tbetgeorge Posted May 29, 2014 Share Posted May 29, 2014 So I have to turn to you other light addicts because you understand my madness! I've been experimenting with different moving heads and all have been underwhelming to say the least once they get outdoors. I want a moving head not for the image, but for the beam of light it creates in the sky. Without haze (which is immediately lost outside with the tiniest bit of wind) it's near impossible to see the beams clearly, especially with light noise (I'm sure the house will create plenty). So far the brightest I've used personally is the new Elation 15R which shoots out about 15,000 lumens. I've heard the Martin 1200s can push out 20,000 lumens but honestly, I don't think that would cut it after seeing 15,000 lumens at work. After talking to a salesman for Solaris, however, I heard about the Showgun light which pumps out over 100,000 lumens - now we're talking! He said these will show the beams across a stadium even with the light noise. I can afford a couple used ones (I'll have to install two 220v breakers - one for each). I think adding a new dimension (these things show beams for miles and don't need an FAA variance) like this would really help the light show. Negative aspects would be 5800 watts of additional power used, lots of heat, needing to build a rain cover, and the need to roll them in (they will stay on their cases made for standing them up) to the garage each night. Am I going too far? What do you guys think... http://www.highend.com/products/automated_luminaires/showgun.asp - Tom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Posted May 29, 2014 Share Posted May 29, 2014 Commercial display? Sure. Residential? My first thought is "overkill" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ItsMeBobO Posted May 29, 2014 Share Posted May 29, 2014 Too big and heavy for my taste, but I would come see your show if you want to go that far. Fixture Dimensions: mm: 596x639x959 (in: 23.5x25.2x37.8)Fixture Weight: 63.5kg (140 lbs.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyD Posted May 29, 2014 Share Posted May 29, 2014 Do it! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zman Posted May 29, 2014 Share Posted May 29, 2014 (edited) Tom, Yup, most who test "movers" on a budget for outside purposes, quickly come to some realization that the intensity of LED is not what it needs to be, to cut through the other light noise. Also, to actually "see" the beam, you need something for it to reflect off of. Fog, haze, or just a powerful light. Don asks a relative question, what application are you considering? Many factors go into your light selection. How far it is from the surface where the spot will hit, the amount of ambient light around that spot, etc... There is a source for used commercial quality yokes from Gearsource. They work with productions shows, theater houses, and the lighting industry in general to broker these used lights. I picked up 2 Martin Mac 250 Entours a few years back for showing on my house. Not inexpensive, but effective. LED is not going to have the "brilliance" I think you are looking for from an outside perspective, showing against other Christmas Lights. They get inventory all the time they need to sell, and are good to work with. Edited May 29, 2014 by zman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbetgeorge Posted May 29, 2014 Author Share Posted May 29, 2014 Tom, Yup, most who test "movers" on a budget for outside purposes, quickly come to some realization that the intensity of LED is not what it needs to be, to cut through the other light noise. Also, to actually "see" the beam, you need something for it to reflect off of. Fog, haze, or just a powerful light. Don asks a relative question, what application are you considering? Many factors go into your light selection. How far it is from the surface where the spot will hit, the amount of ambient light around that spot, etc... There is a source for used commercial quality yokes from Gearsource. They work with productions shows, theater houses, and the lighting industry in general to broker these used lights. I picked up 2 Martin Mac 250 Entours a few years back for showing on my house. Not inexpensive, but effective. LED is not going to have the "brilliance" I think you are looking for from an outside perspective, showing against other Christmas Lights. They get inventory all the time they need to sell, and are good to work with. Thanks, Mark. I also am not considering LED at this point. The Showgun has an LED circle around the beam, but the beam itself is a 2,000 watt MSD lamp. It's similar technology to the Mac 250s, just more powerful (the Mac 250 is about 5,000 lumens compared to the 100,000 of the Showgun). The light will be in the sky, so there won't be an image or a spot it will go on. It is for my house which is not commercial, just me being my ridiculous self. I just want to know if my logic is correct in this light getting the job done or if it won't matter without the haze, regardless. I heard about these lights from Solaris which is a competitor to Gearsource (My understanding is Solaris is the largest used broker of lights in the world). They're actually the ones who recommended it based on my requirement of it being outside. Hope this info helps! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plasmadrive Posted May 29, 2014 Share Posted May 29, 2014 I can tell that even with lasers we need some sort of particulate matter in the air to see them well. 100KL with that fat of a beam will make some visible beams for sure.. unless the sky is crystal clean.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbetgeorge Posted May 30, 2014 Author Share Posted May 30, 2014 Do it! And this is why I love you. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Benedict Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 Do it! Tony, you're just a bad influence on him. But I'll bet you'll be first in line when he plugs it in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiplorenzo Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 The Stage lighting stuff has some great options... I would definitely look for LED stuff as the power bill alone on these will make the Significant other unhappy. I have Ellipsoidals and Fresnels in the Basement for the home theater room ...I had to down grade each Socket in these and the bulbs as each fixture houses a 1000W lamp. I would go to a couple of the theater lighting stores... they might have a couple that you can see work before investing in the units, and one can also look around Ebay or even Alibaba for Moving heads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyD Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 Tony, you're just a bad influence on him. But I'll bet you'll be first in line when he plugs it in. I will absolutely be there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyD Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 And this is why I love you. LOL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MCas4380 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 would this idea cause any problems with the local Airport? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHolmes Posted June 8, 2014 Share Posted June 8, 2014 I believe in doing what the show calls for and nothing more. If the show calls for this type of light, go for it!In my experience as a concert lighting designer, the biggest problem is even the most powerful lights NEED something to reflect off of.You might consider purchasing some high-output hazers or fog machines and running them outdoors too. Even though the wind may carry it away in a few minutes, it will give you the effect you desire with a lesser light. Good luck! I am looking into something similar, though I don't know if I could get that light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tbetgeorge Posted June 10, 2014 Author Share Posted June 10, 2014 would this idea cause any problems with the local Airport? I am in the far vicinity of a few airports but nothing within 10 miles or so. I've contacted companies from the Bay Area that use sky tracking lights (far more powerful) and they told me they've never had issues as long as it's not intentionally following planes or, of course, lasers. I won't need any permits or anything according to my city ordinances regarding light noise etc. Last year the mayor was very supportive as well and sent over 6 police officers to help with traffic... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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