REVISITED - Interesting Programming Discovery

[bob_moody]

In my original posting http://forums.lightorama.com/index.php?/topic/26693-interesting-programming-discovery/

I thought a had a handle on creating and sequencing a MegaTree that was NOT pixel based, and NOT RGB. But after spending some time, I have either messed up my Visualizer, My SuperStar or (as is most likely the case.. ) lost my mind ...

 

Here is the issue...

As stated in my original post, I created 8 3-channel bundles (fixtures) of incandesent  light strings. For example, the first bundle would look like this:

 

LOR CTRL-1 Channel-1 RED

LOR CTRL-1 Channel-9 GREEN

LOR CTRL-2 Channel-1 AMBER

 

These are not set as LED or as RGB in the definition. The Channel Type is set to "Normal"

 

So when I import this into SuperStar, I end up with 8 boxes, not 24 in the programming grid as discussed in the original post.

Now.. fast forward to the present.

 

When using a scene, you have the main Start/End colors. Here is what happens:

1. Turn on RED for some length of time and play it back ... The RED and the AMBER show to be turned on.

2. Turn on GREEN for some length of time and play it back... The GREEN comes on and appears exactly as expected.

3. Can not for the life of me figure out how to turn on the AMBER.

 

It almost acts like that when I turn on ONLY RED that RED and AMBER are coming on because they are on the same channel number in the same fixture regardless of the controller assignment(?)

 

Also SuperStar is pretty smart;  in my case, it wont let me assign a color that doesnt exist in its know pallet. What I mean is I cant turn on BLUE hoping it would turn on the AMBER string located at CTRL2,Channel1. It tells me there is RED and GREEN.

 

Bottom line is that either I have missed something completely or I cant create a tradtional megatree with bundled strings in SS.

 

I'm not sure how to approach SuperStar fixtures with multiple assigned channels if the only way to access them (the channels) of via color assignment and not the programming grid.

 

I can of course convert the fixtures over to RGB and keep in mind that I will have to use sliding color scale and treat each scale (R,G, as one channel.

OR..

Break up the 8 3-channel strings into 24 1-channel strings and approach from there.

 

Comments, suggestions??

 

Thanks for reading ..

 

Bob

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[BrianBruderer]

I'm glad you posted this. It points out some key things that SuperStar has to do in order to sequence non-RGB lights.

 

In Visualization mode, SuperStar has four color controls, Red, Green, Blue, and White. Ideally it would be nice to have a color control for each distinct color in your particular display, but currently SuperStar is limited to Red, Green, Blue or White. So when a visualization is imported SuperStar has to map each color to Red, Green, Blue or White. In your particular case Amber was mapped to Red because it is closer to red than it is to Green, Blue or White. But it means that Red and Amber both got mapped to the Red color control and you have no way to turn them on independently. It is a deficiency in the software, but the way to work around it is to create a special visualization for SuperStar. In the Visualizer, change all the Amber channels to Blue and then save the visualization with a name like "MyVisualization_forSuperStar.lee". Then import that visualization to SuperStar and then the blue color control will control all of your channels that were originally Amber. Unfortunately, that means that while sequencing in SuperStar all your Amber lights will appear blue. But when you export the sequence, you can play it from the Sequence Editor to your original visualization and you will be able to see the sequence with the Amber lights being Amber.

 

It would be nice if SuperStar allowed another way to differentiate between lights that are close to the same color such as Amber and Red, but currently you have to do the above to work around the problem.

[bob_moody]

Brian,

 

Thank you for the explination. I "thought" that was what was happening, but I see it only on the surface (not knowing how the code interprets issues).

I modified the Amber color to blue and it works exactly as described. Red controls red (LOR 1,1), Green controls green (LOR 1,9) and blue controls blue (amber - Lor 2,1). Turning on a Yellow for example give the Red and Green string. A pink color turns on the red and blue(amber) strings. I just modifed the vis files (same one you already have of mine).

 

Okay .. So I can work with this!!!

 

On a programming thought. Maybe if SuperStar knew that if the channel type is normal and there is more than one assigned channel in the fixture to it would actually generate a spaces in the programming grid for each channel. In my case, creating 8 "mega strings" of threee colors out of incans would have auto generated 24 squares in the programming grid. Programming in that scenario would basically be the same as 24 fixtures but with the speed and convienence of reducing the work to create it.

 

Thanks again Brian. Ewedaman!!!

 

Bob

[bob_moody]

Just a reflection on my current process....

 

In other posts Brian and I discussed creating all the elements in SuperStar and sequencing in one pass.

I found that it gets very crowded and very hard to go back and make corrections to a specific element. Additionally, those elements of the display that are normal, single color light elements have to be scripted with the color they are set for otherwise you cant turn them on. Take for example the 5 Bellagio Poles (firesticks .. whatever you want to call them) on my porch. These are 5 channels alternating between clear and some fixed color (red or green depending on the pole location).. so there is a LOR channel 1 - Clear, LOR channel 2 - Red, LOR channel 3 - Clear..etc etc. If you want to alternate the clear and color, you have to create a spefic event for each and change color on the pallet or it wont light up... This gets very time consuming and it creates a ton of events that get hard to find if you have to go back and edit something...

 

So.. on to step two... I copy the VIS file and drop all elements except the pixel and node elements... down to 4 elements now (about 1300+ channels... Still have to upgrade to 24 CCR... (big pocket book hit.. ) and it still feels awkward when trying to locate specific events for specific elements.. Argggggg X 2...

 

Step 3 .. okay .. I'm back to where I started .. I address and code each of the pixel and node elements seperately... This will obviously take more effort since now I'm looking at 5 passes through a song to get it sequenced.. 4 Pixel/node elements and then the rest of the display in Sequencer.... But .. now I can reduce the cost to an 8 CCR license (yes I do know the price break from 8 to 24 drops the price per channel basically in half).. and it makes it easier for me to approach the elements...

 

I'm guessing i have reached the level of mental midget with all of this. I just dont see it when all the elements are loaded in SS. Now.. I do still have a VIS with all the elements and once exported to sequencer, I should be able to view the whole thing...

 

I'm seeing other threads talking about adding a sweep like function (LSP??) to SS. I'll be very curious to see how that plays out. From what I can see so far it would be necessary that all your elements be laid out where they appear in the display. Once again, I have found it very difficult to make this happen becasue of how the grid arranges things when you import. Brian and I have had to modify my layout extensively to make everything fall in to the proper place and if you make a small change to the layout .. chances are your not going to get the results you expected back on the grid.

 

DO NOT get me wrong .. I've been a LOR customer since 1.x (2004/5) and I'm not bashing the product. I would guess that 90% of the issues I am experiencing are the programmer .. not the program ... but its just never clicked... SS is spot on for what it was "designed" to do... but like many others, I'm having difficulty trying to make it do what it wasnt.. and thats not the fault of Brian, LOR or SS.

 

dazed and confused .... Bob

[BrianBruderer]

Thanks for the comments. Some of the goals I had with sequencing with a visualation were:

 

1) Be able to click on a light instead of a channel so you don't have to memorize what channels go to what lights in a huge grid in the sequence editor

2) Be able to select two or more squares on the sequencing grid and do an effect of a particular color and all the lights of that color are used. Especially for displays that have, say, red, green and white lights at many places, it makes coordinating those colors very easy.

3) Modification of effects can be easier. If you have an effect on the sequencing grid, you may change you mind and use that same effect on a different group of lights. The location of the effect stays the say, you just change the location.

 

Bob has also pointed out some challenges that exist with sequencing an imported visualization. By August I expect to add the ability to do a morph using coordinates on the visualization instead of coordinates on the sequencing grid. In other words, you mark the beginning and end of the morph on the visualization itself. This allows an easy way to do a coordinated sweep across the display. Besides adding the "visualization morph" feature, I need to add a way for you to easily specify where you want each light to be on the sequencing grid because as Bob has pointed out, currently if you don't like how the lights are mapped to the sequencing grid you have to move the lights around to change how they are mapped. What is needed is to be able to place the lights in their actual locations and still have them map the way you want onto the sequencing grid.

 

Another comment, and Bob may already be doing this, but he described the challenges of sequencing a group of individual lights where each light is at a different location and some are clear and some are colored.  Realize that you can select the entire group and set the color you want and all the lights of that color will light. You can do a morph across those lights of a particular color and it will do a sweep of all the lights of that color. 

[bob_moody]

Brian, Thanks for the feedback. I hope you did read that was wasnt bashing you, SS or LOR.

I do appreciate all the help you have given me in the past.

I'm pretty sure it will do exactly what we have talked about, but as of now ... I'm just not seeing it .

Bob