When adding more controllers...

[John Slade]

Hello all! With the first year behind me, I'm looking to add 3-4 more controllers to my display and I'm a little confused... I'd like to add some blue strings throughout the enitre display, ie: windows,roof,mega tree,mini trees, and some snowflakes on the roof and I'm not sure what would be the best way to go about this.

Do I have to rearrange all the channels or is there an "easy button" within S3 that does this for me in a blink of an eye?? :D:D

How is everyone dealing with this predicament? Thanks in advance for any input!

[Don]

Well, the software won't rearrange channels for you, you get to move them around yourself.

After adding the channels, move them around in a such manner that you think you can work with. There is no "one" way to arrange the channels ... what makes sense to you might not to someone else.

[George Simmons]

John,

First of all, I'm presuming that you're already using S3. If you aren't, there are an awful lot of reasons why I personally believe you should.

My recommendation is to use two tracks. Track one is your MASTER track and track 2 is your WORKING track. (If you have CCRs, then I suggest making Track 2 your CCR track and making track 3 the WORKING track.)

The MASTER track should contain every existing channel that you have right now. It doesn't really matter what order they are in. If you only have one track in your 2011 sequences then you're already there. As you add more channels in the future, add those new channels to the bottom of the list - always to the bottom of the list - no exceptions! (This will allow you to quickly, easily, and accurately copy your new configuration each year into existing sequences to upgrade them.)

Then, copy each channel that's in the MASTER track into the working track. Once you have the channels copied, you can then create groups and/or move those channels around in the WORKING track any way you want them for the easiest sequencing. No matter how you move or group the channels in the WORKING track, the channel order in the MASTER will remain unchanged.

IMPORTANT - copy the channels - DO NOT DUPLICATE THE TRACK! Duplicating the track will cause problems you very definitely do not want.

If you have questions or if I've totally confused you, please PM me with your phone number and I'll go over it with you. It's one of those things where it's actually easier to do than it is to explain.

[George Simmons]

George Simmons wrote:

The MASTER track should contain every existing channel that you have right now. It doesn't really matter what order they are in. If you only have one track in your 2011 sequences then you're already there. As you add more channels in the future, add those new channels to the bottom of the list - always to the bottom of the list - no exceptions! (This will allow you to quickly, easily, and accurately copy your new configuration each year into existing sequences to upgrade them.)

Sorry - this would be a whole lot easier if a person could edit their posts...

What I meant to include immediately following the above is: Once you have added channels to the MASTER track is it CRITICALLY IMPORTANT that those channels NEVER EVER get moved around. NEVER!

[Mark h2o]

That sounds like some quality advice George.

Got a question along your multiple track advice, if your working on a track with only a portion of the channels for one feature, will the visualizer show only those channels when you play back or will all other tracks that have data in that song also show up when watching the play back?

[George Simmons]

I would expect that the Visualizer will show any/all lighting effects that have been programmed into every channel that's been assigned to a fixture or prop, regardless of which track or group you might be working with at any given time.

[dgrant]

Question regarding tracks: When I hear the word "track", I'm thinking music tracks. Adding tracks, master track and so on, isn't making a lot of sense. Even though I've only got two controllers at this moment, I'm writing sequences for 5 controllers using the visualizer as my testbed. When I added the extra channels, I got a small expanision "+" symbol and all the commands in the world, doesn't make it go away other than selecting the "+" and it'll expand while I make changes there but that's it. I'm going to buy three more controllers, one for two 8-channel arches and two for a 32 channel mega-tree. The arches will be a single color this first time out and the tree will be 32 strings of multi led's.

So, tracks...can someone please define exactly what they are. I don't wish to accidently trash all the sequencing work I've done so far.

[Don]

dgrant,

This article has *not* been reviewed/updated since S3 came out, however, it should give you a pretty good idea of what tracks, within Light-O-Rama, are, and one way they can be used.

[jimswinder]

dgrant wrote:

Question regarding tracks: When I hear the word "track", I'm thinking music tracks. Adding tracks, master track and so on, isn't making a lot of sense. Even though I've only got two controllers at this moment, I'm writing sequences for 5 controllers using the visualizer as my testbed. When I added the extra channels, I got a small expanision "+" symbol and all the commands in the world, doesn't make it go away other than selecting the "+" and it'll expand while I make changes there but that's it. I'm going to buy three more controllers, one for two 8-channel arches and two for a 32 channel mega-tree. The arches will be a single color this first time out and the tree will be 32 strings of multi led's.

So, tracks...can someone please define exactly what they are. I don't wish to accidently trash all the sequencing work I've done so far.

I thought the same thing several year ago...that "tracks" were Audio and I was thinking, why would someone want different "audio tracks" in their sequence???

To me, "tracks" were just different ways to group your channels...at least back with S2.

Now for me, I don't see a need for any tracks and I just use the "groups".

Where I had different tracks, such as for my "Mini Trees", "Mini Arches", "Mega Arches", Mega Tree" etc (which was a to scroll from the top track to the bottom track since I had over 500 channels)...I now just have groups and when they are cpollapsesd, they all fit on the screen.

But like a lot of things in the LOR software, there is more than one "correct" way to use it...you just gotta experiment and find the way that works best for you and your display.

[jimswinder]

DAMN NON-EDIT BUTTON!!!!!

dgrant wrote:

Question regarding tracks: When I hear the word "track", I'm thinking music tracks. Adding tracks, master track and so on, isn't making a lot of sense. Even though I've only got two controllers at this moment, I'm writing sequences for 5 controllers using the visualizer as my testbed. When I added the extra channels, I got a small expanision "+" symbol and all the commands in the world, doesn't make it go away other than selecting the "+" and it'll expand while I make changes there but that's it. I'm going to buy three more controllers, one for two 8-channel arches and two for a 32 channel mega-tree. The arches will be a single color this first time out and the tree will be 32 strings of multi led's.

So, tracks...can someone please define exactly what they are. I don't wish to accidently trash all the sequencing work I've done so far.

I thought the same thing several year ago...that "tracks" were Audio and I was thinking, why would someone want different "audio tracks" in their sequence???

To me, "tracks" were just different ways to group your channels...at least back with S2.

Now for me with S3, I don't see a need for any tracks and I just use the "groups".

Where I had different tracks, such as for my "Mini Trees", "Mini Arches", "Mega Arches", Mega Tree" etc (which was a PAIN to scroll from the top track to the bottom track since I had over 500 channels)...I now just have groups and when they are collapsed, they all fit on the screen.

But like a lot of things in the LOR software, there is more than one "correct" way to use it...you just gotta experiment and find the way that works best for you and your display.

[Guest guest]

dgrant wrote:

Question regarding tracks: When I hear the word "track", I'm thinking music tracks. Adding tracks, master track and so on, isn't making a lot of sense. Even though I've only got two controllers at this moment, I'm writing sequences for 5 controllers using the visualizer as my testbed. When I added the extra channels, I got a small expanision "+" symbol and all the commands in the world, doesn't make it go away other than selecting the "+" and it'll expand while I make changes there but that's it. I'm going to buy three more controllers, one for two 8-channel arches and two for a 32 channel mega-tree. The arches will be a single color this first time out and the tree will be 32 strings of multi led's.

So, tracks...can someone please define exactly what they are. I don't wish to accidently trash all the sequencing work I've done so far.

I think the best way to SEE what tracks are is to download a sequence that was set up in tracks:

Here's one of my Halloween 2011 sequences, the MP3 is not included, but you can still load it into the LOR Sequence Editor and see EXACTLY how tracks are used.




Attached files 18 Wake the Dead.lms

[jimswinder]

Orville wrote:

but you can still load it into the LOR Sequence Editor and see EXACTLY how tracks are used.

not to sound mean Orville...but all this shows is how exactly YOU use tracks...

[Guest guest]

jimswinder wrote:

Orville wrote:

but you can still load it into the LOR Sequence Editor and see EXACTLY how tracks are used.

not to sound mean Orville...but all this shows is how exactly YOU use tracks...

Jim, you're not sounding mean, that is a valid point, however, I only gave this so the person can get an IDEA as to what tracks are and how some of us use them.


Everyone uses tracks differently. I don't use a "master track", see no need for it, waste of space in my opinion, but that IS MY opinion, not others.

I just gave them ONE example so they could see how tracks are set up in the SE, it was just an EXAMPLE, nothing more and nothing less.

However, most sequences I have downloaded from others were also in the same type form I use, no master track either. So I'm NOT the only one that was using tracks in the way MY EXAMPLE is set up for download.

All I was and am conveying is it is easier to UNDERSTAND something if you can see how someone, ANYONE, else has used the method.


And I won't even use groups, that created nothing but issues for a lot of folks from what I've read around the forums. I'll stick with my tracks set up, it works, and it works well for my use and display.

[jimswinder]

how I used groups...


Attached files Groups.zip

[Guest guest]

jimswinder wrote:

how I used groups...

Very interesting. Not sure I'll use groups or stick to tracks, probably stick to tracks for now.

I just don't think my display is large enough to warrant the grouping option, at least not yet.

[jimswinder]

Orville wrote:

I just don't think my display is large enough to warrant the grouping option, at least not yet.

what better time to start using it then...BEFORE your display gets out of hand!!!

[George Simmons]

Orville wrote:

I don't use a "master track", see no need for it, waste of space in my opinion...

I said the same thing my first two years. By my third year, as my channel count exceeded 300 and I was spending almost an hour each sequence just updating the configuration, I came to realize just how stupid my ignorance was. The OP was asking for the EASIEST way to manage expansion and having done it both ways, I shared what my experience has so clearly taught me.

And I won't even use groups, that created nothing but issues for a lot of folks from what I've read around the forums. I'll stick with my tracks set up, it works, and it works well for my use and display.

To each his own... I'm sure there were cavemen who didn't like fire at first because it was too bright for them. Have you ever wished there was an easier and quicker way to move two tracks side by side for sequencing? There is. Have you ever copied an updated config into a sequence that didn't have its tracks in exactly the same order and wished there was a better way as you were spending the next hour undoing the mess you just made? There is. Have you ever wished there was a way to show more channels and only one waveform on your screen at once? There is. It's called Groups.

[TJ Hvasta]

caveman? Caveman?? DID YOU SAY CAVEMAN??!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJjugYO_9JM

[John Slade]

Tons of Great info here!!
George, yes I'm using S3 and just started playing with the group function. No ccr's as of now, my soon to be 4 color mega tree is now in one group. The Arches are in one group...
I understand "Tracks" and I get the MASTER list but what if I only need, say, 2 channels over on the west side of the yard, and 2 in the middle? Now, if I add 2 controllers on the west side of the yard I can see just adding the 2 new controllers to the bottom of the list and grouping accordingly. But for just a few channels...Maybe I'm really looking for justification on adding more elements on the west side just to avoid moving channels around!

Orville, I was also using tracks in a similar fashion. All White in one track, green in another.... now it looks easier to group them.

Jim, Nice sample of group usage!!! Talk about Channel overload! Geez!!
The channels seem to be NEVER ENDING! Can't imagine sequencing those (YET)!:D

Wud up Teege!! If the caveman can do it, well then...LOL

[Steven]

jimswinder wrote:

Now for me with S3, I don't see a need for any tracks and I just use the "groups".

Groups are very nice, and are a good thing to use instead of the "grouping" feature of tracks (similar to the way the "Timings" feature replaced the usefulness of that part of the track feature in early-S2), but the OP's issue is one thing that is solved by tracks and nothing else.

And that is the ability to add controllers and/or rearrange channels from one year to the next, and implement the changes by simply importing a new configuration.

In this case, John added a new controller with blue channels, and wanted to preserve the existing sequences while inserting the blue channels in the appropriate places. It would be nearly impossible to do that easily without using a second track.