Pixie 16 Pixel string extension question.

[Box on Rails]

hello friends. I have already started putting my display up for the Halloween show. I added a new group of props this year. A GE spooky singing tree that has 4 Ornaments hanging from it. These props use 7 ports of a pixie 16 controller. The controller has the most recent firmware.  I have 10 foot extensions on all the pixel strings to reach each prop. I tested this set up last night and a some of the pixels seemed to be struggling to light up. almost like the data was intermittent getting to the pixel. The tree prop has 3 channels of 150 pixels each and it seemed to function correct but it has mostly solid color effects. the other four props are singing ornaments that have 100 pixels each. The outline and eyes of these props seem to work fine but once again they use mostly solid color effects. The issue is  limited to only the mouth movements. These are the fast moving effects all in solid white and all at 100% So before I start messing with the dimming curve or braking out the CCP IIs for testing, I wanted to ask if the 10 foot extensions might be to long for these props?  Any suggestion would be welcomed. 

Kenny

[k6ccc]

5 or 12 volt pixels?

 

[TheDucks]

5V or 12V?  10' should not ever be a problem for 12V.

1st gen or second Gen Pixie  (the 2nd Gen has JP2 & JP4)? If Gen 2, make sure there is only ONE termination (JP4) and it is the last device on the network chain)

High speed networks SHOULD be terminated. Make one if last is not Gen2.

[Box on Rails]

1 hour ago, k6ccc said:

5 or 12 volt pixels?

 

12 volt. These cheapies. 

https://www.amazon.com/Alling-Waterproof-Addressable-12V500pcs-Xconnector/dp/B088W7NQ8R?pd_rd_w=KrSf3&content-id=amzn1.sym.deffa092-2e99-4e9f-b814-0d71c40b24af&pf_rd_p=deffa092-2e99-4e9f-b814-0d71c40b24af&pf_rd_r=DB23KKQR31WX4M2TZ4H1&pd_rd_wg=drAQt&pd_rd_r=fa699c8f-d4a0-4e15-9d91-c566aa34c670&pd_rd_i=B088W7NQ8R&psc=1&ref_=pd_bap_d_rp_1_t

They seem to work fine on other props. 

[TheDucks]

Check the voltage at the far end (the referenced page has the pin out, it is a common one) while running your sequence.

It should not drop below 10.8 (10%, which is why I run my PSU 5% high as there is no such beast as a negative voltage drop :p )

[Box on Rails]

2 hours ago, TheDucks said:

Check the voltage at the far end (the referenced page has the pin out, it is a common one) while running your sequence.

 

I Got everything working correct using 4 CCP2s. I never had a chance to test the voltage but I suspect that is where the problem lies on that Pixie 16.

So here's a little back story. 2 years ago I was given 2 older Pixie 16s. The problem I was having was happening in one of these old ones. These could only be set up for 100 pixels per channel. Last year I ran this same  older Pixie 16 on my Matrix that was a 50 x 32 which had 100 pixels per string with no issue. This year I increased the size of the Matrix to a 50x48 at 150 pixels per port. when I used the HU to change the ports from 100 to 150  it wouldn't allow me to make the change. next I went to update the firmware and I got an error message stating the Pixie could not be updated in the HU. I had to send the 2 older pixie cards to LOR for the firmware upgrade witch I did and have since gotten back and and they now allow up to 170 pixels per port. So the Pixie 16 card is up to date.

In December of last year I was give 2 complete Alpha Pixel controller packages. since these use the E1.31 ( which I don't use). I decided to change out the Alpha cards with Pixie 16 cards. these new units have dual 350w power supplies for 700w total. 

This long story now sets the scene for today.  I took one of the newer Pixie 16 units and changed it out with the older unit and it worked fine. No Issues, even with the 10 foot extensions on the 8 ports I am Using. My guess is the power supply for the older units could handle only the 100 pixels per port but there was not enough power for 150. I was hoping to have my whole show controlled by the 4 pixies and a couple of CCP2s but that will have to wait till next year. As foghorn Leghorn once said "Fortunately I have at least 30 CCP2s in reserve for just such an emergencies." lol

Next I'll get into the older units and fine out what the power supplies are rated at and order new ones if needed. 

Thanks guys

Kenny

[k6ccc]

Kenny,  Please get out of the habit of calling the outputs on a pixel controller as "channels".  They are outputs or ports, but normally have many channels per port.

Calling the outputs of a pixel controller as a "channel" only causes confusion.

 

[TheDucks]

350W is 30Amps

30Amps is a hair under the Bank MAX rating (32A). That is 4A per port CAPABILITY.

Maximum draw is ALL WHITE.  For the power Bus and the PSU to be blamed, you would need to have all those ports White at the same time

AND

have them all strings of 100 (LOR strings are low power) or 50 nodes of higher power (Like HC sells)

If you ain't popin' fuses, then the only other ting is you used small wire from the PSU to the Pixie (IMHO nothing smaller than 12Ga)

[Mr. P]

General rule for 12v pixels 100 per port, anything above that you will probably need to power inject unless they are the lower power LOR pixels. Most other pixels you get from China, Amazon or most other stores are not the lower power pixels. You will normally hit the port 4amp power limits before you run out of power supply juice.

[Box on Rails]

3 hours ago, k6ccc said:

Kenny,  Please get out of the habit of calling the outputs on a pixel controller as "channels".  They are outputs or ports, but normally have many channels per port.

Calling the outputs of a pixel controller as a "channel" only causes confusion.

 

Jim, I know Ports are ports and I forget sometime LOL. Mostly when I'm typing because I can't type. Well a new discovery that I think was the real problem. So I took the controller card off the top of the power supply so I could see the label on it and low and behold it read 5 volts. LOL I think that might of had something to do with it. The guy I got these Pixies from said they were 12 volt. Oh well live and learn. I have 8 CMB24 controllers in storage. I'll check those power supplies. I know they're 12 volts. I'll just have to make sure the watts are sufficient. thanks Jim

 

2 hours ago, Mr. P said:

General rule for 12v pixels 100 per port, anything above that you will probably need to power inject unless they are the lower power LOR pixels. Most other pixels you get from China, Amazon or most other stores are not the lower power pixels. You will normally hit the port 4amp power limits before you run out of power supply juice.

Mr. P. That rule works when the voltage on the pixels match the power supply. LOL. I guessing the reason the Matrix worked last year with the 5 volt power supply at 100 pixels per port with 12 volt pixels is for the reason you mention. They are all 50 pixel LOR strings. other then that I have no Idea why they worked. Thanks 

 

2 hours ago, TheDucks said:

Maximum draw is ALL WHITE.  For the power Bus and the PSU to be blamed, you would need to have all those ports White at the same time

TheDucks, Yes I did that with both pixies and the one that had the right 12v power supply lit everything all white no flickers on any pixels. Thanks

[k6ccc]

2 minutes ago, Box on Rails said:

Well a new discovery that I think was the real problem. So I took the controller card off the top of the power supply so I could see the label on it and low and behold it read 5 volts. LOL I think that might of had something to do with it. The guy I got these Pixies from said they were 12 volt.

Be VERY certain that you know the voltage of the pixels.  Applying 12 volts to 5 volt pixels is a sure fire solution to having an empty E-waste bin - you will have killed pixels to put into the E-Waste bin!

Yes, they pretty much all have labels on each pixel - however sometimes they are an absolute bitch to read!

5 minutes ago, Box on Rails said:

Jim, I know Ports are ports and I forget sometime LOL

I know that YOU do know the difference, but it can be very confusing to new people to the world of pixels.

 

[TheDucks]

Get out you magnalight. Bullets usually write 12V+ at the solder pad (I have no clue what 5V one say. I have none)

OTOH a PSU swap should be straight forward.