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Posted

Hi All,

Well, I've been using my time during this whole Covid19 mess to write a new set of utilities for working with S4 sequences that I'm calling the LOR Toolbox.  I've finally finished it and I'm looking for a few people who would be interested in being beta testers before I release it to the general public.

The LOR Toolbox is a set of utilities and advanced editors for S4 files.  The initial release will allow you to:

  • Import Audacity timing files into an existing sequence or create a new sequence based on a channel template file.
  •  Create a new MIDI sequence from an Audacity MIDI File.
  •  Easily and quickly apply a Channel Template file to one or more of your sequences
  •  Export the channel configuration from a sequence file to a Channel Template file 
  •  Create an Excel file from your sequence listing all of the channels, groups, tracks. etc.
  •  Allow you to edit aspects of your sequence including
    •  Channels (add/change/delete)
    •  Groups (add/change/delete/assign/un-assign channels and groups)
    •  Tracks (add/change/delete/assign/un-assign channels and groups)
    •  Timing Grids (add/change/delete)
    •  Sequence Attributes (Name, created date, modified by, audio file, and more....)

Again, this is only for S4 (S5 sequence files are a whole different ballgame).  If you are interested in being a beta tester, please let me know.

Thanks!

Posted (edited)

Sounds interesting.  But my beta testing days are long over.  

One thing to note though, I have no idea why, but in S4.4.4, the version I am using the Midi option is disabled and I have a Pro License, so not sure why it's disabled in this version, all other versions {prior to S4} I could use it, but not this one.  Won't even allow me to load a .MID{i} file into the SE at all.  I could in version 3, but S4 has never allowed me to use Midi Files or the Midi Tool in it.

Just mentioning this because I don't know if I am the only one with this particular issue with the MID file format.   I have to convert them to MP3 format before I can use them.

Edited by Orville
Posted

I would be interested. Trying to learn S5 on a different computer, but know I will be with S4 for awhile. I helve the latest S4 Pro installed

Posted

IDK- but legally speaking you may want to run this through LOR - if you haven't already.

Just saying

They own S4, I'm not a techy but its almost to me like someone wanting to break in to my house and instead taking a picture of the lock and being able to use a 3D printer to make a key.

JR

Posted
2 hours ago, dibblejr said:

IDK- but legally speaking you may want to run this through LOR - if you haven't already.

Just saying

They own S4, I'm not a techy but its almost to me like someone wanting to break in to my house and instead taking a picture of the lock and being able to use a 3D printer to make a key.

JR

Bob's been making external utilities for the LOR Software Suite for many, many years and many have used a lot of them to help in their sequencing and displays.    So I'm pretty sure Bob is already vetted with LOR on something like this.

Posted (edited)
12 minutes ago, Orville said:

Bob's been making external utilities for the LOR Software Suite for many, many years and many have used a lot of them to help in their sequencing and displays.    So I'm pretty sure Bob is already vetted with LOR on something like this.

Yes, those key words "Bob is vetted or something". Bobs tools, knowledge and kindness is a valuable asset around here.

If I was the OP though and did not identify myself and intentions to Dan and or team, I would before I start asking for Beta testers.

We are all adults and can read in between the lines on that one.

I for one would not want other to have the ability to change meta data in my sequences. But all you have to do is copy/ paste and its done anyway. There are some things proposed that I scratch my head thinking why. Why the need to change a date in a sequence other than trying to misrepresent where, when or who created it. That is info that I present to ebay and paypal to show that someone is selling my work. If the culprit has the ability to change that data to mislead that would hurt my case. Of course I still have the email in which shows proof of them receiving something they are selling but that would add an additional hurdle for instances like this.

If this was ever to happen I believe my sharing days would be over for the majority of members. There are members that would be able to get them but man it would make it tough.

JR

Edited by dibblejr
Posted
7 minutes ago, dibblejr said:

Yes, those key words "Bob is vetted or something". Bobs tools, knowledge and kindness is a valuable asset around here.

If I was the OP though and did not identify myself and intentions to Dan and or team, I would before I start asking for Beta testers.

We are all adults and can read in between the lines on that one.

I for one would not want other to have the ability to change meta data in my sequences. But all you have to do is copy/ paste and its done anyway. There are some things proposed that I scratch my head thinking why. Why the need to change a date in a sequence other than trying to misrepresent where, when or who created it. That is info that I present to ebay and paypal to show that someone is selling my work. If the culprit has the ability to change that data to mislead that would hurt my case. Of course I still have the email in which shows proof of them receiving something they are selling but that would add an additional hurdle for instances like this.

If this was ever to happen I believe my sharing days would be over for the majority of members. There are members that would be able to get them but man it would make it tough.

JR

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but it's not really all that difficult to change a date on{or inside} a file/software.   I'm not going to get into that, as that is information I can not, nor am I allowed to share with anyone.  But it's not as difficult as some may think.  And that's all I'll say on that particular subject matter.

  • Like 1
Posted
1 minute ago, Orville said:

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but it's not really all that difficult to change a date on{or inside} a file/software.   I'm not going to get into that, as that is information I can not, nor am I allowed to share with anyone.  But it's not as difficult as some may think.  And that's all I'll say on that particular subject matter.

Yes, I know of software that does this. But the people I have found selling or sharing claiming their work have not even been smart enough to take out certain things I have learned to do as a marker for my sequences. Some had my pumpkin faces still there and another one that I purchased still referenced my computer file in the sequence info.

So with that being said they are the type selling sequences that would cost a hundred dollars or more more for peanuts and not the type that would shell out $ for software nor even take the time. A google search nets those results.

I never even heard of Meta tags until the first sequence I saw on ebay that was mine and I was asked about the Meta data proof. 

JR

Posted

My software page asks people to not bother LOR staff with questions about my software tools.   LOR has never asked me to desist from distributing the tools I have written to adjust their files.  But I have been blamed for problems a few times.  Multiple people were having a problem and reported to LOR they were using MIIP.   On that occasion I was asked what miip was doing which I explained and the problem was determined to not be related to my stuff since miip does not change anything used by SE.   The other tools do.  Kudos to the OP for his tools and reengineering the lms schema.   The index numbering requirements are a pain.    Dont let the S5 schema scare you.. its not much different. 

 

  • Like 2
Posted
3 minutes ago, ItsMeBobO said:

My software page asks people to not bother LOR staff with questions about my software tools.   LOR has never asked me to desist from distributing the tools I have written to adjust their files.  But I have been blamed for problems a few times.  Multiple people were having a problem and reported to LOR they were using MIIP.   On that occasion I was asked what miip was doing which I explained and the problem was determined to not be related to my stuff since miip does not change anything used by SE.   The other tools do.  Kudos to the OP for his tools and reengineering the lms schema.   The index numbering requirements are a pain.    Dont let the S5 schema scare you.. its not much different. 

 

Best S4 tool ever was the AutoFlip which was kind of integrated in S5 v5.4.2.

  • Like 1
Posted

Dang, I just realized, I was thinking that Bob was the one that had posted this.  Just noticed the OP wasn't Bob!   Sorry Bob.  You have always made a lot of neat utilities to use with the LOR Software, so without really paying attention to the OP, and just reading the info, I thought it was you that was making the request.   Sorry about that.   That was one big blunder on my part.

  • Thanks 1
Posted (edited)

Autoflip does other stuff besides flip.    The Matrix multiplier allows you to repeat in ways LOR does not. 

Edited by ItsMeBobO
Posted

Wow, I don't remember the last time a single thread had this much activity during the off season  😀.  Lots of good discussion, though.  I thought I would respond to some of the items that have been brought up.

I have not had and conversation with Dan or anyone else at LOR (although I am not opposed to it if they would like).  I have no intention of competing with them or trying to create an alternative to the LOR software.  These are simply some tools and utilities that work in conjunction with LOR and provide some features that aren't built into the LOR software and/or provide a different mechanism to edit the sequence files.  I don't believe anything I've done is illegal as the tech industry has a long history of having different software packages create files of a common format (i.e. pdf files, excel files, word files, etc.).  This is no different.  Many of the utilities in the toolbox were inspired by the work shared by others in the community (John Storms and BobO to name a couple), my own experience with my shows, as well just general conversation in the forums (I wish I could do this....).  

To be clear, I do not support or condone anyone who attempts to pass off someone else's work as their own (for profit or not).  People who attempt to do that should face the full consequences of their actions (whatever that may be).  LOR does provide methods for protecting and encrypting sequences so that they can not be modified and the toolbox will not work with those types of sequences.  I also allow for the fact that as creators, there may be times where we want to modify some attribute or aspect of our sequence (for whatever reason we may have).  

Are there risks to using third-party tools like mine?  Yes, I am not a LOR employee and don't have access to everything they know.  But the format and structure of an S4 sequence file isn't that hard to figure out.  We have all benefited from the knowledge, work, and tools shared by other members of the community.   Many people on the forums preach the importance of backing up our files on a regular basis.  The toolbox has a number of defaulted options for creating backups before any changes/edits are saved.  That being said, the toolbox is designed as a set of advanced editors which assumes the user has some level of knowledge about the changes they are making.

All software has bugs and all software can be improved.  I created the toolbox with the intent of giving it to the community as my way of giving back (much in the same way that I created the Weather Conditions app for updating Zara with current weather data).  I want to release the best possible tool that I can and I fully recognize that so many of you produce shows that are way more amazing than mine.  That's why I was looking for beta testers - to get that additional feedback, thoughts, and ideas so that I can make the best software tool that I can.  

Thank you for all the perspective and feedback and please let the discussions continue.

Posted
1 hour ago, jfuller8400 said:

Wow, I don't remember the last time a single thread had this much activity during the off season  😀.  Lots of good discussion, though.  I thought I would respond to some of the items that have been brought up.

I have not had and conversation with Dan or anyone else at LOR (although I am not opposed to it if they would like).  I have no intention of competing with them or trying to create an alternative to the LOR software.  These are simply some tools and utilities that work in conjunction with LOR and provide some features that aren't built into the LOR software and/or provide a different mechanism to edit the sequence files.  I don't believe anything I've done is illegal as the tech industry has a long history of having different software packages create files of a common format (i.e. pdf files, excel files, word files, etc.).  This is no different.  Many of the utilities in the toolbox were inspired by the work shared by others in the community (John Storms and BobO to name a couple), my own experience with my shows, as well just general conversation in the forums (I wish I could do this....).  

To be clear, I do not support or condone anyone who attempts to pass off someone else's work as their own (for profit or not).  People who attempt to do that should face the full consequences of their actions (whatever that may be).  LOR does provide methods for protecting and encrypting sequences so that they can not be modified and the toolbox will not work with those types of sequences.  I also allow for the fact that as creators, there may be times where we want to modify some attribute or aspect of our sequence (for whatever reason we may have).  

Are there risks to using third-party tools like mine?  Yes, I am not a LOR employee and don't have access to everything they know.  But the format and structure of an S4 sequence file isn't that hard to figure out.  We have all benefited from the knowledge, work, and tools shared by other members of the community.   Many people on the forums preach the importance of backing up our files on a regular basis.  The toolbox has a number of defaulted options for creating backups before any changes/edits are saved.  That being said, the toolbox is designed as a set of advanced editors which assumes the user has some level of knowledge about the changes they are making.

All software has bugs and all software can be improved.  I created the toolbox with the intent of giving it to the community as my way of giving back (much in the same way that I created the Weather Conditions app for updating Zara with current weather data).  I want to release the best possible tool that I can and I fully recognize that so many of you produce shows that are way more amazing than mine.  That's why I was looking for beta testers - to get that additional feedback, thoughts, and ideas so that I can make the best software tool that I can.  

Thank you for all the perspective and feedback and please let the discussions continue.

My friend Bob cleared up my initial thoughts. They were just thoughts to try and keep you out of what I thought may be trouble. 

The "protected" option does not work well with singing faces. Maybe you can figure that one out but as of right now S4 protected would make a singing face sequence useless. I have tried it, sent it to others to test and all of us had unfavorable results so I went back to normal sharing.

Sounds like you are on a good track for others though.

Its great to see others sharing their work.

JR

Posted

@ jfuller8400     I will give them a try and offer my thoughts.    Send me the beta link.   

Posted

Sent PM to Bob

Posted

I've just completed the next beta of the Toolbox.  If you've ever imported a channel template and ended up with a bunch of extra timing grids, the Toolbox now as a tool that can automatically identify and remove those duplicate timing grids.  It also has a tool that can apply/import a channel template to multiple sequences quickly and easily.

Please let me know if you are interested in being a beta tester.

 

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