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Marty Belisle

CCR Issues with multiple networks

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I have 3 networks, Regular, 500k enhanced and DMX. All programmed with PE.   I have 7 CCRs and 4 CCBs on my 500k network.  No issues with the CCBs. 4 of the CCRs seem to act up at random times during my show/sequences.  Random parts of the ribbon at different times seem to play different parts of another sequence?  Its like the CCR has maintained a memory and just plays part of it or that I'm getting some sort of interference? I can unplug the CCR and it seems to reset and resume correctly for a few songs.  I checked the verifier could not see anything unusual.  I do have a CCR Controller/Power supply in a plastic tote along with 2 CCB controllers and a E1.31 DMX controller/power supply.  This CCR is the first one in the daisy chain in the 4 that are acting up.  Its weird I have watched my complete show a number of times with no issues and than every once and a while one of the CCRs acts up.  Is it possible that I am creating some sort of interference with having my CCR controller in the same container with my CCB, DMX controller / power supply?  Could it be a CCR Firmware issue?  Looking for some troubleshooting ideas, thanks.

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I think I found my problem.   I had a cat 5 cable in my high speed network that was not seated completely.  I also adjusted all my pixel editor sequences and turned off the lights a split second before the end of the sequence and removed my CCR/CCB controllers from the plastic tote they were in with my DMX controller/power supply.   Ran for two nights  no longer seen the issue. 

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Still fighting with some random playing in a few of my CCRs.  Went through all my Cat 5 connections and verified dry and seated.  Moved all Cat 5 away from power cords. Replaced my high speed USB485 adaptor. I am using power bars to power many of my devices?  Is it possible that the power source is causing grief?  I had the very same set up in this network last year with no issues  Only change is Pixel editor sequencing and what have plugged into the power bars. If I unplug the CCR and  plug back in it runs fine for an hour or so?  Open to suggestions thanks.

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don't own CCRs or use PE but ,,,,,,. Is it always from the one CCR controller? same one everytime?

Edited by saxon

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Were you able to upgrade your CCR firmware back in January?

That's where I would start

.

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Yes I recall updating the firmware in all my CCRs last spring. I will double check it is the latest.  One particular seems to act up more than others and I have a spare controller so I will replace it.  Now that Halloween is over I will reroute some Cat 5 cable and power supply cables to reduce the chance of interference.  The problem is so intermittent on random CCRs its tough to troubleshoot.  Thanks for the suggestions.

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Man still can't figure out what is going on.  My CCRs continue to act up random flash.  Show plays great for a few songs than a glitch shows up like a memory in one of the ribbons.  I reset the ribbon and it works fine for a song or two than the issue creeps back in another ribbon.  Sometimes I get random flashing in the ribbon even after the show has gone to bed.  Updated firmware, separated the power cables from the Cat 5 cables, added a terminator to my last CCR, swapped controllers, replaced controllers.... just can't figure it out. 

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Running 3 networks a low speed for LOR residential controllers, high speed for my CCRs and CCBs and a E131 for my pixel tree, matrix and pixel screen. 

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I often don't know what I think I do, but it sounds to me like a data transmission issue.  

How about using that extra high-speed USB to add another network.  One high speed LOR network *should* be able to handle the load, but if you've got the goods right there, it is definitely something you can easily rule out.

Edited by George Simmons

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In show editor clean up seguences i had an issue similar and cleaned up and it worked maybe it will help 

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Hey yes George maybe I will split my enhanced network as if it doesn't fix it will help to isolate where I might have a connection issue.  Plan on replacing some more Cat 5 cable on Sunday when the temps get a little warmer.  Stupid cold right now -35 C, -31 F.  I can't touch nothing without it breaking in my hands. The challenges of the Canadian North eh!

Derkngoogly I have not been using a cleanup sequence.  I have 12 musical sequences and run a filler ever third song.  I have had great success for an hour or two when I disable my show and unload light o rama.  Not really sure how the cleanup sequence could help? 

 

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split your CCR's into 2 networks- run at 500k and make sure your setting are right and using the high speed adapter- should look beautiful then....

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This might be a dumb question, but what is or a "Clean Up" sequence do?

Most / if not all of my sequences have some sort of a to "0" / off for all circuits.

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Temps warmed up and I ran some new Cat 5 avoiding as much power sources or other Cat 5 as possible.  Ran my show Sunday night with no change.  Weird sequence memory starting showing up about 2 hours into the show.  Cycled the power on the affected CCR and this issue went a way for a few songs and than would show back up looking a little different.  Sometimes the issue moved up the Network into another CCR.  Monday I split my high speed network into two enhanced networks using another high speed adapter.  Net A 3 x CCBs, 3 x CCRs ran flawlessly (these ribbons and CCRs have been running great all along, first half of the network).  Network B (second half of my original network, problem CCRs) 4 x CCRs, 8x10w RGB floods, 1 x CCB.  Same problem occurred in the last CCR on this network about 2 hours into the show.  Random flashing that appeared to be consistent with another sequence?  I did not touch this CCR and let it play out to avoid this issuing transferring as it is not too noticeable)  This particular CCR continued to play 1 hour after the show schedule was completed.  I needed to disable the schedule and unload my control panel to get it to quit.  I did install terminators at the end of each network to prevent reflection.  The more I trouble shoot the more I believe the issue is with software and the communication to the controllers that seems to only be affecting my CCRs further down the line only after the show has played for a couple of hours.  All of these devices ran flawlessly last year all on the same network.  Its a head scratcher. 

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Sorry to hear about the problems.  I'm frustrated just hearing about it as your display is really nice.  I saw a post today where a CF50D flood was causing random flashing in CCR controllers on the network.  I know you have the 10W floods but have you tried disconnecting them and run the show?  Or even try disconnecting other units.  With that seriously COLD weather it has to be a pain to troubleshoot.

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Thanks BYRG.  Good idea to bypass my floods as most would not realize they are not playing and they happen to be located at the start of the network where I have been having the problems.  I did have to update the firmware on them at Halloween to get them to work with the enhanced network.  Will let you know how it works out after tonight.

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Good news.  Bypassed my floods controller last night and from what I could see the show ran flawlessly with no issues.  Hope to reroute some Cat 5 and put the floods at the end of the Network with a terminator to see if it will make a difference. Fingers crossed having this controller at the end of the Network will keep the Gremlins from creeping back into the CCRs.  Thanks a ton BYRG for the suggestion. 

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1 hour ago, Marty Belisle said:

Good news.  Bypassed my floods controller last night and from what I could see the show ran flawlessly with no issues.  Hope to reroute some Cat 5 and put the floods at the end of the Network with a terminator to see if it will make a difference. Fingers crossed having this controller at the end of the Network will keep the Gremlins from creeping back into the CCRs.  Thanks a ton BYRG for the suggestion. 

Sometimes these forums do help out with the exchange of information.  Glad to hear back to no issues but weird with the floods though.

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I'm just setting up 4 of the CF50 floods and after reading through these forums kind of expected to have trouble with the CAT 5 connections.  Sure enough out of the 8 pigtails, 2 of the pigtails won't pass a signal through and 1 is shorted out completely.  When I hook anything to the last pigtail it takes out all of the floods...

Since I have two of the floods with bad connectors I can only set up 3 of the floods until I fix the pigtails.  I've never made Cat 5 cable or put ends on before but due to how they are routed through the casing, the only option is to put a new end on, or build a whole new cable anyway.  I'll be heading to the store tomorrow to see if I can buy a good terminating/crimping tool for Cat5. 

Any suggestions on technique in building a Cat5 end? 

I'd bet Marty has a bad pigtail connection in some way...  One of these floods was very intermittent at first, but wrong colors, off timing, etc.  But when I started wiggling the pigtail it went away completely and hasn't come back.  I was able to restore signal to the flood by disconnecting that pigtail entirely from the unit, as it was the one that was shorting and taking out the rest of the floods.  But while I can make that one work now, since the other flood has a bad pigtail, I don't have a way to daisy chain the fourth... 

This is the first RGB I have added.  I was strictly 48 channels of LEDs prior to this so I just daisy chained out of the CTB16PC but I don't have an extra port out to run to the 4th flood. 

Is it possible to use a switch or splitter with a usb/458 LOR dongle? 

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Cat 5 cables are easy to build a little tedious but simple.  Suggest you print a large wire color code chart and that a good quality tester is a must.  Crimping the ends is one thing but being able to verify that you a secure correct flawless connection is a must.  I had bought a kit on amazon that came with a handful of connections that seems to work good.  My 10 watt dumb RGB system is using the LOR CMB24D controller that has worked flawlessly for the past number of years.  I moved it to the end of my Network and added a terminator where I would normally daisy chain the next device.  Show ran great last night, not sure if it was coincidence or if it was my controller creating reflection or memory down the line?  May be an issue with the new firmware for an enhance network or a bug as a result of my S4 upgrade and Pixel editor use?  Either way I'm good with the work around as show season is here and folks are lined up to watch the display. 

No I do not believe you can use a splitter or a switch with a USB485 dongle.  From what I understand a repeater may be an option once one becomes available for an high speed enhanced network.  Good luck whyintheworld, welcome to the madness. 

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I had to order the tester and crimping tool kit as I've not played around with the cables before.  It is almost just as cheap to order them online these days.  But with the way the CF50D case is, I can't pass a pre-made cable through to hook it up.  Last night was the first night running the three floods.  WOW are they bright.  I need to relocate them just slightly as the inside of our house became a disco even with the blinds closed.  :D

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Put my CMB24D at the end of the network and added a terminator.  Show has ran perfect for two nights.  Feeling confident the problem is solved. :D

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