Dumb ribbon RJ45 extensions

[Brucey]

In trying to figure out the best way to extend the cables from the CMB24D to the dumb ribbons, I've tried a number of different cable combinations without success.  I tried 16/4 and 18/4 but those were too thick for the solder points so I was thinking of using RJ45 as a test. 

My longest run will be about 50-60', just wondering if anyone has any suggestions on this?  I went through some of the old threads and it looks like some people have had success with it, just not sure and didn't want to fry the ribbon...

Thanks

[Mr. P]

For that long of a run I wouldn't go any smaller than the 18 awg wire or you are looking at too much voltage drop. RJ45 is 22-24 awg and at that distance you will have issues.

Calculate the voltage drop:

http://www.calculator.net/voltage-drop-calculator.html

Edited September 4, 2016 by Mr. P

[Brucey]

Then maybe it 's the type of wire I got, but even by tinning the ends, the 18/4 is still too big to properly fit on the end of the ribbons.

 

I'm trying to not have to buy the $7/each extensions but may have no choice.

[k6ccc]

I'm mostly using 16 and 18 gauge.  One tip to help keep the wires apart. Most of the strips have solder pads for each position on both the top and bottom of the strip.  Alternate the wires.  For example, if your strip has the solder pads in this order: +12, Red, Green, Blue, you could solder the +12 and Green to the top of the strip and the Red and Blue to the bottom of the strip.  Gives a little extra working space.  Second tip is that you can also add a short pigtail of smaller wire to make the connection to the strip, and then solder your larger wire to the end of the pigtail.  That way you are not soldering your larger wire to the strip.  It adds some work, but especially if you need the long run to the controller to be a fairly large gauge,it avoids having the solder large wire to the strips.  Also less likely to pull the solder pad off the strip while handling.  For example if you had three 5 meter strips that are all on the same RGB channels and all three start at the same location, but are 100 feet from the controller, you could solder a pigtail from each strip of 18 or 20 gauge, and then connect the pigtails to 12 or 14 gauge to the controller.

BTW, if you do use Cat-5 cable (and I'm with Mr. P in recommending against it), make sure to use stranded cable rather than solid.  Solid is more likely to break during handling.

 

[Brucey]

Thanks the tip of using the top and bottoms. I saw the pads on the bottom but wasn't sure if I could do the alternating pattern. Maybe I'll try that again using the 16/4 as I'd rather have the larger cable from the ribbon to the controller. 

[k6ccc]

16 gauge is fairly easy with the alternating pattern.  Just have to be steady and have a small tipped iron.

 

[Brucey]

3 minutes ago, k6ccc said:

16 gauge is fairly easy with the alternating pattern.  Just have to be steady and have a small tipped iron.

 

Agreed, I just couldn't get the 16 all on one side.  

 

Looks like I have a project for when the kids and wife go to sleep tonight to give it a try. 

[k6ccc]

16 on one side is tough - possible, but tough.  If all else fails, use the pigtail method I mentioned several poses above.

 

[Ebuechner]

I would do the pigtail method if it was me. Also I solder to the second set of pads in from the end of the strip on the bottom and run my wire out from there I find it's less likely to break the pads while handling.

[k6ccc]

1 hour ago, Ebuechner said:

Also I solder to the second set of pads in from the end of the strip on the bottom and run my wire out from there I find it's less likely to break the pads while handling.

Good idea!  Obviously only for dumb strips - although you only need to apply the data to the first strip on smart strips...You could apply power and ground at the joint between the first and second pixels...

 

[Brucey]

4 hours ago, k6ccc said:

 Second tip is that you can also add a short pigtail of smaller wire to make the connection to the strip, and then solder your larger wire to the end of the pigtail.  That way you are not soldering your larger wire to the strip.  It adds some work, but especially if you need the long run to the controller to be a fairly large gauge,it avoids having the solder large wire to the strips.  Also less likely to pull the solder pad off the strip while handling. 

So in the example above, solder 18 to the strip, and then after a short distance, use wire nuts/solder then connect the 18 to 16?

[k6ccc]

2 minutes ago, Brucey said:

So in the example above, solder 18 to the strip, and then after a short distance, use wire nuts/solder then connect the 18 to 16?

Under normal circumstances, there would not be much point in going with 18 gauge pigtails if you are using 18 gauge wire to the controller.  However you might use 20 or even 22 gauge pigtails connected to 14 or 16 gauge wire to the controller.  In the photo below, the two ends of the strip both have a pigtail that goes into the 4x4x4 electrical box where both are connected to the cable that goes to the controller.  In this case, it is the same gauge wire, but I wanted to connect to both ends of the strip (and they are right next to each other so it was EASY!).  In the box, I am using standard electrical wire nuts to connect the wires together.  In this case it's only 12 feet of conduit from this box to the cabinet where the controller is located.

 

 

[Mr. P]

Most dumb ribbons come with a pigtail and a 4-pin connector on the end, unless you cut the ribbon. What I do is purchase these:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00D0Y8SG6/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pd_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=61DMUXRRSCM3&coliid=I3PJZ9KJ1XHV6D

and solder them to the end of my extension wire and then plug them into my lights. This way I can unplug my extension wires from my lights and pack them up separately.

 

[Brucey]

35 minutes ago, Mr. P said:

Most dumb ribbons come with a pigtail and a 4-pin connector on the end, unless you cut the ribbon. What I do is purchase these:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00D0Y8SG6/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pd_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=61DMUXRRSCM3&coliid=I3PJZ9KJ1XHV6D

and solder them to the end of my extension wire and then plug them into my lights. This way I can unplug my extension wires from my lights and pack them up separately.

 

So you cut the 4 pin connector off already connected to the ribbon but leave the wire intact then you insert those wires, after stripping them, into the holes in this accessory and the other side is then solvered onto the extension cable?  Instead of soldering the other side to the extension cable, I wonder if a wire nut and electrical tape would work.

Also, how do you secure the ribbon wires into this accessory?

[Mr. P]

It all depend on what type of connectors your lights come with. I tend to buy the cheaper ones that don't have the waterproof connectors on them and have these type of connectors on them. This way all I have to do is solder this type of connector on to my extensions.

If you look at these they already have that style of 4-pin connector on them.

http://www.holidaycoro.com/RGB-LED-Strip-12v-30-LEDs-per-Meter-Waterproof-p/59.htm

Edited September 5, 2016 by Mr. P

[Ebuechner]

4 hours ago, k6ccc said:

Good idea!  Obviously only for dumb strips - although you only need to apply the data to the first strip on smart strips...You could apply power and ground at the joint between the first and second pixels...

 

I have found that not all of the dumb strips have solder pads all the way through on the bottom. For those without the solder pads on the bottom I drill with a Dremel tool and poke the wire through from the bottom. I've only recently started doing this after I learned from a few that failed

[Brucey]

Using Jim's suggestion of top/bottom, I was able to get a 16awg soldered onto the ribbon and got it working (even though the 16 barely fit into the controller).  Now that I've got that working, and thinking about the pigtail discussion, I want to build 'extension' cables that are connected to the controller that feed out of that case and either into another electrical box or in another weatherproof enclosure that I'll then use to solder to the extension going out to the ribbon.  Basically I want to try to pre-stage as much of this as possible without having to wait to get everything into place outside before being able to 'complete' everything needed in the controller chassis.

If I could just find really flexible 18awg wire then maybe I would just solder right to the ribbon and install into the controller when it was time to go but the stuff I found on Amazon is really rigid and not easy to work with.

[Ebuechner]

http://www.holidaycoro.com/category-s/1939.htm.          http://www.holidaycoro.com/100ft-4-Conductor-18-AWG-Extension-RGB-Lights-p/695-100.htm

Edited September 5, 2016 by Ebuechner

[Brucey]

1 hour ago, Ebuechner said:

http://www.holidaycoro.com/category-s/1939.htm.          http://www.holidaycoro.com/100ft-4-Conductor-18-AWG-Extension-RGB-Lights-p/695-100.htm

I ordered those but they're too big to fit directly onto the ends of the dumb ribbons but they could be good for the 'extensions'. 

[Ebuechner]

That's why I put the second Link in.http://www.holidaycoro.com/100ft-4-Conductor-18-AWG-Extension-RGB-Lights-p/695-100.htm.  use this wire as a whip coming out of your light strips then attach your weatherproof connector or 16 gauge wire. And keep in mind the color order doesn't always match the strip that you're using, it will work just as long as you keep it straight