IDMX-1000 & MP3 Showtime Director.

[robin1373]

Hello,

  This year will be my second year using LOR. I am really interested in using RGB dumb and smart lights in my show. I was given a couple of websites to go to and watch videos. I have been watching them for days now. I think I have a good understanding of how the lights work just not how to tie them in to the setup I have. I am more confused than ever and would like help understanding it all please. 

 

 I have 2 16 channel lor controllers and they are run by the MP3 showtime director as i did not want to use my computer to run the show. It is my understanding that the only way to use DMX and not have to use my computer is to purchase the  LOR iDMX- 1000 adapter ?

 

Question 1 Is this correct?

 

Question 2 If so does it plug into the showtime director or to one of my controllers. 

 

Question 3 Dose the idmx only support 1 dmx universe? 

 

Thank you 

Robin 

[Ken Benedict]

Using a LOR Director card, you can run DMX with either the LOR iDMX1000 or Sandevices ELOR.

 

They will both plug into a regular LOR network, in any order,  and you can test them with the LOR Hardware Utility.

Or they can plug directly into your Director card.

 

The iDMX1000 will run one universe of DMX. If you need more universes, get more iDMX1000 units.

You can then use DMX converters to talk to either dumb pixels or smart pixels.

 

Holidaycoro has both; the dumb types and the smart types.

And there are similar products from many other vendors.

 

LOR has a DC controller that can be used for driving dumb strips, motors and solenoids, amongst other devices.

 

 

The ELOR will run four universes, with the first three using the E1.31 protocol and the last one would run straight DMX.

 

Then you can use an E6804 to make your LED lights dance as you would like them.

Or you can use several types of boards from J1SYS, such as their ECG-P2 or their ECG-P12R, both of which talk E1.31 and use either dumb or smart pixels.

 

Keep in mind that LOR has smart pixel products, like the Cosmic Color Ribbon, which many people use and are extremely simple to connect to your LOR network or the dedicated Director unit. LOR will stand behind these Cosmic devices and the LED strips that come with them. And they will replace them if needed. Yes, they are pricier, but you are paying for the support if you have problems.

 

There is good support from the non-LOR vendors until you get to the actual LED strips themselves; then you are on your own to find solutions to fixing bad LED strips. Generally, they are very fragile things that not too many companies will replace willingly.

 

Since you're not using a PC to drive your network, some of your options are limited.

 

If you're not a very technical type of person or would find it difficult to cut and splice wires, then you might want to go the LOR CCR route which is very quick and easy to do.

 

If you are a Do-It-Yourself type of person that loves the wiring and network configuration stuff, then you are certainly on the path to some fun adventures.

 

I use the MP3 Director for most of my displays, since they are usually "one switch wonders" that are very easy for people to start and stop.

The Directors have been used to drive the CCRs and 2811 smart pixel displays just fine.

 

Keep us posted on your progress.

Edited August 4, 2013 by Ken Benedict

[robin1373]

Using a LOR Director card, you can run DMX with either the LOR iDMX1000 or Sandevices ELOR.

 

They will both plug into a regular LOR network, in any order,  and you can test them with the LOR Hardware Utility.

Or they can plug directly into your Director card.

 

The iDMX1000 will run one universe of DMX. If you need more universes, get more iDMX1000 units.

You can then use DMX converters to talk to either dumb pixels or smart pixels.

 

Holidaycoro has both; the dumb types and the smart types.

And there are similar products from many other vendors.

 

LOR has a DC controller that can be used for driving dumb strips, motors and solenoids, amongst other devices.

 

 

The ELOR will run four universes, with the first three using the E1.31 protocol and the last one would run straight DMX.

 

Then you can use an E6804 to make your LED lights dance as you would like them.

Or you can use several types of boards from J1SYS, such as their ECG-P2 or their ECG-P12R, both of which talk E1.31 and use either dumb or smart pixels.

 

Keep in mind that LOR has smart pixel products, like the Cosmic Color Ribbon, which many people use and are extremely simple to connect to your LOR network or the dedicated Director unit. LOR will stand behind these Cosmic devices and the LED strips that come with them. And they will replace them if needed. Yes, they are pricier, but you are paying for the support if you have problems

 

There is good support from the non-LOR vendors until you get to the actual LED strips themselves; then you are on your own to find solutions to fixing bad LED strips. Generally, they are very fragile things that not too many companies will replace willingly.

 

Since you're not using a PC to drive your network, some of your options are limited.

 

If you're not a very technical type of person or would find it difficult to cut and splice wires, then you might want to go the LOR CCR route which is very quick and easy to do.

 

If you are a Do-It-Yourself type of person that loves the wiring and network configuration stuff, then you are certainly on the path to some fun adventures.

 

I use the MP3 Director for most of my displays, since they are usually "one switch wonders" that are very easy for people to start and stop.

The Directors have been used to drive the CCRs and 2811 smart pixel displays just fine.

 

Keep us posted on your progress.

Thank you for the good info. That helps alot. If you dont mind me asking? What do you use as far as the idmx or the elor. Do you feel one is better than the other? I am a diy type of person and feel I rather do that that use the ccrs. I have one more question can you use more than one elor or idmx if needed? 

Edited August 4, 2013 by robin1373

[Ken Benedict]

I use the iDMX1000 unit because it can hold a pre-programmed sequence in it's internal memory.

 

When it turns on, it just runs the sequence continuously until turned off. No sound tho.

[Steven]

What do you use as far as the idmx or the elor. Do you feel one is better than the other?

 

The iDMX1000 comes in a nice, compact package with XLR connectors, making it plug-and-play. It is also fully supported by LOR (so they will repair or replace it if there is any problem). The iDMX1000 firmware has 64 "smart" channels, meaning that a maximum of 64 (out of the 512 channels) can be shimmering, twinkling, or fading at the same time. Unlike the ELOR, the iDMX1000 can run in standalone mode, holding about 5,000 LOR commands. (This feature is not useful if always connected to a showtime directory that is always powered on.)

 

The ELOR comes as a PC board with no case, and is available as a solder-yourself kit for $40 less. It comes with no DMX connector, so you'll have to wire that yourself, using the plug with the screw terminals. If you use E1.31, it gives you 4 times as many channels as an iDMX1000. On the ELOR, all the channels are "smart", meaning they can all twinkle, shimmer, or fade in any combination.

 

The ELOR is much newer than the iDMX1000, meaning it doesn't have as much real-world testing. It is theoretically possible to download firmware for it, however.

 

I use the ELOR in my display, but at the moment I only have 28 DMX channels. In the 1 season I used it, it locked up once and required a power cycle.

[robin1373]

So what I am reading is that you get the elor and then the controlers for the rgb light strips plug into that. Do you have to buy a controller for each rgb strip you buy ?I am sorry for all the question. I have been reading over all this info and watching video for the last few days and it is all mush in my brain now lol.

 

Thank you

Robin

[Steven]

So what I am reading is that you get the elor and then the controlers for the rgb light strips plug into that. Do you have to buy a controller for each rgb strip you buy ?

It depends on what kind of RGB strips you have. There are basically 2 categories:

 

The first is called "dumb", "analog", or "single color". These strips don't have any active circuits in them, but just LEDs and resistors. When they are lit, the entire strip is the same color. They are 3 channels, and have 4 wires: R, G, B, and common.

 

The second is the "smart" strip. These strips have multiple "pixels", each pixel is 3 channels. Since each pixel can be controlled individually, you can do fancy effects, like bounce or chase. The strips have IC chips driving the LEDs, Some have 3 wires, and some have 4.

 

If you tell us which type of strip you plan to use, then we can go from there.

[Ken Benedict]

The ELOR plugs into your Director network and looks like four of the iDMX1000 controllers to the software.

 

The first three output ports of the ELOR speak E1.31 to whatever controllers you choose (see above links).

 

The fourth ELOR port speaks regular DMX, so you can use a regular DMX pixel controller, like Holidaycoro's Tinypix, or a dumb controller.

 

 

If you buy Dumb strips, they only speak Dumb (the entire strip changes color).

 

If you buy Smart strips, they can speak either Dumb or Smart (color changes every few inches).

 

They're almost the same price now.

Edited August 5, 2013 by Ken Benedict

[robin1373]

Thank you guys so much for the help!!! I am just trying to get all this down before I start buying a bunch of stuff. I will say I feel a little better about things than I did  a week ago. I am sure once I get it down it will seem like second nature. I think I would like to use both smart and dumb strips. I have seen several people use the strips up on the roof line and around the garage door. This is something I am thinking about doing so I know I will need a few strips to do this. From my understanding if I want them to twinkle and things like that then I need smart pixels. I was also wanting to do some mini trees and some small things in my yard. I know that these I can use the dumb strips as they will just change color. So If i do put the strips on the house do I need a power supply and a controller for each strip or is there a way to control and power several strips from one controller? I was looking at this strip on holidaycoro  the Smart / Pixel LED RGB Strip 30 LEDs/M 50 Pixels Waterproof (16ft-6in Roll) - 12v 2811. it says this one uses 150 channels. So 4 of them would almost use up one universe. Does this sound correct? So if you have a lot of these strips do you have to buy more than one ELOR to give you more than 4 universes. I  also see that you can buy either a 5v or 12v strip is of these better than the other?

 

Thank you,

Robin

[Steven]

I understand this is not planned for your display, but if you were going to make a mega tree out of 8 RGB dumb strips, then a CMB-24D would be your best choice, and you wouldn't need any DMX hardware.

 

 

the Smart / Pixel LED RGB Strip 30 LEDs/M 50 Pixels Waterproof (16ft-6in Roll) - 12v 2811. it says this one uses 150 channels. So 4 of them would almost use up one universe. Does this sound correct? So if you have a lot of these strips do you have to buy more than one ELOR to give you more than 4 universes. I  also see that you can buy either a 5v or 12v strip is of these better than the other?

 

150 channels means 50 RGB pixels. 4 of these would be 600 channels, which would require 2 universes, as one universe is 512 channels.

 

One ELOR is 4 universes, or 2048 channels total (using E1.31).

 

5v strips are typically 1 RGB LED per pixel. 12v strips are typically 3 LEDs per pixel (like the CCR). (The reason is that 3 LEDs in series is a voltage drop of 8-10v, so you get 3 times the light for the same current.)  A 5v strip will take about 3 times the current of a 12v strip. That, and the greater sensitivity to voltage drop, means that you have to run heavier and/or shorter power wires to the 5v strips.

 

If you have an ELOR and some smart strips, you have to get a controller to convert the E1.31 signal into the signal that goes to the strip, such as the SanDevices E682. Of course, you also need a power supply and wiring.

[robin1373]

If you have an ELOR and some smart strips, you have to get a controller to convert the E1.31 signal into the signal that goes to the strip, such as the SanDevices E682. Of course, you also need a power supply and wiring.

 

Thank you for all the info. I looked up the E682 I did not see where it says how many strips can be ran off of it at one time. Not sure if I missed it or did not know what I was looking at lol. Do you happen to know?

[CLD Kevin]

The iDMX1000 firmware has 64 "smart" channels, meaning that a maximum of 64 (out of the 512 channels) can be shimmering, twinkling, or fading at the same time.

I swore that the iDMX had 128 intelligent channels? The data sheets shows 64 but thought the latest firmware changed it to 128. I'm on the road and had a link saved on my home PC that showed it. Please correct me if wrong.

[Don]

I swore that the iDMX had 128 intelligent channels? The data sheets shows 64 but thought the latest firmware changed it to 128. I'm on the road and had a link saved on my home PC that showed it. Please correct me if wrong.

 

Per the docs:

What's New in Version 2.7.4

New iDMX1000 Firmware: Version 1.41

A new version of the firmware for the iDMX1000 has been released (version 1.41). It contains the following enhancements:

It now has native address support (i.e. there is no longer a need for multiple unit IDs for a single iDMX1000). The old method of having a single iDMX1000 use multiple unit IDs is still supported, as "legacy mode". An iDMX1000 will be in native mode or legacy mode depending upon the unit ID it is set to: If its unit ID ends in a "0" (such as "10", "20", or "30"), it will be in legacy mode, where it actually uses sixteen unit IDs of sixteen channels each (e.g. setting the unit ID to 10 will cause it to use unit IDs 10 through 19 and 1A through 1F). If its unit ID ends in anything other than a zero, it will use only that single unit ID, but it will support all its channels on that single unit ID.

Previously, only DMX addresses up to 256 were supported. Now, addresses up to 512 are supported (but only in native mode).

Previously, only 64 "intelligent channels" were supported at a time - i.e. only 64 channels could simultaneously be doing shimmers, twinkles, and/or fades. Now, 128 intelligent channels are supported at a time.

[CLD Kevin]

Ha!!! My memory is still working :-) Thanks Don! Maybe that data sheet needs to be updated? Still shows 64 "smart" channels.

[Don]

Ha!!! My memory is still working :-) Thanks Don! Maybe that data sheet needs to be updated? Still shows 64 "smart" channels.

 

I'll send them a note about it.

[Steven]

Thank you for all the info. I looked up the E682 I did not see where it says how many strips can be ran off of it at one time. Not sure if I missed it or did not know what I was looking at lol. Do you happen to know?

The E682 can run up to 16 strips, with up to 1024 pixels.  (The pixels don't have to be evenly allocated to the strips.)

 

They also make a newer, smaller, lower-cost board, the E6804, which supports 4 strips.