USB Adapter

[MrTechie]

Hey All!

New kid on the block here, just got my first controller the other day. I ordered the software as well and thought - I got one of those connectors - and didnt get the adapter from LOR.

Come to find out - I can't find it. But before I go and buy one, I want to just make sure it is what I think it is.

My laptop is what I intend on using for the source of the show. It's a CQ50 (Compaq). 2.4 Dual Core, 3gig of ram - and running Vista Home.

But I noticed in the device manager there were no 'Com Ports' listed. But when I fire up LOR and check I do see a 'com 3' listed there. Im a bit confused - especially since I don't even have anything plugged in yet (to the laptop)

So here's my question (2 parts)
1.) I am just picking up a standard USB to Cat5 adapter correct?
2.) When I get it and plug it in and hook up the box, is it presumed that
Vista and LOR Software will create the "Virtual Com" port and things will be good?

I've seen the post about FTClean and have that already download should
it need to happen.

What I just absolutely want to make certain is that the adapter to use
for the usb is just a standard usb to cat5.

Please dont refer me to the RS485 because no where can I find a pic
of what the back side of that thing looks like.

Thanks guys and Im excited to be aboard!

[Don]

MrTechie wrote:

So here's my question (2 parts)
1.) I am just picking up a standard USB to Cat5 adapter correct?
2.) When I get it and plug it in and hook up the box, is it presumed that
Vista and LOR Software will create the "Virtual Com" port and things will be good?

1) No.
2) When you install the software/drivers for the US485 adapter, the ports will be there.

It's not a standard USB to CAT5. LOR uses the RS485 standard, so you would need an adapter/converter that was designed for use with RS485 equipment.

Ps. A picture of the adapter: http://lightorama.com/PDF/RS485_Adapters.pdf

[MrTechie]

Don,

Thanks for your speedy reply. So again, I presume the backside of that adapter, the RJ45 side of it - is the female side of cat5?

Any ideas where I could pick one up - beside LOR or online?

[Don]

Correct. Double RJ45 on the other side, both female.

As for picking one up, other than LOR, I don't know that information. (I've simply never researched it.)

I'm sure they are out there, though.

[MrTechie]

Even for the mini-usb to 485?

That has a double cat5 female?

Maybe I am a bit confused.

On the board itself there is a phone plug and then two
plugs for cat5. Are both slots linked up for the cat5 or
just one while using the LOR software?

[MrTechie]

And why does it seem like every single pic I look at for the mini-usb to RJ45
all seem to have a usb on one side and a 9 pin connector on the other side?

[Don]

Few things here.

1) Mini USB has only one RJ45 connection on the other end.

2) There are three products listed on that page from the PDF in my earlier reply. Mini-USB to RJ45, 9-pin serial to RJ45 and USB-B to double RJ45.

3) On the controller you have 1 RJ11 and 2 RJ45 connectors. Assuming that you will use all CAT5 (or higher) in your display, you will not use the RJ11 at all. The CAT5 is used to get the commands to the next controller. (Think of it as a really old token ring network.) It does not matter which port you use for "in" or "out" so long as all controllers in your display are connected together.

[MrTechie]

Ok so taking that back into account then,
isnt the USB485 Mini-USB to RJ45 just a
standard USB to Cat5 female connection then?

In the example you showed me in the pdf,
I want to get one like the picture in the top left.

Being a computer geek - to me that looks like
just a standard mini usb to a cat5 connection
that passes data along like an ethernet connection.

Unless I am wrong - and if I am - please tell me.

[Don]

MrTechie wrote:

Ok so taking that back into account then,
isnt the USB485 Mini-USB to RJ45 just a
standard USB to Cat5 female connection then?

In the example you showed me in the pdf,
I want to get one like the picture in the top left.

Being a computer geek - to me that looks like
just a standard mini usb to a cat5 connection
that passes data along like an ethernet connection.

Unless I am wrong - and if I am - please tell me.

You're wrong.

It's not a standard USB<->RJ45. You have to take into account the RS485 standard. The adapters that LOR (and others) sell were designed to convert the signal to a RJ45 based connection. (Keeping in mind the RJ45 is what's on the boards.)

Since your a techie, go ahead and throw out any thoughts of ethernet here. The only thing that is similar is the CAT5/RJ45. It does not use ethernet based technologies.

[MrTechie]

Understood and respected. Thanks for the clarification.
It looks like a duck... quacks like a duck... 'get the shot gun?'

Anyrate, I'd love to go and 'pick' one up and not have
to order it online. So if anyone reading this could chime
in as to where it may be found - that would be great!

Maybe places like Best Buy, Staples, Walmart, A Cell Phone store...

[kzaas]

You will not find these in any standard stores like Walmart or cell phone stores. It could be possible at some place like Fryes Electronics, But your best bet is ordering it online and the cheapest price I have seen is at Light-O-Rama.com.

[Dave Batzdorf]

The device should be procured from LOR. If it means a lot to you and the shows are very important get a spare. It is a single point of failure, not that they fail all that often. But my IT background told me to get a spare!

[MrTechie]

LOL Thanks Dave, but what I am finding out is
two things...

1.) "I got one of those.." turned into "Where is it?"
2.) "It looks like.." turned into "Cameleon!"

So Im trying to avoid the 5 - 7 days of LOR sending
me one and pick one up somewhere.

Hey - Im just a newbie! Im gonna make the mistakes

[Paul Roberson]

I hate to disagree with everyone here, but....... I disagree.

I bought a usb to 485 converter/isolator off ebay and wired it up and it worked just fine.

Here is a quote from an email with Dan about how the pins are set up with LOR.

"With LOR the center 2 pins (4&5) are 485 + and -, Pins 3&6 are ground and +10V. The RJ45 to XLR diagram shows which is ground. It does not hurt anything to connect the 485 lines backwards, it just will not work and you can try the other way."

So if you get a converter that has the 485 + and - identified on it or you can figure it out it will work....

So what I am saying is you can get any usb to 485 converter and if you wire your cat5 where the 485 + and - are on pins 4 and 5 going into your LOR controller it will work.

Although I do recommend getting one from LOR.

[MrTechie]

Thanks for your input Paul.

It's interesting too, because I have a huge spool
of Cat5 that I usually add the ends to myself. And
when I was looking around for the adapter, I saw
a USB with the screw downs for the wires on the
end of the Cat5.

Now my only two reasons I didn't just get that
is because:

1.) Not sure of the wiring setup
2.) Exposure. Don't know how I fee about the
ends of the cat5 just screwed into the usb like that.

But interesting to know tho!

Hey Guys - I appreciate all your input and guiding
me along the way. I finally just broke down and
called Mary - and she was nice enough to just 'send' me
one. So it's on it's way. COME ON UPS!

[Paul Roberson]

MrTechie wrote:

snip

Now my only two reasons I didn't just get that
is because:

1.) Not sure of the wiring setup
2.) Exposure. Don't know how I fee about the
ends of the cat5 just screwed into the usb like that.

But interesting to know tho!

snip

If you tried that route I would suggest that you actually wired in a rj45 connector and mount the two to something. That way you could just plug in a cat5 cable.

Glad to here you have one on the way from LOR.

[MrTechie]

Well I will pick another one up along the way, right now it's just like a kid in a candy shop who wants to get his new toy working!

I so appreciate that you guys are very informative and helpful. I know I will
get there someday, just still a bit 'nervous' about jumping in is all...

I've been watching these forums for a while, and reading up on software
and sequencing and things for about 6 to 8 months. Just been a spectator
for that time tho.

[gizmomkr]

Forwhatever its worth - Im with Paul on this one.

I had some other stuff lying around that used RS485, so I got the pin outs, and hooked it to my lor controller, and it DID WORK FINE.

I know I got the adapter off e-bay for about 20.00

I have a pic of it in this thread http://lightorama.mywowbb.com/view_topic.php?id=22471&forum_id=84&highlight=generic+rs485

The reason MrTechie's adapters are no-go is the guts - Cat-5 to screw terminals or Db-9 - or anything - Its just a connector. They are all simply pieces of metal. They have no brain inside.

The LOR adapter has a chip inside that converts the signal from usb-to-RS485 (actualy I think it goes USB->rs232->rs485 just in one small pcb)

LOR is NOT the only one who makes a rs485 adapter.

Having said all that - I went and bought the LOR one anyway because it came in the starter kit, and I had to have the showtime software.


The stuff you see thats in the local PC shop with Cat-5 to DB9 type connectors are quite comon for "dumb terminals" Back in the day a lot of warehouse systems, and fast food systems would use Serial Terminals with very limited hardware that make a serial connection back to a larger server with all the data. Most of the stuff is long gone, but a handfull of fast food joints still have some of it around. Very popular for POS installs. Cat-5 cable became really popular and really cheap, so these adapters made it easy to run OLD JUNK on NEW WIRE.

The Marriott Hotell chain has a brick full of those things at every hotel to connect the hotel server to all the various things that BILL you (the phone system, the video on demand system, the mini bar, the internet) everything uses that serial adapter and a connection to an old IBM mainframe to run your hotel bill.