cat5 extender to 7 port powered usb hub - Universes 1-6
PC USB port 5 - USB 2.0 Cat5 extender to 7 port powered usb hub - Universes 7-12

I have the Cat5 extenders running out into the middle of the yard, where i have a NEMA enclosure (pictured below) which houses the USB CAT5 extender receiver, 6 Enttec Pro adapters, and a small UPS. I'm using an Icron USB extender. one thing i learned was to slowly and methodically plug the adapters in one at a time. Letting the pc discover and install the drivers for each one, before i went on to the next. (write down the ID of each one as you install it.. you'll thank yourself later)

(The UPS is there because I was afraid of what would happen if a slight power glitch reset all the enttec's and they had to be re-discovered in the middle of a show)




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[jeffl]

I need to take a few more opportunities to scan over everything that you have in those enclosures but WOW.

Masterful engineering. Those are a thing of beauty!

[WilliamS]

jeffl wrote:

I need to take a few more opportunities to scan over everything that you have in those enclosures but WOW.

Masterful engineering. Those are a thing of beauty!

Beauty nothing, those monsters look expensive. Hope you have them under a rock with a truck on top, booby trapped to blow up!

[jeffl]

Some people have expensive motorcycles, boats and cars. In this case, its a beautiful Christmas display that many get to enjoy instead of just one.

Great investment. I enjoyed the show.

And by the way. You must have missed the light sabers. They will defend against thieves.

[heystew]

Thanks guys.. we're fortunate to have had no issues with the equipment in the yard. The only vandalism I remember is when we had a deer chew through a power cord.. fortunately the GFCI tripped rather than waking up to find Bambi lying among the mini trees..

[Jack Stevens]

It looks like a good temporary solution, until LOR releases their E.131 enabled software. Based on what I think you're trying to do and what I've seen of those, you are a perfect candidate for it.

[heystew]

yes.. i am anxiously awaiting their E1.31 implementation. that said i've invested a fair amount in this so I will maintain this. .but expansion would hopefully be via E1.31.

[travis p]

jack any idea when lor will release e.131

[jeffl]

I think RJ's Etherdongle would basically do this and people were using it with xLights already this season. Let's hope LOR can catch up with the DIY community this year, maybe even improve on it.

[WilliamS]

The more I look into E.131 the more lost I become. It would seem more hardware is required to create the larger networks. This would to me in terms of practice be similar to what you have already accomplished.

The more I look at those boxes the more impressed I am. Every single time I see this thread pop back up I just admire those boxes man.

Am I close that you have almost 7000 channels avaialble to you with all the adapter and controllers you have?

[Jack Stevens]

Mike -

The rumors are that LOR has their implementation in alpha or beta test. I have no idea of the release date.

Goofyguy -

Short answer to your question about 7000 channels - yes.

Not me; I'm still dealing with individual strings of lights, other than some RBG floodlights.

But when you get into strings of nodes, of which I believe the CCR is a representative of, and use 3 channels per pixel, and 50 pixels on the string, channel counts ramp up quite quickly.

A "simple" megatree made up of 8 strings of 50 pixel strips, would be 3 colors X 50 pixels X 8 strings, or 1200 channels. I think that would look a bit sparse, but that's 3 DMX universes there, with a maximum of 512 channels per universe.

Doing the megatree seen on http://www.lightorama.com/CosmicColorRibbon.html with DMX pixel strings - 12 strings of 50 pixels each, would be 1800 channels. Adds up fast.

[heystew]

yes it works out to almost 7000 channels available. I have started using Tracks and Groups out of necessity.

One of the Enttec Pro's is a spare universe should i need it. Started out with a spare in each box, but then I used one of the spares for the pixels in the light sabers. Each light saber is 42 pixels so I am only using 1/2 of that universe.

Have not spent too much time on E1.31 yet, but from what i have seen.. if you have a device that can send E1.31 (S3 Show computer soon we hope) you can then connect any E1.31 controller to the Ethernet network. Basically those boxes would disappear for me as the DMX Pixel controller I have for each universe would be switched to a controller that could accept E1.31. Should be a simpler architecture.. but we shall see... plus i don't plan to get rid of these.. .will expand with E1.31 though.

Going to need to adopt some new color coding for wires as we'll soon have Ethernet lines running around our yards in addition to DMX and LOR network cables.

[WilliamS]

Jack Stevens wrote:

Mike -

The rumors are that LOR has their implementation in alpha or beta test. I have no idea of the release date.

Goofyguy -

Short answer to your question about 7000 channels - yes.

Not me; I'm still dealing with individual strings of lights, other than some RBG floodlights.

But when you get into strings of nodes, of which I believe the CCR is a representative of, and use 3 channels per pixel, and 50 pixels on the string, channel counts ramp up quite quickly.

A "simple" megatree made up of 8 strings of 50 pixel strips, would be 3 colors X 50 pixels X 8 strings, or 1200 channels. I think that would look a bit sparse, but that's 3 DMX universes there, with a maximum of 512 channels per universe.

Doing the megatree seen on http://www.lightorama.com/CosmicColorRibbon.html with DMX pixel strings - 12 strings of 50 pixels each, would be 1800 channels. Adds up fast.

Im dabbling in the 2801 strips now as well. Im ordering a few next month. Right now Im not spending a dime just so I have time to cool off and not buy out of excitment. 7000 channels do add up quick when your doing those 12 ccr trees and such. Still impressive setup.