New to DMX questions...

[buratti]

Over the past year or so, I've heard of how LOR now uses DMX and can connect to it and what not, but I had absolutely no clue what DMX was until last night. I gave myself a crash course on DMX by watching YouTube videos and reading some posts here, and think I understand at least the bare basics of it, which brought up some questions and ideas that hopefully someone can tell me if would work or even exists...

First of all can someone just correct me if I am wrong on my assumptions of the workings of DMX? I gathered from my little research that DMX is the standard in stage and disco/night club lighting. They are usually controlled by a board that looks similar to a sound board with various sliders and buttons. One board can control up to 512 or something "channels" by daisy chaining fixtures (and each fixture can be fairly expensive) together with 5 prong wires (but separate power sources for each fixture). I also assume that the iDMX from LOR is basically a converter that connects a standard LOR 16 channel board to a DMX network of expensive fixtures, all being controlled from LOR sequence editor instead of the physical board stated above. Correct me if I am wrong on anything just stated.

One question is... for the people that use DMX in their xmas displays, are they actually using dozens (or even hundreds) of those expensive fixtures and even placing them outdoors, or are they somehow connecting all of their standard mini and C9 lights to the DMX network?

The second part of that question brought up an idea that may or may not work or is already what people are doing. Is there some kind of "power strip" of electrical outlets that connects to a DMX network and can just control power on, power off, and fades (similar to what the regular 16 channel LOR controllers do)? If I remember correctly one web site I was viewing last night called this a dimmer pack, which tells me that something like this does exist, but this one was only 4 channels. Are there any other models that are like 16 channels (electrical outlets) or more?

Now I know the obvious response would be "why convert to DMX just to essentially have the same amount of hardware and controls as standard 16 channel LOR controllers"? Well technically yes, it's the same exact thing, but I'm thinking cost here. If a 16 channel DMX "power strip" like described above really does exist, I can’t see the cost of each to be more than $200, if even that. So I figured... iDMX - $250, and can control up to 512 channels, lets say 8 "power strips" - $1600, giving me a total of 128 standard "LOR" channels for a total cost of $1850 (plus 384 additional channels still open). If I were to just purchase 128 channels of LOR controllers it would cost $2600. OK, maybe it’s not THAT much of a savings, but that is based on the $200 cost of "mythical" power strip.

Anyway, regardless of the total cost, basically to sum up, does such an object exist, and what kind of devices or fixtures do most people use when have DMX in their Christmas network?

[Steven]

I haven't (yet) used DMX myself, but from reading things on this board and elsewhere, I can answer some of your questions:

buratti wrote:

I also assume that the iDMX from LOR is basically a converter that connects a standard LOR 16 channel board to a DMX network of expensive fixtures, all being controlled from LOR sequence editor instead of the physical board stated above. Correct me if I am wrong on anything just stated.

A LOR 16 channel board is not part of the LOR-DMX connection. The iDMX plugs into a LOR network, which usually, but not always, also has 16 channel controllers. Other than that, you are correct.

One question is... for the people that use DMX in their xmas displays, are they actually using dozens (or even hundreds) of those expensive fixtures and even placing them outdoors, or are they somehow connecting all of their standard mini and C9 lights to the DMX network?

Usually neither. Most people that have posted here are using a few (or just 1) DMX fixture, often a panning, gobo light, or a DMX floodlight, such as this: http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=202973290&listingid=42050915. They use LOR controllers for the rest of their lights.

Is there some kind of "power strip" of electrical outlets that connects to a DMX network and can just control power on, power off, and fades (similar to what the regular 16 channel LOR controllers do)?

Yes, there are. Here's an example: http://www.buy.com/prod/chauvet-lighting-dmx-4-4-channel-dmx-dimmer-relay-pack/q/loc/111/203971309.html

This is a 4-channel dimmer that costs $111.99. That's the least expensive price I could find. 4 of these would be $477.96 for 16 channels, compared to $205.95 for a complete CTB16PC. This DMX dimmer can handle more current than the LOR controller, but it can't be used outdoors, and it doesn't do shimmer. (Does the iDMX do twinkle?)

[Denny]

Here is a link that basically explains the use of LOR controllers as DMX dimmer packs.

http://www.lightorama.com/Documents/DMX-DOC.pdf The LOR controller can become a sixteen channel dimmer pack. You can use the LOR sequencer to include DMX in your automated sequences. To control them manually, you would need to use the hardware utility which would be somewhat cumbersome for me. Some DMX fixtures such as the moving yolks are "intelligent." Other DMX fixtures are "dumb?" That is, like some flood lights, etc. You can use DMX to control snow machines, fog machines, lasers, etc. To do this with LOR, you need the iDMX 1000.

Edit to add: Most of the DMX fixtures stilll use the 3 wire rather than 5 wire cable. You can buy adapters to go from one to the other.

[-klb-]

So far, I am only using LED light bars. Three of them on the house, and 15 on the city show. It works very well for lighting up white areas with any color you choose. So far, and as far as I see, the vast majority of these two shows will remain conventional Christmas lights on LOR controllers.

[buratti]

wow thanks for the quick replies.

Usually neither. Most people that have posted here are using a few (or just 1) DMX fixture, often a panning, gobo light, or a DMX floodlight, such as this: http://www.buy.com/retail/product.asp?sku=202973290&listingid=42050915. They use LOR controllers for the rest of their lights.

So, people actually spend $220 on a fixture plus the $250 for the iDMX to control that ONE light in their show that most likely wont even stand out that much if they already have 100+ channels. With absolutely no offence to them though, but it seems a little of a waste doesn't it?

As for the power strip, I found a similar unit (for a little bit more $$), but was just wondering if anyone made a larger maybe 16+ channel unit, but I guess not. It may be a good idea to design one, for any LOR designers reading this (hint hint) No? But maybe not, I really have no clue what I'm talking about because I'm so new with DMX, and have no equipment yet either. I am just trying to learn about it and see if I could use DMX or will have interest in it in future shows. I currently only have 32 channels and on my 4th year, but believe me, if I could afford it, I would be up to 128 by now with comparable shows to all you pros out there.

Basically I can sum up my last novel of a post into: "I'm trying to add a butt load of channels to my show with only spending a few hundred", and I'm realizing that may not be possible. Oh well, I'll just keep adding to the new controller fund jar, and maybe someday I'll catch up!

[zman]

Buratti,

You may have stumbled across my DMX Primer on my website. I have spent the last 3 years looking into DMX and incorporating a fair amount last year and will grow the DMX universe very little in terms of added fixtures in the display in 2009. I will use 18 floods, 3 zap strobes, and 2 yokes. I have a snow machine that is nice to play with cause I got it at a screaming deal. It might make the display in 2010. My main impetus was DMX Floods. I am moving to LED where possible for economy reasons. LED Floods are so-so in performance (IMHO) and expensive in cost. DMX floods opened up doors for me there, and added a huge wow factor. Next I wanted a Yoke light and zap strobes. The strobes do not have to be DMX, but I get the performance out of a DMX strobe that I am looking for.

DMX can be a cheaper means of leveraging mass channels, however you have to realize how that is broken out and controlled.

If you start DMX that is different than if you grow into DMX. I grew into it, because I had LOR, wanted to use different types of fixtures. If you want bang for buck, DIY is the way to go. In a pure DIY sense, I feel that the stuff that is out there now, even coupled with an LOR PC DIY kit (as Denny and Steve mentioned) gives you the lowest cost per channel out there. If I was starting today, knowing what I know now, I would go this route. LOR is a wonderful company and I will continue to support them, but LOR and AL are very much like DMX in the sense that you get wrapped into a protocol that drives an interface/harware. For LOR purposes, DMX is just an extension into something different. The advantage DMX has, is that it is an accepted standard on a global basis. DMX is going to allow a lot of things to come. Video (large displays), different lighting options etc... But you have to decide what you want to say with your display. If you want a rock concert, You can do that. If you want ambience, moving spot lights, with color washes in 16million colors, you got that too. You have more "things" available to you in the DMX world.

Some are more comfortable with the "full meal deal". They get one stop shopping at LOR. I was not savvy with hardware and how this can interface with that. I admire guys that can do that. I am getting better at that, but I needed the comfort in the beginning that LOR gave.

OK I was not intending a philisophical reply. It's late, hope that helped a bit.