4'x16' RGB pixel wall equipment/software question. 2nd opinion request. :-)

[JeffF]

I need to make up my mind in the next 36 hours to get in on an early season pre-order... and I just would like a 2nd(or 3rd or 4th) opinion. For some reason I can't talk myself into hitting the "place order" button... which I usually don't have a problem with.

Here's what I'm thinking would be a good list of equipment to get the job done...

Netting: 2 x https://www.holidaycoro.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=775

Pixels: 21 x https://www.holidaycoro.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=672%2DPS

Power Supply: 2 x https://www.holidaycoro.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=50%2DPS

RGB Controller: 1 x https://www.holidaycoro.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=722%2DPS

As far as software, I'm a bit overwhelmed. Seems like there are so many choices. I'd love to just keep LOR since I have over 20 PC contollers and know the program very well. I am not looking to ever go all pixels... I just want a place to display info and maybe do a couple effects to words/sayings like Merry Christmas, Jesus, etc. (and maybe, just maybe to draw a snowman or elf or something else Christmassy-cute...)

Any advice on this front? I've never played with anything besides the sequence editor so I'm hoping there's just another LOR product out there for this type of effect. If not, maybe something in addition to LOR?

Thanks,

Jeff

[indi]

LOR has updated the software with a new pixel editor, and you can always use Superstar, my favorite.

[k6ccc]

I saw this a couple hours ago on my phone, but wanted to wait until I was on a computer before trying to look at all the links, and type what may become a long response.  I think that could look cool!  I am assuming you are intending to fill the net.  That takes 1152 nodes and if you order 21 strings of 50 pixels, that's only 1050 pixels.  I would recommend that you buy at least 24 strings of pixels with the expectation of cutting off the last two (or just not using them).  However cutting the extras off will give you 48 spares.  You WILL need them eventually and having spares out of the same batch is recommended because replacements bought in three years may not look quite the same. 

 

You do need to give a major thought to the controller.  That is a four port controller.  That means that you would have six strings of 48 pixels on each output.  I don't know off hand if the AlphaPix controllers will handle 288 pixels on an output (some controllers will, and some won't), but in any case, the refresh rate may be pretty slow with that many pixels in a string.  If you are wanting to stay with the Holiday Coro product line, you should use the 16 port version of the AlphaPix.  With that controller, you would presumably wire two 48 pixel strings end to end which would use 12 outputs, leaving 4 available for future use.  Personally if I were going to do it, I would use a SanDevices controller rather than the AlphaPix, but that's just personal preference.  You could also stay with LOR and go with a PixCon 16 controller.  With any of the 16 port controllers, and certainly with the 4 port, you will have to do something about power injection.  Without power injection, you will have major voltage problems even at the end of 96 pixels (288 pixels would be FAR worse).  You would also likely exceed the amperage capacity of the controller and blow fuses.  Another option would be to buy two 16 port controllers, so that each 48 port string is on it's own output.  This makes it simple and eliminates the power injection problem (and the cost and effort involved in fixing it), but costs the bucks for a second controller.  It would also give you more extra outputs for future use...

 

One last thought about the matrix.  Think about what you want to display.  If you are primarily intending it for text, you might want to think about splitting the net lengthwise and setting it up as 12 x 96 pixels rather than 24 x 48.  Having 96 pixels available makes text FAR easier to read, and the extra height does not buy you much for text.  With 24 x 48 you get fewer characters - which makes it harder to read.  If you are expecting to use graphics, the added height would be more useful.  Heck, you could even split it into thirds to get 8 x 144 pixels, however then it is really only useful for text.

 

Yep, this ended up long enough that I'm glad I did not try it on my phone!

[EmmienLightFan]

You do need to give a major thought to the controller.  That is a four port controller.  That means that you would have six strings of 48 pixels on each output.  I don't know off hand if the AlphaPix controllers will handle 288 pixels on an output (some controllers will, and some won't), but in any case, the refresh rate may be pretty slow with that many pixels in a string.  If you are wanting to stay with the Holiday Coro product line, you should use the 16 port version of the AlphaPix.  With that controller, you would presumably wire two 48 pixel strings end to end which would use 12 outputs, leaving 4 available for future use.  Personally if I were going to do it, I would use a SanDevices controller rather than the AlphaPix, but that's just personal preference.  You could also stay with LOR and go with a PixCon 16 controller.  With any of the 16 port controllers, and certainly with the 4 port, you will have to do something about power injection.  Without power injection, you will have major voltage problems even at the end of 96 pixels (288 pixels would be FAR worse). 

The AlphaPix controller will support 680 pixels on each output.

 

I was going to get a AlphaPix controller but instead I got a Pixlite and I am so pleased I did.

HolidayCoro used to sell Pixlite controllers but then they stopped and started using AlphaPix controllers which they got made especially.

 

There were problems with the AlphaPix causing random flickering, so I am so pleased I chose the other.

Price difference is less than $10, normally, but in the sale it there is a $15 difference.

Shipping was what made me pick Advatek over HolidayCoro. The HolidayCoro website shipping calculation said it would be twice the cost of the controller.

 

Have a look at SanDevices but either controller will work. SanDevices are popular and I have never heard anything bad about them. I will probably get one this year.

 

You can use LOR software with E1.31.

 

Power injection is easy. Connect a wire from the end of each pixel string back to the power supply. Hanson Electronics sells a fuse board which is a good thing to include with power injection and in front of your controller for added safety.

[JeffF]

Great info, thanks a ton! I did not think or know to think about refresh rates, so thanks! Controller wise, pre-ordering wouldn't save a ton so I could always pick up one(or two) later.

BUT, it seems like I waited too long. None of the items appear to be available for pre-order anymore. Didn't realize these would sell out. Darn.

At least it gives me more time to research.

I did watch the tutorial Pixel Editor video and it was very helpful. Seems like this won't be too hard. Just time consuming which is OK at this point.

Thanks again guys!

[JeffF]

Doah! Products are back? Musta been a glitch! Woo-hoo!

Pretty sure I will buy the pixels, netting, and p/s now. Then read more into controllers. I've seen SanDevices mentioned a few places so I'll look into those first.

Thanks again!

Edited January 10, 2016 by JeffF

[JeffF]

I am assuming you are intending to fill the net. That takes 1152 nodes and if you order 21 strings of 50 pixels, that's only 1050 pixels. I would recommend that you buy at least 24 strings of pixels with the expectation of cutting off the last two (or just not using them). However cutting the extras off will give you 48 spares. You WILL need them eventually and having spares out of the same batch is recommended because replacements bought in three years may not look quite the same.

I forgot to mention I am getting two of the 3" spacing nets(each uses 512 pixels). They will be viewed from 80' to 150' away so I'm thinking 3" should work good... hopefully.

Edited January 10, 2016 by JeffF

[indi]

I will be buying the pixel net also. But I ordered my pixels from Holiday light Express's sale. I have already gotten my controller from LOR during their sale. Good luck.

[JeffF]

I will be buying the pixel net also. But I ordered my pixels from Holiday light Express's sale. I have already gotten my controller from LOR during their sale.

Good luck.

Thanks, you too.

I was just reading about the PixCon16. Seems pretty nice.

On the SanDevice site now...

Edited January 10, 2016 by JeffF

[Little_b]

I went with the pixcon16 controller from LOR. The 8 pixel nets, 4000 Pixel Nodes and 12v Power Supplies came from Holiday Coro last year.  My matrix is 63x61 pixels running on Pixel Editor.  I went with the 3" spacing and it turned out great.  Looks even better with snow on it.  Here is a link to one of my videos.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qtro7jRWHOA

 

Search more of my videos for other effects and pictures on the matrix.

[JeffF]

That's great! And I love your dripping icicle tree too!

Thanks for sharing the video.

[JeffF]

Order placed last night for pixels, netting, and power supplies! So excited for this... thanks a bunch for the information guys. It really helped.

 

And I ordered an extra strand of pixels so I should have a strand and a half for replacements over the years. Great advice Jim!

 

Pretty sure I'm going with the PixCon16. Seems like people have had good luck with it and I like that it's LOR.

 

Thanks again!

[bretk]

Have the same setup as you, got the alphapix 4 and it works great with lor pix editor, ended up with 4 strands 256 pix each, injected power at pis 150 and works well. I hope you went 12v otherwise you will need to inject more frequent

[JeffF]

Couple more questions... think I will have to inject power for 5v, 64 pixel strands?

Two 3" spaced nettings will give me a 16x64 grid and I'm pretty sure I should be able to use just one SanDevices E682 controller. Does that sound doable? I figure I'm only using 1024 pixels and the controller is rated for either 1190 to 2040 depending on mode.

At $118 shipped this controller kit seems pretty much perfect for this project no?

-Jeff

[k6ccc]

Couple more questions... think I will have to inject power for 5v, 64 pixel strands?

Two 3" spaced nettings will give me a 16x64 grid and I'm pretty sure I should be able to use just one SanDevices E682 controller. Does that sound doable? I figure I'm only using 1024 pixels and the controller is rated for either 1190 to 2040 depending on mode.

At $118 shipped this controller kit seems pretty much perfect for this project no?

-Jeff

 

 

64 pixel strings will not be a problem.  Depends a little how intense you will be lighting it (all pixels full on vs only a few).  For example, text has a pretty low percentage of pixels that are on.  In my pixel star, I'm running 90 pixels for each of four outputs of an E682 at 5V.  When doing some tests, I found that with all pixels on, the voltage at the end of the string was getting pretty low, so I jumpered power so that power is sent from the E682 to the beginning of the string and also to a point between 60 & 80 percent along the string (depends on which string).  There was no real need to supply power from another source as the total current was OK for the E682.

 

In your case, I would turn all lights full up and measure the voltage at the end of the strings.  If you measure more voltage drop than you would prefer, run a piece of zip cord to the end of the strings and parallel that with the power going to the beginning of the string.

 

I'm glad that you decided not to use a four port controller as you originally proposed.  Although some of the controllers can handle several hundred pixels on a string, the refresh rate gets quite a bit slower.  If you need any assistance in getting the E682 configured, feel free to ask.  I have set up enough of them, and helped quite a few other people over the phone.

[JeffF]

Awesome, thanks Jim!

[1983ss454]

Couple more questions... think I will have to inject power for 5v, 64 pixel strands?

Two 3" spaced nettings will give me a 16x64 grid and I'm pretty sure I should be able to use just one SanDevices E682 controller. Does that sound doable? I figure I'm only using 1024 pixels and the controller is rated for either 1190 to 2040 depending on mode.

At $118 shipped this controller kit seems pretty much perfect for this project no?

-Jeff

I personally like to use sandevices controllers, but everyone has opinions of what they like. I would set it up as Jeff has said with 12 outputs and then I would use the other 4 for power injection. You could probably be ok without it but I have a tendency to side on the side of caution and I'd rather wire it with the power injection in my cellar during the build process then figure out when it's installed that I need it. Pretty easy to setup the power injection on the matrix, just inject on the string on the back side.

[Welsford]

Keep in mind that price on the sandevice is for the kit.  So if you are not handy with a soldering iron that could pose a challenge.  PC Board soldering is not my favorite personally.

 

I can tell you I used the alphapix this year and with the 16 output one you would have no issues running 64 nodes on each output to get your 16x64 matrix.  No power injection would be required if you are running 12v.

In fact you would be fine running them on 8 of the outputs and using the zig zag setting in the controller.  If you are using 5v you are fine too but I would use all 16 outputs then.  I've had no issues with refresh or flicker and mine is the V1 controller.  V2 has a number of improvements to avoid issues there as well.

 

But if you like the sandevice I know a lot of people that love them  Just sharing my experience.

[JeffF]

Awesome to hear, thanks! With all the info people have shared I am extremely happy with my purchases. I appreciate the time taken to reply. It has totally put my mind at ease.

Ans as far as kits, I like soldering. So much so I've soldered 15-20 CTB16PC kits.

Thanks again.

[jerrymac]

If you haven't selected on a controller be sure and check out the Falcon 16.  The most flexible of the controllers on the market, as well as ability to run more pixels than you can count.  Check the Falcon board they are making a group buy now.