Built a pixel mega tree with a flag pole, and it just crashed in the wind

[Wonko]

Hi all,

I put up a 20’ pixel mega tree with 16 strands on an extension flag pole banged into my yard with 5 guy wires. It worked fine last week, but tonight we had heavy winds. The entire flag pole cracked in half, and it’s now on my grass. 
 

What should I use to get it back up and working? This can’t be a permanent install, as my kids play in the back yard all year. 
 

Thanks for your input!

wonko

[dibblejr]

4 hours ago, Wonko said:

Hi all,

I put up a 20’ pixel mega tree with 16 strands on an extension flag pole banged into my yard with 5 guy wires. It worked fine last week, but tonight we had heavy winds. The entire flag pole cracked in half, and it’s now on my grass. 
 

What should I use to get it back up and working? This can’t be a permanent install, as my kids play in the back yard all year. 
 

Thanks for your input!

wonko

Black Iron pipe no less than 2". I have been under trees and would never use anything less than 2". Even my 2.5" black iron steel  1 section 22' tree bows with all of the weight. I would not put myself under an AL pole with the weight of lights on it, never.

JR

Edited December 1, 2022 by dibblejr

[k6ccc]

Good advise.

I have a 25 foot flag pole in my yard and several people have suggested making a mega tree out of it.  No way!  My son suggested putting a single ribbon strip zip tied up the pole.  That it could support, but I don't think it would look good so not planning on it.

 

[Mr. P]

I purchased two army camo pole sets with spreaders off of ebay and I run my flat pixel tree 18 feet tall and my mega tree is 22 feet tall with those poles. They are 1.75 inch aluminum and I have never had problems with them.

[dgrant]

My two megatrees are 15 feet tall. I use 1 inch black pipe with four guide wires. Then 8 wires to the base-ring which is attached to the ground. Even a tornado level wind (just starting up), didn't take them down. Trashed my pixel trees but not the megatrees.

[Wonko]

Thanks for the info! How do you get your 15’  1” black pipe w/ pixels up in the air? And do you use a coupler? The 2 pipe for my 20’ tree w/ 2 sections coupled together w/ 16 sets of 100 pixels is so heavy, we couldn’t figure out how to get it stood up at an angle high enough to make it into the floor flange which was bolted into a 2x6 and then into the grass. We had to pick the whole thing up on its end (including the 2x6 base we built), and push the whole thing up together. Which meant I couldn’t use the rebar I had banged into the ground for extra support. Any ideas?

 

thanks!

[EARLE W. TALLEY]

Since I sold my ROHN tower that I used for my spiral tree back in 2018, and got back into this hobby I have been trying to work out a combination of EMT poles and guy wires that would withstand the tension needed for my cables of the spiral tree.I started with a 10' EMT pole 2 1/2', then the next smaller size that slipped inside that pole, it was also 10' in length. I drilled a hole at the point to give me a 15' pole with 5' of the smaller pole inside and 5' outside the other pole. I then put my hook head and 16 cables , put my 2' anchors in the ground and tightened the cables, PROBLEM the pole started to bow at the 10' point, took it down , added 4 guy wires at the 10' point redid the cables all OK until I put more pressure on the cables, it started to bow in the middle of the 10' pole, I put 4 more cables at that point. All worked out 2021, but before take down I noticed the top 5' had a small bow. This year I now have 4 cables at the 6' point, 4 cables at the 10' point and 4 cables at the 12 1/2' point , then my hook head with the 16 cables. All cables are inside the 16 cables that form the tree. The tree was put up on Nov. the 1st and it has not bowed at all and the cables has pulled the base into the ground about 2" , with that much pressure something had to give. 

[dibblejr]

5 hours ago, Mr. P said:

I purchased two army camo pole sets with spreaders off of ebay and I run my flat pixel tree 18 feet tall and my mega tree is 22 feet tall with those poles. They are 1.75 inch aluminum and I have never had problems with them.

That is also stout and great but getting more difficult to find my friend. Anyone in Al needing some, I will give a few sections. I have a couple sets. Even though they are AL, it takes several drill bits to drill a hole.

JR

[ItsMeBobO]

Sorry to hear that Wonko.  What a bummer.   In the past I used a threaded coupling but the pipe broke at the threads.    A pole pin slides inside the pipe.     Looks like Christmas Light Show is closing up.  This was my source for several of them.   My pole is three pipe sections 1.25 with these between just held together by gravity.     I had four guy wires and also support in the middle.

 

[dgrant]

10 hours ago, Wonko said:

Thanks for the info! How do you get your 15’  1” black pipe w/ pixels up in the air? And do you use a coupler? The 2 pipe for my 20’ tree w/ 2 sections coupled together w/ 16 sets of 100 pixels is so heavy, we couldn’t figure out how to get it stood up at an angle high enough to make it into the floor flange which was bolted into a 2x6 and then into the grass. We had to pick the whole thing up on its end (including the 2x6 base we built), and push the whole thing up together. Which meant I couldn’t use the rebar I had banged into the ground for extra support. Any ideas?

 

thanks!

I designed mine to be able to come apart all the way for storage. In my case, I'm doing 16 CW spirals and 16 CCW spirals with each its own controller channel on two AC Controllers. Just a coupler to attach the two 1 inch pipe pieces together, '10 and '5. On top, I cheaply used a pvc collar thing from the home improvement store with 32 holes drilled into it. In the holes went S hooks. On top is a 1 inch galvanized adapter plate. From that plate, hang the four major tie does "1/16 steel cables and the 8 "1/16 inch guide wires for the pixels.  There's no pixels on it at the time. In the ground I pound in a solid steel bar that's about "3/4 inch thick and '3 long. On a wood base, I attach another galvanized screw on adapter. The large bar goes into that hole.

So, I manually lift the whole pipe up and onto the "3/4 bar which provides the temporary support so that I can get the main guide wires attached to their screwed-in, ground attachments with zip-ties. Using a level, I then adjust the pipe for plumb vertical by adjusting the zip ties till the whole pole is perfect and tight. Then proceed with the base ring, which I forgot to say, I just lay on the ground before I raise the pole. Proceeding then to screw-in anchors for the base ring and finally the 8 steel guide wires from the collar to the base ring.

The hard part is last. Using a long pole and hook, I hang one set of lights onto every other hook, CW or CCW and one at a time, I walk the string around the tree 1.5 times or so. Depends in the base ring diameter and string length. When I finish 16 strings CW, then I do 16 CCW. Being that I use M6 type LED strings, they support each other to mostly keep the shape. Its not perfect  but hey, it works and at night, its beautiful. I have two of these megatrees and both are individually controlled, so I can make them identical to each other or dance them separately. Back when I old had two controllers for both trees, I fabricated 32 entension cords(SPT2 type) to run from tree to tree and control both the same.

[Wonko]

Thanks for all the input, guys!

Update...(pics in dropbox below)

Built a basic base out of 2X6, bolted a steel floor flange onto the 2x6, installed (2) 10' sections of 1" black steep pipe with a coupler. I use a quick tree topper from Holidaycoro, so I had to drill out some holes and add another flange at the top. I can't believe how heavy this was, even with only 16 strands of 100 pixels. I'm hoping to go to 32 next year, but I'll definitely need a new setup. Myself and two buddies could barely get it up and straight. I'm only using 3 guy wires, and I wish I had used more. It's stable (for now), but the weight of the pipe is bugging me. Can't imagine what happens if this thing falls.

Wish me luck! ;-)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/be79x6udpkotsyq/IMG_0061.JPG?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/5fiinl118ekp8h6/IMG_0062.jpg?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/kayi9seppep11p2/IMG_0063.JPG?dl=0

[Wonko]

I'm thinking to add a few more guy wires in the middle at the coupler. Any thoughts on how to add a guy wire where there's no hook? 

Thanks again!

[Mr. P]

My strands are staked directly to the ground so its like having an extra 48 guy wires holding the tree up. You didn't mention, do you stake to the ground or use a ring or something else?

[TheDucks]

13 hours ago, ItsMeBobO said:

Sorry to hear that Wonko.  What a bummer.   In the past I used a threaded coupling but the pipe broke at the threads.    A pole pin slides inside the pipe.     Looks like Christmas Light Show is closing up.  This was my source for several of them.   My pole is three pipe sections 1.25 with these between just held together by gravity.     I had four guy wires and also support in the middle.

 

I use 1.75 6061T6 Aluminum with a similar pin. The rule of thumb (splice a leading edge on a Hangglider) for splices was the inside needed to be 3x the diameter.

Threading cuts material away, making it even weaker to side loads.

[dgrant]

8 hours ago, Mr. P said:

My strands are staked directly to the ground so its like having an extra 48 guy wires holding the tree up. You didn't mention, do you stake to the ground or use a ring or something else?

Weld some hooks on!

[prevue12]

I had a questionable pole one year, added bracing / guy wires in the middle of the pole so it couldn't bow so easy and take the wind loads. Got me through that year and the next  no problem. 

[dgander]

I use a palm tree for my pole 😁

Be very careful as you go higher and more weight. You also don't have to use something round for the "shaft" if it's hidden anyway. I have a used steel warehouse near me and you can get I beams cheap. Remember if the weight is all on one side your shear force becomes a huge issue. Support/guy wires need to evenly counter the unbalanced weight.

[Wonko]

My tree crashed again last night 🤦‍♂️

A ground stake in the grass for one of the guy wires ripped right out of the lawn, and the tree went falling.

I was using a 1” steel pipe screwed into a malleable floor flange screwed into a base made out of 2x6s. One of the 2x6s shattered when the tree fell, so I’m going to use a Mattos Design Sasquatch stand alone mega tree mount that I bought a few weeks back.

I’m going to keep the 1” steel pipe as the center of the tree since it’s already assembled, but the Sasquatch is made for a 2” square tube.

1) Any issues with using the 1” pipe with the Sasquatch if I screw it in tightly?

2) The Sasquatch has spots for four legs, which will be made of 1” square tube. Any ideas what to use keep them in place on the grass? Some kind of a strap with a stake?

3) How do I make sure my guy wires stay in the grass this time?

4) How wide would I put my pixels, and how securely do you guys have your pixels in the grass? I’m using 16 strands of 100 pixels on a HolidayCoro Pix Node Extreme with 2” spacing, and the tree is 20’ high. I had the pixels about 6’ wide and each strand was secured with a stake, but they were blowing around a lot. I was having to adjust the strands every morning, but I’m afraid to secure them to the grass too firmly with all the wind we’ve been having. Do your pixel strands move at all?

Thanks for your help!

-Wonko

Edited December 17, 2022 by Wonko

[dgrant]

As I mentioned, my two megatrees are at 15 feet tall and I have no issues. Its possible that the winds you experience are just beyond your design limits for the amount of actual lateral force being caught by the pixel strips. Basically put, you've created a sail and as we all know, sails are created to catch the wind. If you spaced out the individual strips a bit more, that would allow the wind to get through them. I use screw-in stakes that are a good 12 or more inches long for the main tie-downs. Another thought on the 1 inch black pipe is putting them together using pipe wrenches to insure you get them into the coupler all the way possible with a little WD-40. The bottom of the pole, I use a steel stake that's like 3/4 inch thick and two feet long. All it does is provide protection from any bottom horizontal movement...keeps the bottom from working its way sideways and slipping out from under the tree.

[TheDucks]

Rather that rigid guy tension, allow the tree top to move a small amount within the slack (but not too much). This absorbs the shock of the gust by allowing a small bit of motion.