Another Singing Tree Question

[AllAmericanJock]

I currently don't own any singing tree's yet. If I was only able to buy one tree, would it work until I could get the other one's. Also do they have to be purchased in a certain order? I wish I could buy all at once, but that's not possible. 

 

Thank you 

[75redman]

You can have one or you can have as many as you want.

Are you looking at rgb or the string light version?

[AllAmericanJock]

I'm not sure, what's the difference in the two? 

[TheDucks]

The LOR singing trees come with (Pixie2) controllers. I don't know if there are any of the older (V1, fewer mouth movements ) left.

AFAIK, you just need to keep the controllers for a tree (name) with the tree type (just avoids setting changes).

Edited June 12, 2023 by TheDucks

[AllAmericanJock]

I assume they plug into the main lights controllers too? 

[Jimehc]

each tree controller will have it own AC cord (plug) - the only connection between the other controllers is Network Cable (Daisy Chained)

Edited June 12, 2023 by Jimehc

[TheDucks]

23 minutes ago, AllAmericanJock said:

I assume they plug into the main lights controllers too? 

Pixies are High speed-enhanced network LOR network devices (formerly Red dongle). Depending on age/model, AC controllers may not be compatible with Enhanced network mode and will need to be on a separate LOR network.  Your Showtime license is good for any way you go.

@Jock Your questions are confusing me as to what you have. could you list what controllers you have and what adapters (or directors) so we can give you good recs the first time.

[AllAmericanJock]

ShowTime Central with N4-G4-Mp3 + FM Transmitter

PRO software license

USB Adapter/filtered cable

50ft Cat5

TSO Signature Series SD Card with 44 minutes of sequences/music

Plus additional controllers. At this time led lights. 

[Jimehc]

So currently you are GOOD to add Pixel Trees along with your existing controllers - Daisy Chain the Network Cable - and set Network Speed at 500K Enhanced..

Facebook is a good place for shared sequences and welcome to the Modern World...

Edited June 12, 2023 by Jimehc

[AllAmericanJock]

Do you have any FB sequence recommendations? 

[k6ccc]

3 hours ago, AllAmericanJock said:

I'm not sure, what's the difference in the two? 

This question about RGB vs string lights largely did not get answered, so here goes.  In string lights singing faces, there will be a bunch of strings of traditional mini light strings that form the various facial features (outline, eyes, various mouth positions, nose, eyebrows, etc).  Not all singing faces include all those features.  Because they are using traditional light strings, a fixture that is wired for example with green lights, is only going to be green.  Also, each entire string is doing the same thing, but different strings will normally be doing different things.  One of the more common pre-made string light trees are from Holiday Coro ( https://www.holidaycoro.com/Singing-Christmas-Trees-p/100.htm ).  These use eight strings of lights (outline, eyes open and closed, and five mouth positions).

In contrast, pixel based singing trees are using RBG pixels instead of traditional strings.  They CAN be either dumb RGB strings, but are far more commonly smart RGB pixels.  Being RGB, they can be made any color at any time (either an entire string for dumb RGB or each pixel for smart RGB.  The LOR singing trees are using smart RGB pixels, but there is a "special" mode in the controller that allows faking it to behave like dumb RGB (so you are not having to sequence hundreds of channels).

As with most things in this hobby, there are advantages and disadvantages to traditional string vs pixel based singing faces.  Obviously the pixels have the advantage that you can use different colors at different times (for example, a face may have green eyes in one song, and blue eyes in another).  In my opinion, the biggest advantage to traditional string type singing faces is that the lights are quite a bit smaller, and therefore normally much closer together.  This makes lines look smoother.  For example, on the Holiday Coro traditional singing trees, the outline of the tree has 200 light, where as on the LOR pixel based trees, the total for all features on each tree is about 200 pixels.  In my opinion, the closer light spacing looks far better - particularly if the faces are not a really long way from the viewers.  In my case, I have two of the Holiday Coro singing faces and they are about 55 feet from the absolutely closest viewers (and more like 100 feet for the best viewing location).  I have seen many examples of both pixel and traditional string based singing faces, and much the string based faces.

 

[TheDucks]

Great. you have up to 3 more networks for use.

I will assume that those LED  are AC (wall plugs) type

FWIW Dumb or Smart RGB are also LED of 12V or 5V DC

In addition to the tree(s), all you need is CAT5 from them back to the controller (N4-G4) (Up to 4 tree controllers should work on that chain)

[TheDucks]

In addition to Jims comment.

Smart (LOR) trees use just 2 Ports. as it uses 2 strings of 100 nodes INDIVIDUALLY addressable, so all the Mouth shapes may be on a single Pixie port..

BTW Pixies have built in LOR Tree Macros, so you can treat them more like the AC except you get to set COLOR (Mouth O red)

Dumb AC use 8 ports (1/2 a AC controller) 1 port for each face feature

[Box on Rails]

One thing that needs to be addressed here is choice and ease of use. There are many Singing (Tree) props from a number of different Prop venders to choose from. Last year I had 8 singing props in my show. 2 Gilbert Engineering small singing Christmas trees, 1 GE large singing spooking tree, 4 singing Ornaments from boscoyostudio.com and one Large singing Christmas Tree from Holiday Coro. All are Pixel props. I do all my own programing which gives me total control over all the pixels individually. If you are very new to LOR then going with the LOR singing trees might be the best choice but there is a limitation to the effects that can be used account of the controller's macro settings. let me explain. The macros simulate dumb RGB strings for each prop member, This means that each potion of the prop will only light all the pixels in the color selected. This to me completely eliminates the ability to use motion effects on any portion of the singing tree. In my display I will use the outline string in the prop with Motion effects when there is no singing. With the LOR Macro set up, you can only light up the outline string in one color. These macros limit the capability of the Pixie controller and the Smart RGB strings it controls. But with that said the ease of use of the LOR trees might be what you want to use being new to this hobby. Now, if you do use the LOR singing trees you will be captive to only sequences from LOR or LOR authorized sequencers. If you buy only one LOR Tree to start and you purchase LOR sequences, all 4 singing Trees are included in the sequence so in the future when you add another Tree it should be as easy as plug and play. That might be what you need to get started. Good luck and have fun with it. 

Kenny Jure

[k6ccc]

1 hour ago, Box on Rails said:

If you are very new to LOR then going with the LOR singing trees might be the best choice but there is a limitation to the effects that can be used account of the controller's macro settings. let me explain. The macros simulate dumb RGB strings for each prop member, This means that each potion of the prop will only light all the pixels in the color selected. This to me completely eliminates the ability to use motion effects on any portion of the singing tree. In my display I will use the outline string in the prop with Motion effects when there is no singing. With the LOR Macro set up, you can only light up the outline string in one color. These macros limit the capability of the Pixie controller and the Smart RGB strings it controls.

 

Unless I am mistaken, you can turn off that feature so it becomes normal smart pixel strings.

 

[Box on Rails]

54 minutes ago, k6ccc said:

 

Unless I am mistaken, you can turn off that feature so it becomes normal smart pixel strings.

 

You can but then your LOR sequence will will not work. The LOR Sequence is designed to only work with the Macro for each singing Tree.  You would have to understand how ME rows work very well to convert the sequence. Literally you would have to create a new prop to assign all the pixels to the proper portion of the tree prop. probably using the Custom Prop design. Then create the Motion effects rows to coincide with the Channels in the Macro. Then copy and paste each channel to the ME row. this will take an advanced understanding of the S6 sequencer. 

[TheDucks]

57 minutes ago, k6ccc said:

 

Unless I am mistaken, you can turn off that feature so it becomes normal smart pixel strings.

 

AFAIK You have to enable that (Macro mode) using HU. See P16 of the Pixie Manual (advanced Pixie Parameters).

Also note: *IF* LOR sold the singing trees, sans-controllers, allowing you to use your Pixie#.

You can only control up to 4 trees as that mode is available on the first 8 ports (trees use 2 ports) See P20 for V1 mouths

@Box on Rails makes a good point  about limits.  Easy, but limited or Harder, full control