Upgrading....Help Me Decide

[Protege94]

Posing here since the topic covers both S4 and S6....

Currently running S4 and have been for almost 10 years. Considering upgrading to S6 because last season I had issues with S4 not operating correctly with my scheduled shows and interactive inputs. Here are my questions:

Can I make the jump from S4 to S6 or do I need to install S5 first and then S6? Is there an upgrade license to go from S4 to S6?

Will S6 accept my S4 sequences and then reconfigure them into the new S6 protocol? I know that from S4 to S5 there were file type differences with the sequence files but couldn't find if the S5 and S6 file types are the same.

Is S6 built more for RGB or AC? My whole display is AC with 6 interactive input switches that guest push to start each song. I would like to incorporate RGB at some level in the future but during the off season I never seem to think about it or set time aside to learn it. Who knows if I ever get to the point of adding RGB.

Thank you in advance for the assistance.

[Don]

1. You can make the jump from 4 to 6. 
1a. If you want to keep the same level you have now (Basic+, Advanced, Pro) then you need this:
https://store.lightorama.com/products/software-major-release-upgrade
If you want to move up a level (basic+ to Pro for example) then you need this: 
https://store.lightorama.com/products/software-license-level-upgrade
    You do NOT need both.
2. Watch this video.
3. S5/S6 use the same file structure.
4. I use S6 for all programming jobs I do. AC and RGB. Works just fine.

[k6ccc]

One more note.  There is a rather large learning curve between S4 and S5 or S6.  Not so much in the sequencing (at least until you start using Motion Effects), but how to get things done.  When S5 was new, one of the standard recommendations was to NOT try to upgrade late in the season.  Better to make the change right after you are completed with your Christmas show.  That gives you nine months or so to figure it out.  I still largely stand by that recommendation.

BTW, I use interactives every night for my year round landscaping show, so might be able to help you with that.

 

[Orville]

Or do what I'm going to do, I just bought a new laptop with Windows 11 on it.  I will be installing S6 on the new laptop, and still be using S4.4.16 Pro on my older system, and try and learn S6 on the laptop.

My only issue is, I've read some of the S6 versions (above 6.2.2?) have had some issues, so I'm not exactly sure which S6 I need, or should install. 

I also did the major upgrade for my license, as the last version my license was good for was 5.6.8 I believe. 

Hoping S6 may be a little less complicated than S5 was for me, tried S5, but could never get any lights functional in it.

When I load any of my S4 (copied) sequences to the laptop into S6, what else will I need to do to make them fully converted, and work in S6?

Edited August 15, 2023 by Orville
Correct typos.

[Don]

11 hours ago, Don said:

2. Watch this video.

Forgot link.

https://youtu.be/XbbIhz-5dWk

[Don]

4 minutes ago, Orville said:

Hoping S6 may be a little less complicated than S5 was for me, tried S5, but could never get any lights functional in it.

Nope. It's virtually the same for programming. 

 

5 minutes ago, Orville said:

When I load any of my S4 (copied) sequences to the laptop into S6, what else will I need to do to make them fully converted and work in S6?

See the video I posted just now.

 

6 minutes ago, Orville said:

I've read some of the S6 versions (above 6.2.2?) have had some issues

Well, every single version of software (not just LOR) has some issue. Could be major, could be small. Personally, I wouldn't worry about it if I were in your position. 

[Orville]

18 minutes ago, Don said:

Nope. It's virtually the same for programming. 

 

See the video I posted just now.

 

Well, every single version of software (not just LOR) has some issue. Could be major, could be small. Personally, I wouldn't worry about it if I were in your position. 

Thanks Don.  I'll download the latest version available.

Off to check out the video.

[tlogan]

2 hours ago, Orville said:

Hoping S6 may be a little less complicated than S5 was for me, tried S5, but could never get any lights functional in it.

When I load any of my S4 (copied) sequences to the laptop into S6, what else will I need to do to make them fully converted, and work in S6?

As mentioned I've seen very little difference between S5 and S6 in what I do. I only have a few motion effects and a few Super Star effects. The exception is the new combined Control Panel. It does all the same stuff, just differently, at least as  far as I can tell. I upgraded from 5.6.8 to 6.2.8 and it has been plenty stable for me. I think the 6.2.6 had some issues others were posting about, so I went to 6.2.4 and then up to 6.2.8.

As far as I know, the import process in S6 is the same as for S5. When you open your S4 sequences in S5/6 a dialog box pops up to complete the upgrade of the sequence. It was very straightforward for me in S5 and I've had no issues opening them when I upgraded to S6 this year.

The key to these new versions, as I'm sure you've probably seen many times, is that you MUST start from the Preview. Start by defining each Prop and you assign the Units and Channels (or ports for pixels) within the prop definition. Once I started at the bottom (the props) it was pretty easy. If you get a picture of your house, it is all very visual.

[Protege94]

Thank you for all the replies. Seems like the consensus opinion is to run S4 one more year and then really dedicate the first 6 months of next year to learning S6 and getting everything converted over.

I like the idea of running S6 on another machine to play around with it in the mean time, will probably go that route as well. Does anyone know if I do the major upgrade license will that brick my version of S4?

[PhilMassey]

All the past versions are available on the download page back to version 2.

https://store.lightorama.com/pages/download-software

You can run any version you choose . You get 5 seats, so you can have five different versions on five machines if you wanted to.

 

[Orville]

17 minutes ago, Protege94 said:

Thank you for all the replies. Seems like the consensus opinion is to run S4 one more year and then really dedicate the first 6 months of next year to learning S6 and getting everything converted over.

I like the idea of running S6 on another machine to play around with it in the mean time, will probably go that route as well. Does anyone know if I do the major upgrade license will that brick my version of S4?

Nope, won't affect anything on ANY PREVIOUS versions.  You can run any version you like up to what your license will cover.

[Dr_Aplet]

I think there is enough time between now and Christmas (depending on your display) to get your preview, sequences, show, and schedule situated. you would need to dedicate some time to it.  however i have not upgraded i just jumped in to s5.  If you have a big display and are you are starting now to set up then wait for sure.  I try to be ready to go the day after thanksgiving.  But i also have Halloween and fall simple sequences that i run between then but i am small time compared to some of you. Just my 2 cents.  For sure having a second computer and duplicate sequences would be great to test without fear or failure.  I buy Dell latidude laptops from ebay for $300 and they work great.  ive been doing that for years- those are business grade laptops not like the box store garbage you get from the "home" side of computers.  

[bdwillie]

When I moved to S5 during Beta, it was a bit of a learning curve, but it was worth it to me.  I am 98% AC / Dumb RGB. This year I will be up to a grand total of roughly 160 pixels total! LOL! 

Once past the learning curve I just found 5/6 easier to use.  Have needed help a few times but folks here always help out if needed!  Good luck with your choice!

 

[Mr. P]

I have been using S4 ever since it came out and I have been resisting the change. I will however be upgrading after the Season this year and finally jump onbard.

[dgrant]

I'll toss in my two cents worth here, I've been with LOR since Version 2 I think. Now on the latest and greatest 6. Simply put, I find that S6 is easier in the long run and much more user friendly. Yes, there's certainly a learning curve but not really from S5 to S6. A few new motion effects but its not a lot. From S4 to S6, a larger learning curve but its really only in locating where things are. Its not near as bad as its made out too be. Another suggestion for anyone here, if you actively participate in the Beta tests for any new major version coming out, it'll put you way ahead of everyone else. Beta testing is closed for now till they figure out a S7 plan, if and when.

For those sitting on the side of the fence at this moment, as several have said, depending on the size of your show, you can make the jump now or wait. If its a small show, do it now, large show, your choice. One huge loss from S4 to S5/S6 is the loss of the visualizer. Supposedly LOR is still working on or thinking about a way to give it back to us. To clarify, the S4 visualizer allowed us to see our preview displays, live, while the show runs. S5/S6 do not.

[Orville]

46 minutes ago, dgrant said:

I'll toss in my two cents worth here, I've been with LOR since Version 2 I think. Now on the latest and greatest 6. Simply put, I find that S6 is easier in the long run and much more user friendly. Yes, there's certainly a learning curve but not really from S5 to S6. A few new motion effects but its not a lot. From S4 to S6, a larger learning curve but its really only in locating where things are. Its not near as bad as its made out too be. Another suggestion for anyone here, if you actively participate in the Beta tests for any new major version coming out, it'll put you way ahead of everyone else. Beta testing is closed for now till they figure out a S7 plan, if and when.

For those sitting on the side of the fence at this moment, as several have said, depending on the size of your show, you can make the jump now or wait. If its a small show, do it now, large show, your choice. One huge loss from S4 to S5/S6 is the loss of the visualizer. Supposedly LOR is still working on or thinking about a way to give it back to us. To clarify, the S4 visualizer allowed us to see our preview displays, live, while the show runs. S5/S6 do not.

So with S5/S6, if I want to see a live "preview", then I have to have the actual lights and props all configured, and all lights and controllers physically connected to actually see how it's going to look in the actual display when set up for public viewing outside?

Am I comprehending this correctly, since there is no visualizer?

I'll have a workroom for this, hopefully soon. 

Just want to be sure this is what I need to do to test things out when I finally start learning the latest version of S6 when I install it on the new laptop.

Thank you.

[PhilMassey]

The Preview works without actual hardware physically connected. What's missing is the ability to see the display when the Show Player is playing the show.

Edited August 19, 2023 by PhilMassey

[Orville]

30 minutes ago, PhilMassey said:

The Preview works without actual hardware physically connected. What's missing is the ability to see the display when the Show Player is playing the show.

I think I understand that this is when running a show from a computer, has nothing to do with the sequencer itself when creating sequences for the show.

I've never used this option, and since I use a Director to run my shows, I'm pretty sure this couldn't be used, or even an option in my case with a Director running the show.

Thanks for clearing that up for me, as I wasn't sure exactly what this was, or how it worked exactly.

[Dr_Aplet]

5 hours ago, Orville said:

So with S5/S6, if I want to see a live "preview", then I have to have the actual lights and props all configured, and all lights and controllers physically connected to actually see how it's going to look in the actual display when set up for public viewing outside?

Am I comprehending this correctly, since there is no visualizer?

I'll have a workroom for this, hopefully soon. 

Just want to be sure this is what I need to do to test things out when I finally start learning the latest version of S6 when I install it on the new laptop.

Thank you.

In the sequence Editor there is a preview where you can model your house and see your display watch your computer version of the song, do your timing , however when you are playing the show there is no preview available.  That said if you want to see each individual song with active lights and the sequencer you can go use the Sequence editor and toggle it to control lights. 

All that to to say- when you are at your desk you can see your project as you work on it with the Preview in the Sequence editor. 

[Orville]

18 minutes ago, Dr_Aplet said:

In the sequence Editor there is a preview where you can model your house and see your display watch your computer version of the song, do your timing , however when you are playing the show there is no preview available.  That said if you want to see each individual song with active lights and the sequencer you can go use the Sequence editor and toggle it to control lights. 

All that to to say- when you are at your desk you can see your project as you work on it with the Preview in the Sequence editor. 

I usually set up some controllers and lights, so I can verify what the computer conversion shows me, is what I get by creating a test show, and making sure it's doing what I expect.  

When I don't do a "live" verify like that, I've gotten some unexpected results in the actual display I've had to fix!🤣🤣🤣

So I like to see how the sequence actually translates into the real world   I learned a long time ago, never trust what a computer shows you on screen for real world results, can get some really odd and wierd results.🤪🤔🤣

Edited August 19, 2023 by Orville