shfr26 Posted October 2, 2009 Share Posted October 2, 2009 I have two 16 channel CTB16PC controllers and am planning on two more for next year. My electrician said he could put in one 70 amp double throw and that would be fine. I do not know if this is good or not. My conntrollers are rated at 30 amps. Any thoughts or suggestions?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Simmons Posted October 2, 2009 Share Posted October 2, 2009 Where do you see your needs being in a couple of years? Will you be using incandescents or LED's? The controllers are rated to handle 30 amps max, but if you're going to be using LED's you'll probably never reach that total. Having 70 amps at your disposal is a lot of power for most yards. What you need to do is figure out how many sets of lights you'll be controlling and then go from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shfr26 Posted October 2, 2009 Author Share Posted October 2, 2009 I am planning on about 8,000 lights per conntroller and now have two but want four. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Simmons Posted October 2, 2009 Share Posted October 2, 2009 Having an idea of what you want to do is the first step. Now just do the math and see how much power those lights will consume. I think you'll be okay with the 70 amps your electrician was proposing - at least for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shfr26 Posted October 2, 2009 Author Share Posted October 2, 2009 Thanks, but I know how LOR goes, it's 32 this 64 next and who knows where after that!!!! I'm hoping that the double throw 70 whick is supped to be 140 will be ok:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shfr26 Posted October 2, 2009 Author Share Posted October 2, 2009 Sorry, got fat fingers. 32 this year, 64 next and also 70 amp double throw is suppose to 140 amps. I hope Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-klb- Posted October 2, 2009 Share Posted October 2, 2009 Generally, a double pole, 220V breaker will wire to a sub panel with 4 conductors. 2 hot leads, a neutral, and a ground. When broken out into separate circuits on the sub panel, it provides 2 sets 120V power, and you can take up to the rated load off of both sets of 120V at the same time. If either set exceeds the rated load, it will trip, no matter how lightly loaded the other side is. So if you get the loads balanced, you will be able to draw 140A of 120V power, but you will be responsible for balancing the load between the two sides. Generally on most panels, alternating rows of breakers will be on the opposite poles. So the top row connects to one side, the second row the opposite side, and the third row back on the first side... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBullard Posted October 2, 2009 Share Posted October 2, 2009 In my display, I use 20 controllers (320 channels) from three 15 amp circuits, (and still have current capacity to spare)I chose to buy LED lights rather then pay the electicians (nothing against electricians, but I was getting quotes in the $ 4 to $5,000 range for a serious power upgrade) I use approx 35,000 FWR sealed LEDs (most from CDI) and spent approx $4k on them.George mentioned LEDs as an option in the second post, and this is what works for me, with my display. Just something else to consider while you are planning for the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 7, 2009 Share Posted October 7, 2009 I already have 2 outdoor plugs in my front yard, but they're on a 20A circuit breaker. I just got my LOR 64 and want to know the best way to hook it up, electrically. Can I just swap out the 20A breaker for a larger one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cray Augsburg Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 NO, July!The circuit breaker is designed to limit the current draw on the circuit it is on. Its size (20 Amp, etc) is dictated by the maximum current allowable through the circuit it protects. If you were to use, say, a 30 amp breaker in place of a 20 amp breaker, you would be allowing the circuit (the house wiring to the plug) to pull more current than it can safely handle. This could lead to overheating and a fire.The answer is to run suitable extension cords (current versus size/length) to power the controllers, or have someone (who knows how) add new circuits.Are the two plugs out front on the same breaker (i.e., do both plugs go OFF when you switch the breaker to OFF)? In simple terms, if they do, you should not plug both plugs from one of your controllers into each of those plugs. Depending on what you are controlling with your controller, each of its power cords should be plugged into outlets on separate circuits in your house's wiring. If you try to draw more current than the circuits can handle, you'll be throwing breakers.Cray Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max-Paul Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 July,Cray did a fair job of explaining to you the problem. What I feel that Cray missed telling you is that wire can be bought that is different size dia. The larger the wire the more current it can handle. 12 gage wire is only rated up to 20 Amps, no more. If you where to put a 30 Amp breaker on that 12 gage wire. Then load it up so that the wire pulled lets say 25 Amps. Two things will happen. First more than likely the voltage will drop down. Now if you have a motor on that circuit, it will try to pull more amps (another topic but trust me on this). This will cause the motor to get very hot and may catch on fire. The 2nd thing that will happen is that the wire from the breaker will become very hot also. And a good chance that it can catch on fire or something in contact with the wire will catch on fire (romax running through the wooden frame of your house).This is the reason you can not just put a larger breaker on a wire that is not of the right gage.BTW 10ga=30A, 12ga=20A 14ga=15A and so on. These numbers are for standard house romax. There are different types of wire with different ratings even though the size of the wire does not change. Thus why I said for standard house romax wiring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shfr26 Posted October 8, 2009 Author Share Posted October 8, 2009 My electrician said that with the 70 amp breaker he can put in 4 double outlets and each one will have its own 15 amp breaker , thus giving me 8 15 anp breakers and 8 outlets to utilize. He said that breaking off something on each breaker will make each one operate on its own breaker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgardner518 Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 What do you all think about my outlets for my new display? I'm new at this and wanted to do it right. I only have two controllers, to start. and with each one able to handle 30 amps, 15 on each side. I can put in 8 more controllers for future use. I have 10 outlet boxes, each with 2 20amp GFI plugs. Each plug is on there own 20 amp breaker making 10 tandem breakers for a total of 20. I personally don't think I'll be making out my wattage/voltage. But What do you think? Attached files Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgardner518 Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 I don't know how to add all the pictures to one upload. Attached files Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rgardner518 Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 This is my last picture. Attached files Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 Sorry guys, I guess I should have been clearer. I didn't mean swap a 15 for a 20 and stop there. I knew the wire also had to be changed. I just didn't know if within the box there had to be a certain amount of Amps or a certain number on each side.Actually what I'd like to do, since I'll only use this twice a year, is run a line from a large breaker to a subpanel in the front yard with more breakers that then lead to the plugs for the LOR. Then at the end of the season, I can disconnect it and put it away until the next year.I actually saw a film company do this once when they were filming at our house. They had a big clamp that they clamped onto our meter somehow which led to a subpanel that they ran lots of stuff off of. It's only about 75' from the box to the front yard. I know that wouldn't be to "code" but I'm sure a lot of the extension cord mazes aren't either! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmoore60 Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 Yankee,The two breakers at the top of your panel that you have labeled phase A and phase B protection. Are those suppose to be like main breakers? If so they are both attached to the same Buss. What is their purpose suppose to be?Also looking at the panel each of the tandem breakers you have at the bottom labeled Christmas Box 1, etc....each breaker is tied to the same buss not 2 individual busses. If both handles of that breaker go to the same outlet box. You have the potential to overload your neutral. Unless you upsized you neutral. Assuming that the breakers are 15A breakers. you have the potential for 15 amps on each hot wire going out to your outlet box. You also then have the potential to have 30 amps on the neutral. Your neutral would need to be a minimum of 10ga wire, where as your power feeds from the breaker could be a minimum of 14ga wire. I site minimum because I have no way of me knowing distance from the panel to the outlets and with length there is the line loss issue that has to be accounted for if it is a long distance.Chuck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Simmons Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 Max-Paul wrote: July,...(romax running through the wooden frame of your house)....not of the right gage.Call me anal, or whatever else makes you feel good, but mis-spellings of common, simple words make me crazy - especially from someone giving "expert" advice. I was sixteen when I worked for an electrician in the '60's, but back then we spelled romex with an "e". When did it change to romax? And when did guage change to gage? Last time I looked, there was a spell-checker provided here. Perhaps LOR needs to develop a tutorial on its use... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 8, 2009 Share Posted October 8, 2009 George Simmons wrote: Max-Paul wrote: July,...(romax running through the wooden frame of your house)....not of the right gage.Call me anal, or whatever else makes you feel good, but mis-spellings of common, simple words make me crazy - especially from someone giving "expert" advice. I was sixteen when I worked for an electrician in the '60's, but back then we spelled romex with an "e". When did it change to romax? And when did guage change to gage? Last time I looked, there was a spell-checker provided here. Perhaps LOR needs to develop a tutorial on its use...Aw, come on George. Yes, to me that's anal but it's also petty. This is a forum for a wonderful product and I don't think it's a good idea to ever make someone feel bad. I know sometimes I get so excited about certain things that I type way too fast and make errors I normally wouldn't, and then click send before I've checked. The words you cited above...I think are clearly readable even if spelled incorrectly.Have a little compassion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shfr26 Posted October 8, 2009 Author Share Posted October 8, 2009 Are some of you saying that for each 30 amp controller I should use two 20 amp breakers and also use GFIC plugs?? Just asking cause I want to do it right the first time. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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