New to pixels

[PhilMassey]

Understood, but the thread is about dimming during the show.

[TheDucks]

1 hour ago, Orville said:

If the LOR RGB Controller is selected {Pixie2D or CCB100D, only 2 I have experience with}, and you select ALL ports and any color you want from the color drop down box and turn on the lights, you can move the sliders {Fade Duration set all the way left to 0.1 sec}  in the Start Intensity back and forth {0% to 100% back to 0%}, End Intensity can be set to any % you want the string to end at, I leave it at 100%.  Then you can dim the strings on BOTH ports at the same time.   I've used it to do this to test the intensity {where the starting illumination begins to light up the bulbs to full brightness} of the RGB strands I have.

 

HU has 2 general functions: Testing (running Lights)  and Configuration.

That slider (on the first screen) is for testing. It is only effective during the session.

HU can configure intensity caps on G3 AC controllers. (sorry, my Pixies have been put away so I can't check what their configuration really allows, but V1.05 of the manual does not show intensity caps (but is does mention PixLink))

[Orville]

2 hours ago, PhilMassey said:

Understood, but the thread is about dimming during the show.

I do that with the LOR Singing Trees and CCB100D Controllers too.  In the sequencer I just dim the strand using whatever intensity I want or I fade it up/down to any level of intensity.  Never been an issue with any of the controllers I use.

 

[dibblejr]

2 hours ago, Orville said:

So the S5 HU doesn't have the "Settings" box at the lower right where it shows "Starting Intensity", "End Intensity" and "Fade Duration"?  Like S4 HU does?    Because I can dim my LOR Singing Trees using these options in the S4 HU, as well as any other RGB Controller I have {CCB100D x 12} with no problems.

So did they remove this ability in the S5 HU?  I haven't even looked at that yet.  I just played around with the sequencing aspect of it since my controllers were already set, I just never bothered looking at the HU in S5.

 

You cannot change intensities on a pixie4/8/16 in the HU. You can test there but not make a permanent change.

As far as pixie2's I cant say because I have no reason to test any of my controllers when I build them. I simply know they work and my tests like my tutorial points out , is done within SE.

JR

[dibblejr]

1 hour ago, TheDucks said:

HU has 2 general functions: Testing (running Lights)  and Configuration.

That slider (on the first screen) is for testing. It is only effective during the session.

HU can configure intensity caps on G3 AC controllers. (sorry, my Pixies have been put away so I can't check what their configuration really allows, but V1.05 of the manual does not show intensity caps (but is does mention PixLink))

You are correct, about all above. You can TEST in HU with a pixie controller bur you CANNOT make any permanent change the controller to be set permanently. NO WAY , NO how.

I think this even includes the pixie 2's. I have 8 but seeing how I have no need to test them in HU I have not even looked.

JR

[Orville]

3 minutes ago, dibblejr said:

You are correct, about all above. You can TEST in HU with a pixie controller bur you CANNOT make any permanent change the controller to be set permanently. NO WAY , NO how.

I think this even includes the pixie 2's. I have 8 but seeing how I have no need to test them in HU I have not even looked.

JR

Never said I was making "permanent" changes in the RGB controllers, can't be done.

I only do dimming via the SE, same as you.

[dibblejr]

44 minutes ago, Orville said:

Never said I was making "permanent" changes in the RGB controllers, can't be done.

I only do dimming via the SE, same as you.

I don't use dimming for sequencing. I only use intensity setting to change colors for an entire row(s) at once. S4

S5 its a permanent change that can be made for an entire pixie controller / prop controlled by a pixie controller for every sequence. There is no need to change anything while sequencing. That is one of the many benefits of S5 for us pixie users. I did the same thing with my LOR Octuplets. They are premiant set at 30% as long as I keep the same preview, if I change the preview I will once again have to reset that in Prop Def

JR

[hasslerk]

This year I finally played around with both Pixel Dimming Curves via prop definitions and just dropping the intensities in SE.  I ultimately opted to use the dimming curves since even by choosing the 30%, they still show up in preview as 100% (so I could see them), and it is way simpler to manipulate the prop rather than adjusting all the sequences.  You just have to remember that if you also start overlaying intensity settings in SE that you are starting with an already set output maximum intensity of 30%.  So if you apply a 50% intensity in SE, it will be an effective (approximate) 15% at the pixel (really is based on the shape of your curve).  Also note that pixels really fall off a cliff light output wise in this range so you will want to experiment with your specific setup to get the desired effect you are looking for.

I did all this for the same reasons above; trying to video the show.  I think this is the first year I have gotten somewhat close to videoing the show such that it is not just a blob of light.

FYI: I extrapolated 10, 15, 20, and 25% curves from the LOR curves (matches their variable slopes) and was thinking I would post them out here on the forum, with plots, if anyone is interested.

[James Hill]

You guys lost me. I understand you all are further along than I am and that is why I started this thread in the first place. What is this dimming 'Curve'? My lights are far to bright and thinking I could probably cut them down to at least half! Some pics/videos are washed out (especially my singing light bulbs) and in SE dropped the 'full on' white down to 40% for them and that seems to work....if there isn't much of a difference (for the individual colours - red, blue, green) then I could change the 100% output to 40% without visual difference and that would also cause less work for the 12V power supply, no? Is there a way to set this once then it would be set for every Sequence moving forward?

Keep in mind I jumped from S2 to S5 and wanting to understand while learning the new features at the same time jump into the deep end with a few pixels.

Not sure if it makes a difference...was considering LOR's Pixie 8 for the first crack at pixels.

Thanks everyone. Much appreciative for this forum!

[dibblejr]

1 hour ago, James Hill said:

You guys lost me. I understand you all are further along than I am and that is why I started this thread in the first place. What is this dimming 'Curve'? My lights are far to bright and thinking I could probably cut them down to at least half! Some pics/videos are washed out (especially my singing light bulbs) and in SE dropped the 'full on' white down to 40% for them and that seems to work....if there isn't much of a difference (for the individual colours - red, blue, green) then I could change the 100% output to 40% without visual difference and that would also cause less work for the 12V power supply, no? Is there a way to set this once then it would be set for every Sequence moving forward?

Keep in mind I jumped from S2 to S5 and wanting to understand while learning the new features at the same time jump into the deep end with a few pixels.

Not sure if it makes a difference...was considering LOR's Pixie 8 for the first crack at pixels.

Thanks everyone. Much appreciative for this forum!

 for the pixie controllers you can drop it once and for all in the Prop Def = i would suggest 30%. They are plenty bright. That sets it for the entire controller as long as you keep the same preview. If you change the preview or the prop you will have to re configure but it only a couple of clicks

JR

[k6ccc]

There are several ways to dim a prop.  The first (and least desired) is to re-sequence every song.  Not the ideal way to do it.

The second is in your Preview, for each Prop Definition, there is an option for Dimming Curve.  The default is None.  There is a dropdown where you can select various levels.  What this does is dim that prop by the percentage shown.

The third way to dim a prop is by settings in the controller.  How that is done and the limitation depend on the type of controller.  This is BY FAR the easiest way to change the light levels for a prop.  It is fairly easy to change levels for some special event (for example, you are shooting video and need to dim some prop).

For props controlled by AC controllers, there are options for Gen 3 controllers via the Hardware Utility that allow dimming the channels.

For props controlled by Pixel controllers, MOST (not all) controllers allow setting either the entire controller or individual ports to be dimmed by some percentage.  My screen capture on 5 January shows that for a Falcon controller.  Note the Pixie series controller do not have this option.

 

[TheDucks]

A dimming curve is a file that is used to compensate for non-linear light output at different DiM settings in your sequence.

What folk have been talking about is really establishing a Dimming CAP. When you say ON, it really is a 30%, anything less (is being 'dimmed' by the sequence)

There is a 'typical' dimming curve file (like used by the CTB16) in the documents/Light-o-rama/dimmingcurves folder (It is a simple TEXT file and can be opened with NOTEPAD (do not use a W/P editor)

[k6ccc]

19 minutes ago, TheDucks said:

What folk have been talking about is really establishing a Dimming CAP. When you say ON, it really is a 30%, anything less (is being 'dimmed' by the sequence)

No.  I have never tried a Preview based dimming curve, but dimming in a pixel controller (which I have done) absolutely is a percentage - not a cap.  For example, if you have a dimming percentage of 50%, then sequenced levels of the following would have these results:  Sequence of 100% results in 50% on pixels, Sequence of 60% results in 30% on pixels, Sequence of 30% results in 15% on pixels.  Having simply a hard cap would make no sense at all. 

To make sure we're on the same terminology page, what I read a cap would be as follows (using your 30% level):  Sequence of 100% results in 30% on pixels, Sequence of 60% results in 30% on pixels, Sequence of 30% results in 30% on pixels, Sequence of 15% results in 15% on pixels.  That would be nuts.

A dimming curve on a Gen3 AC controller can be anything that you want it to be since you can edit every single level individually.

 

[James Hill]

Quote

The second is in your Preview, for each Prop Definition, there is an option for Dimming Curve.  The default is None.  There is a dropdown where you can select various levels.  What this does is dim that prop by the percentage shown.

So, what I understand is yes - the LOR Pixie 8 can be dimmed in Prop Def / Preview. The dim %, if I choose 30% drops the output by that amount....so instead of full on 100% (in Sequencer) it really is 70% at the pixel?...would that not mean 50% (Sequencer) be 20% at the pixel?...or would it be 30% drop of the 50%....35%.

Trying to keep my head up. Sorry.

[k6ccc]

13 minutes ago, James Hill said:

So, what I understand is yes - the LOR Pixie 8 can be dimmed in Prop Def / Preview. The dim %, if I choose 30% drops the output by that amount.

No.  On every controller I have tested this on, the percentage is a multiplier.  So if you set it to 30%, then the actual output will be 30% of whatever the sequence calls for.  Therefore, 100% in the sequence becomes 30% on the pixels, 50% becomes 15%.

I assume that the dimming curves in the Prop Definition is the same way.  I have not tested that personally.

 

[dibblejr]

9 hours ago, k6ccc said:

No.  On every controller I have tested this on, the percentage is a multiplier.  So if you set it to 30%, then the actual output will be 30% of whatever the sequence calls for.  Therefore, 100% in the sequence becomes 30% on the pixels, 50% becomes 15%.

I assume that the dimming curves in the Prop Definition is the same way.  I have not tested that personally.

 

I believe you are correct. The light output set for all of my pixie controlled props are at 30% through the prop def. They work the same as the 30% set on my dmx controllers that I set on the controller software. They are also set at 30%

You have to remember though, the OP is talking about a pixie8 and not our more complex controllers. There are only 2 ways to set the intensity, within the sequence or luckily now S5 prop def.

JR

[hasslerk]

Here is my graph of the LOR pixel curves (100, 50, 40 and 30) compared against a straight linear.  As stated above, it is a percentage of the maximum.  So like Jim/k6ccc states above, if you apply a 30% curve in the prop def/preview, then the maximum 100% intensity setting in your sequence will create an actual output at the bulb of 30%, and does not dim it in your preview view.  This is still significantly bright enough for a show, and gets closer to allowing for videoing of your show.  When I played around with the LED intensities, I generally did not see much difference dropping from 100 to 50, and then below that I could start to see the actual dimming, and it really starts to drop quickly below 30.

[prevue12]

8 hours ago, hasslerk said:

Here is my graph of the LOR pixel curves (100, 50, 40 and 30) compared against a straight linear.  As stated above, it is a percentage of the maximum.  So like Jim/k6ccc states above, if you apply a 30% curve in the prop def/preview, then the maximum 100% intensity setting in your sequence will create an actual output at the bulb of 30%, and does not dim it in your preview view.  This is still significantly bright enough for a show, and gets closer to allowing for videoing of your show.  When I played around with the LED intensities, I generally did not see much difference dropping from 100 to 50, and then below that I could start to see the actual dimming, and it really starts to drop quickly below 30.

Units for each axis? To quote an instructor from my past, "Is that 500 pounds force or 500 Green and Purple Unicorns, units matter"  😁

 

[hasslerk]

Good point!  The X-axis is the number of samples in the LOR XML file for the curve (there are 256 samples).  The Y-axis is the 0 to 255 value for the given "X" sample from the LOR XML file.  So looking at the data in the excel file or the LOR XML file you would see that the 30% maximum value is 77, which is basically "Y=ROUND(PixelCurve(X)*.3,0)" in excel-speak.

Edited January 9, 2021 by hasslerk
Mis-typed formula