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seanmc

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I am currently using a Mr Christmas with 6 channels, 12 amps, and 30 preprogrammed songs for 28 strands of C9 LED lights. The songs and programs are getting old so I have an interest in retiring Mr Christmas and buying LOR products. Before I buy anything I want to make sure I'm not jumping down a rabbit hole. I think the Addon CTB04-PC will work for my set up. My question is, if it doesn't can I return the products for a full refund? I can't find that information on the LOR website anywhere and since there's software licensing involved that creates a whole other set of problems. Thank you in advance for your assistance.

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17 minutes ago, seanmc said:

I am currently using a Mr Christmas with 6 channels, 12 amps, and 30 preprogrammed songs for 28 strands of C9 LED lights. The songs and programs are getting old so I have an interest in retiring Mr Christmas and buying LOR products.

Hey Seanmc!!! Welcome!  I used a Mr. Christmas for a few years before I moved to LOR last year and I find it a delight to see posts from those using a MR. C.  I had always looked at my MRC as adequate for my needs once I soldered wires for my FM transmitter into it. LOR was kind of a "if I  was rich and an electrical engineer" kind of thing. Last year my MR. Christmas 6 channel started to die right at beginning of season so my wife let me get my first 16 channel controller and it was light and day. My whole family loved doing that show so much that I was running 48 channels by the end of the year.

Anyways, all that to say that you will not regret LOR. As for what to buy - I strongly recommend buying a starter kit (Residential Series 16 Channel Starter Package)as this will save you money. I went with the commercial kit to start with, but have since learned the residential series are just find for most homes. The starter kit comes with a 16 channel controller, the RS485 adapter you need and a basic software license. Buy this kit as you save money. I strongly recommend upgrading to the Basic Plus license and the red RS485 adapter as the cost is minimal and you will likely ending up needing these down the road. As for songs: when I switched from MRC to LOR I had no idea how to sequence and quickly learned it can take months to have songs ready. So I bought 5 from the LOR store for $24 each with the music from Amazon (linked in the sequence page) and followed the directions to add them in. Instant show. Worked great. And I was able to use all the extension cords, lights, blow molds and etc. (called 'props' in LOR land) that I had so other than the starter kit and songs I didn't have to lay out any money last year. Which reminds me: If you don't buy the starter kit (and you should) make sure to buy a 16 channel controller. Don't buy the 4 channel as that will be more limiting than the MRC.  I know you said you are only using 28 strands, but once you go LOR and see the capabilities I think you'll really appreciate having 16 channels.  That being said, if you just want the 4 channel controller, you'll need the basic software license ($50) and the RS485 black converter ($30) to make the controller work. Plus songs.

I hope that helps. The group on this forum are a great bunch and are an awesome resource for questions going forward with LOR. Feel free to PM me if you have questions as I am pretty sure I made all the expensive mistakes on my move and am happy to help save you time and money.

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I too started with a Mr. Christmas unit that I purchased in 2009 {maybe 2008}, a 4 channel wireless setup.  I had always seem them in the stores and thought they were always so cool, that was until I started driving around to check out other Christmas Light Displays and stumbled on to these animated lights to music shows and ended up being able to talk to a few of the folks that were doing them.  I was hooked after seeing how they worked and got into this hobby in 2010.

I started with a 16 channel CTB16PC unit, at first and Basic Plus license, but within several months I was up to 5 CTB16PC Controllers, upgraded to Advanced license {highest available at the time}, an DC-MP3 Director unit to run my shows and an FM transmitter before my first show got off the ground in 2010.

I'd definitely recommend what LaughsBrightly stated, however, if it were me and if you can afford it, go with the PRO license, it will give you a whole lot of extras and options you can't do with lower license levels.  because if you end up going into RGB Lighting, like the LOR Singing Christmas Trees or any other RGB lighting products, PRO is the definitive way to do all this.   And you can still keep and use your current lights, blow molds/props.

Sequencing may be a bit daunting at first, but once you get the hang of it, it'll become much easier to do and complete.  Believe me, my first years sequence are the worst I ever created, I'm still not as good as a lot of these folks here, but I've definitely improved a lot over the years from my first year of learning and doing this.

Once you see all the capabilities of how this all goes together and works together, that Mr. Christmas will be a dust collector, or like me, you'll give it to another family member, neighbor or friend.   Once you go the route this hobby takes you, you will never look at a Mr. Christmas box in the same way ever again.

Good Luck on what you decide to do, but there are many of us here that will help you along as we can.  Just ask questions and we'll help if we can.

However, some times of the year, getting an answer may be a little difficult, and can take longer than you'd like, especially around Halloween and especially Christmas as folks are working on and getting their displays ready and set up for the Holidays.  Just be patient and someone will probably answer as soon as they can.

The key is don't get frustrated, take a break, relax and come back to it.  This is a hobby that takes a lot of effort and time to do.  I've seen a lot of folks come and go, usually newbies that come in around late October, early November and get frustrated and flustered because they can't get answers they're looking for quick enough because we're all working on our displays and sequences.  So again, take it easy, relax and try not to be to impatient if you don't get an answer immediately.   I've had to wait at times 2, 3 or even more days during the peak Holiday season to get an answer on the forums like this one.   So just want you to be aware of this factor as well.

Again, Good Luck and hope to see you in this crazy, zany lighting hobby soon.

 

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Thank y'all for the kind words. Just curious, do y'all run CAT5 from your PC's, ELL's, or MP3 players for controller communication? I don't think my wife would like a CAT5 running out the front door.

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 I have three cat 5 cables through the wall to a wall box.

One LOR network

One LOR to dmx network.

One E1.31 over Ethernet.

ELL's will only work for low speed, low channel count setups.

Some people use a piece of foam pipe insulation at the bottom of a window to seal the small gap for the cable.

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Welcome fellow Missouri resident.    If you live near St Louis   please feel free to buzz me and I can show you my gear.  I may be able to loan you spares to do a proof of concept.  

Bob-O 

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2 hours ago, seanmc said:

Thank y'all for the kind words. Just curious, do y'all run CAT5 from your PC's, ELL's, or MP3 players for controller communication? I don't think my wife would like a CAT5 running out the front door.

This show owner is seriously committed or needs to be.    There are holes drilled in the walls for the phone line, the cable tv and internet.   And also holes drilled for light show Cat5 which is an important utility like the others. 

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I have conduit all over the place.  This drawing is a little dated, but it gets the idea.

Conduit_drawing_2017-03-02.png

 

I know that is rather hard to read, but here is a pdf so you can zoom in better (this forum does not know what to do with a pdf).

http://www.newburghlights.org/images/Conduit_drawing_2017-03-02.pdf

 

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12 hours ago, seanmc said:

Thank y'all for the kind words. Just curious, do y'all run CAT5 from your PC's, ELL's, or MP3 players for controller communication? I don't think my wife would like a CAT5 running out the front door.

Mine did run out the door for 2 years, rather under the door and secured with UV screw down cable clamps.  Not something I'd recommend, but whomever re-hung my front door left a 1/2" or so gap under it, so my cat5 cables {only 2} were easy enough to do.   If the door would have been hung {or cut?} properly, then that gap wouldn't have been there and I'd have ran the cat5 out through the window instead.

I'm hoping to eventually drill holes through the wall and use Cat5 jacks on both the inside and outside if I opt to run my show from my computer or for testing purposes.   Otherwise, my shows will be ran from my G4 {N4-G3} MP3 Director, so no cables through windows, doors or walls would be needed, but I still want to have them, just in case the Director would fail or have issues, then I can resort to the computer for backup to run the shows.  That, and it'd be so much easier having dedicated Cat5 jacks connected together through the wall in this manner.   I'll be using 4 gang Cat5 plates to do this, that way I can still have 4 Networks in the same fashion as the G4 {N4-G3} Director unit.   Just how I'm planning on doing it in case I need to run shows from my computer.

 

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Phil- Thank you for the 411. It helps.

Bob-O - Thank you for the invitation. I live in Lebanon. If I move forward with this I will certainly ask if I can come take a peak. Y'all have forgotten more than I will ever know.

Mr P - Thank you. Forty odd years in IT environment and I had never heard of flat cat. That was worth the price of admission.

k6ccc - If you have a video of that schematic in action I would love to see it. That's amazing.

Orville - Without out knocking out some brick and mortar to install an external RJ45 wall mount I like the idea of the MP3. Any idea how many songs and light programs will fit on a 1mg SD card? I think my game camera has a 32mg if I need to scavenge.

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I too have boxes mounted on the outside wall with passthroughs on the inside. Two RS485's, standard and enhanced, then two cat5's, one E1.31 and another for cameras, another ethernet for the other side of my house plus...lol, a fiber line for internet coming in. Oh yeah, power also going out for the small wired router there which is enclosed in a weatherproof box. I tried the ELL's and have a bunch of them but I found too much interference on the frequencies and had lights doing their own things. Then saw a couple of HAM radio operators, I think, searching and finding my house with a device. I was probably interfering with them. No, no clue if in their frequencies or some other type. Anyway, had to stop using them.

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2 hours ago, seanmc said:

k6ccc - If you have a video of that schematic in action I would love to see it. That's amazing.

I'm not sure what you are asking for.  Assuming you are talking about my conduit layout I posted yesterday, that is just an AutoCAD layout that shows where there is conduit and junction boxes, how big those conduit and boxes are, and what equipment is at each box and what wire is in each conduit.  It includes all the various cabling - only some of which is lighting related.

 

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20 hours ago, PhilMassey said:

 I have three cat 5 cables through the wall to a wall box.

One LOR network

One LOR to dmx network.

One E1.31 over Ethernet.

ELL's will only work for low speed, low channel count setups.

Some people use a piece of foam pipe insulation at the bottom of a window to seal the small gap for the cable.

I am a hole driller as well the wife thinks the house will fall down someday because I am always drilling in to the bricks. I do have some holes I have to drill at about 58' or so that I have been putting off since mounting the RGB roof nodes permanently. 

I am glad i didnt get the contractor who hung the lights to do it. I was nervous just watching him drill the clips in to hold the conduit then run the cables through the vents. Its unsightly up close but at the time I had already soldered the cables to the lights.

Next time I will cut off the weather proof connectors close to the connector. Run the cable through the hole and then solder the connectors back in place and silicone the hole. Either way there is no easy way to drill holes at about 60' and it takes a 100' man lift to reach due to the incline. When I was doing LED roof lights there was a time I used a shorter lift with a ladder in the basket to reach but those days were not thought out very well. LOL

The last time I did that I was letting pressure off the stabilizers and the shorter man lift took off down my hill. Never rented it again. I am glad to lower it you have to be on the ground.  It was a very dry year and it took off like a downhiller on a ski slope. Somewhere I have the security camera footage.

JR

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On 9/29/2020 at 8:07 AM, seanmc said:

Orville - Without out knocking out some brick and mortar to install an external RJ45 wall mount I like the idea of the MP3. Any idea how many songs and light programs will fit on a 1mg SD card? I think my game camera has a 32mg if I need to scavenge.

If you have the N4-G3 {G4} MP3 Director I know the maximum SD card size is 32GB, but it MUST be a Kingston SD Card.  Other brands to to either not function correctly or at all.   When I first started I used the very first generation DC-MP3 Director, I used a 2GB SD Card in it {it would use up to 4GB}, but even a 1GB card would hold my Halloween show and then my Christmas show, Halloween had around 40-45 MP3's and Sequences, my Christmas show was pretty close to that as well.   Note this also included my Off Hours Daytime music for Halloween and then Christmas, my Off Hours Daytime music on the same card held somewhere near or close to 125+/- MP3 files and their associated sequences, Christmas was about the same. 

This year I will be using a Kingston 32GB SD Card, my Christmas off hours day music is now a combination of Spanish and English songs and instrumentals, and that is now at or just over 425+ songs with sequences {at last count, and I keep adding more}, but my actual Christmas show is about or somewhere currently around 50-60 MP3 files and sequences, again in both English and Spanish, many are still a Work-in-Progress and may not get them all done for my 2020 show.   And the shows will also have a couple of nights per week where it will only be Spanish or will only be English and other nights a combination.

So you should be able to get quite a bit on 1GB card, but I'd recommend a 2GB to 4GB SD Card for a minimum, and definitely a 32GB for future growth of your show for additions and more sequences and music.  Again, try and make sure you only us the Kingston brand SD Cards, I have yet to have any of the Kingston SD Cards not work in mine, but SanDisk and others have worked, but not properly.  Most issues with the SD Cards other than Kingston has been lights or props not working with the sequence, or the lights or props may work, but the music {MP3} may not play or may start and abruptly stop.   So it can be a real pain to troubleshoot and it will drive you crazy, because you wrote to the SD Card and it got written, but the Director doesn't tell you if it has any errors in reading the NON-Kingston SD Cards you might use.  So you think everything should work perfectly, but it doesn't always.   Sometimes you may get lucky and the NON-Kingston SD Card may work for quite a while, but eventually it'll fail on you.   So also ALWAYS have some spare back-up SD Cards just in case.

When I write my shows to an SD Card, I always write 2 SD Cards, this way I always have a working backup in case something happens to the one in my Director, just pop out and replace.  Then I reformat the SD Card that was in the Director and rewrite the show to it.  if it won't reformat, then I know it's time to destroy the SD Card because it's gone defective {but that usually doesn't happen}, it's rare and I've only had 2 SD Cards out of 10 go defective/bad in 10 years.   I also do this so if I add new sequences to my show as the season progresses I can just pop out the SD Card in the Director and plug in the new show.   If I only had a single SD Card, then my show would be shut down until I redid the new show settings and sequences on the SD Card.   So I have at least 2 SD Cards for back-up purposes or show updates and 1 SD Card that's in the Director running the show so I don't have to shut my show down for more than the time it takes to unplug and plug in the updated SD Card.

This is what I know that worked for me and how I do it, others may have differing opinions on what worked for them or the way they do it.

Good Luck!

 

 

Edited by Orville
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