Brucey Posted August 22, 2016 Share Posted August 22, 2016 I would never try to put smart pixels behind a controller connected to the main show director via ELL's, but could I do it with the 8 pack of dumb ribbons/controller? So that it's main director->ELL->ELL-1602Controller->CMB24? I'm worried about lag and the ribbons being able to keep up with the show due to the speed limitations of the ELL's but since it's a dumb ribbon controller and there wouldn't be anything else connected to the remote controller, I wanted to double check to see if it was even remotely possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k6ccc Posted August 22, 2016 Share Posted August 22, 2016 A CMB24 is only 24 channels, so not a problem . Sent from my Droid Turbo via Tapatalk, so blame any typos or spelling errors on Android Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brucey Posted October 20, 2016 Author Share Posted October 20, 2016 (edited) Well I put up 6 ribbons up over the weekend to do Halloween colors but noticed that they keep disconnecting from the ELL. My computer is about 100' away from the controller/ELL. My show will run for about 5-10 minutes then all of the ribbons will turn off for 5 seconds then they'll flash red until I turn off the show and power down/up the controller. Before I run an rj45 cable and forego the wireless, anyone have any thoughts? I've changed the frequency a couple of times and tried different speeds and still experience the issue. I've even replaced the ELL's with some extras to rule out a hardware issue. The interesting thing is that attached to the same ELL on the 2nd port is a PC16 running my Halloween "ghosts" (aka mini trees with white sheets over them) and that show continues to run without incident while the ribbons' controller seems to lose connectivity so I know I'm communicating properly from my PC to the controllers. Thoughts? Edited October 20, 2016 by Brucey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k6ccc Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 What is the cable distance from each ELL to the nearest controller? Because the ELL gets power over the Cat-5, there is a fairly short distance limit for that cable. Sent from my Droid Turbo via Tapatalk, so blame any typos or spelling errors on Android Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brucey Posted October 21, 2016 Author Share Posted October 21, 2016 What is the cable distance from each ELL to the nearest controller? Because the ELL gets power over the Cat-5, there is a fairly short distance limit for that cable. Sent from my Droid Turbo via Tapatalk, so blame any typos or spelling errors on Android From the pc to the ell it's 10' and from the ell to each controller is 5' Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k6ccc Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 OK. So much for that idea. When I saw the reference to 100 feet in the first post, my red flag went up. Sent from my Droid Turbo via Tapatalk, so blame any typos or spelling errors on Android Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brucey Posted October 21, 2016 Author Share Posted October 21, 2016 I wonder if anyone else is using the ELL's with the dumb ribbons and if they see periodic loss of signals. Just strange that the PC16's shows continue without issue and that it's just the ribbons that seems to lose it. Of course it could be a bad board but I highly doubt that. Looks like I'm running another cat5e cable from the pc to the controllers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k6ccc Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 Does the problem show up at exactly the same point in the show every time it is played? Sent from my Droid Turbo via Tapatalk, so blame any typos or spelling errors on Android Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k6ccc Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 One more thing. When the problem occurs, what is the status of the LED on the CMB24D - flashing or solid? Sent from my Droid Turbo via Tapatalk, so blame any typos or spelling errors on Android Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brucey Posted October 21, 2016 Author Share Posted October 21, 2016 Not sure, I'll have to open it up over the weekend since it's mounted and locked. I'll let you know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brucey Posted October 21, 2016 Author Share Posted October 21, 2016 16 minutes ago, k6ccc said: Does the problem show up at exactly the same point in the show every time it is played? Sent from my Droid Turbo via Tapatalk, so blame any typos or spelling errors on Android No, that was one of the first things I checked. And at this point, all that the ribbons are doing are slowly transitioning from orange to green. No rapid color changes, no complex sequences, just green to or orange to green.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k6ccc Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 Reading this whole thread at one sitting, I notice you give several conflicting descriptions of your hardware / network configurations. You refer to a director, but also a computer. Can you give a detailed description of your controllers and network configuration. What I'm looking for is something like this: PC > 6' USB cable > USB-RS485 with booster > 20' Cat-5 > ELL #1 > 100' radio link > ELL #2 > 5' Cat-5 > Some controller (specify type) > 15' Cat-5 > Some other controller, etc No, I'm not trying to be a pain in the backsides, just trying to make sure are on the same page... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brucey Posted October 21, 2016 Author Share Posted October 21, 2016 Sorry for the confusion. My original plans for 2016 morphed, don't mind the pun, as soon as I decided to add DMX strings, arches, bulbs, and more all around my house. By going DMX, out when the director and I moved to a PC-based show. So at this point I have: PC with the Regular network on Com4 hooked to USB485B connected to en ELL via cat5e ELL's configured for the 57k speed on frequency channel 24 (I've tried different speeds/frequencies with not impact) ELL on remote end set to 57k and channel 24 with one of the ports connected to a 16PC and the other port on the ELL connected to a CMB24D. Cat5e cable going from the PC to the network switch for the DMX equipment. Thanks for your help! It's probably something stupid but I can't figure it out. At least the kids don't realize, they think the flashing red that the ribbons turn to when it loses connection is spooky for Halloween. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k6ccc Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 Thanks for the more detailed information. I don't see anything obvious there. Can you swap the connectors on the remote ELL, or connect the cable going to the CMB24D to the second port on the CTB16PC? At this point, I'm kinda leaning towards a problem with the CMB24D, but I've never heard of that failure mode. A network failure would not manifest itself with the symptoms that you describe. The CMB24D should simply turn the lights off if it looses network connectivity - in fact I depend on that to turn off my overnight landscaping show when the sun comes up. You can test that by simply unplugging the cable to the CMB24D at the ELL while the lights are on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brucey Posted October 21, 2016 Author Share Posted October 21, 2016 2 minutes ago, k6ccc said: Thanks for the more detailed information. I don't see anything obvious there. Can you swap the connectors on the remote ELL, or connect the cable going to the CMB24D to the second port on the CTB16PC? At this point, I'm kinda leaning towards a problem with the CMB24D, but I've never heard of that failure mode. A network failure would not manifest itself with the symptoms that you describe. The CMB24D should simply turn the lights off if it looses network connectivity - in fact I depend on that to turn off my overnight landscaping show when the sun comes up. You can test that by simply unplugging the cable to the CMB24D at the ELL while the lights are on. Well the other thing that's interesting is that when the problem occurs, I have ghosts/mini trees off the PC16 that keep up with the show but I also have a spotlight set to shimmer off the 16PC that turns off like the ribbons on the 24D and only comes back when the ribbons return as well. So I'm wondering if it's a throughput issue? I'm going to run a long cat5e cable over the weekend to make sure it's not an issue with either of the controllers but I'm stumped on this one... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k6ccc Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 10 minutes ago, Brucey said: Well the other thing that's interesting is that when the problem occurs, I have ghosts/mini trees off the PC16 that keep up with the show but I also have a spotlight set to shimmer off the 16PC that turns off like the ribbons on the 24D and only comes back when the ribbons return as well. So I'm wondering if it's a throughput issue? I'm going to run a long cat5e cable over the weekend to make sure it's not an issue with either of the controllers but I'm stumped on this one... That sure sounds like something in the sequence. If you want, you can send me the sequence and I'll take a look. jim@k6ccc.org The fact that you see a similar issue with channels on multiple controllers, largely rules out a controller problem. With only 40 LOR channels, I can't imagine it being a throughput issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brucey Posted October 21, 2016 Author Share Posted October 21, 2016 Thanks, sent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k6ccc Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 Got the files. One suggestion for future use when E-Mailing sequences. Zip them before sending. Accomplishes two things. First is the obvious in that it makes the file size A LOT smaller. Second is that sometimes mail systems manage to corrupt text files as attachments. Fortunately my mail server does not barf on large files... BTW, I did not need the .lsv or .lcs files - just the .las. I can honestly say that I have never seen a single sequence over four hours long! The quick look is that you just repeated the same two minutes over and over. Note that since this is an animation sequence, you could have just made it the two minutes long and put in a loop to run 121 times and accomplished the same thing. Or you don't bother with the loop, and I assume you have just this one sequence in the show. The show player will keep repeating the one sequence until the scheduled end time. On a quick look, I don't see anything obvious. Please confirm a couple things for me: 1) Am I correct that this is the only sequence running? You had mentioned DMX channels (I gather via E1.31) in an earlier post, but they are not in this sequence. Makes me wonder if there is another sequence running in a different section of the show editor (for example in the background tab). 2) You said that there was one channel set to shimmer that was having the same issue. I assume that you mean the "Graveyard" channel at the top of track 1. Since with LOR protocol (rather than DMX) that channel should not be getting any commands except at the very start of the sequence, it should not go off without being commanded to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k6ccc Posted October 21, 2016 Share Posted October 21, 2016 One more thing. The way you have the sequence broken into two tracks is setting you up for future issues when you add or move channels. Take a look at this thread and pay particular attention to how George uses track 1 in the first post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brucey Posted October 21, 2016 Author Share Posted October 21, 2016 11 minutes ago, k6ccc said: I can honestly say that I have never seen a single sequence over four hours long! The quick look is that you just repeated the same two minutes over and over. Note that since this is an animation sequence, you could have just made it the two minutes long and put in a loop to run 121 times and accomplished the same thing. Or you don't bother with the loop, and I assume you have just this one sequence in the show. The show player will keep repeating the one sequence until the scheduled end time. On a quick look, I don't see anything obvious. Please confirm a couple things for me: 1) Am I correct that this is the only sequence running? You had mentioned DMX channels (I gather via E1.31) in an earlier post, but they are not in this sequence. Makes me wonder if there is another sequence running in a different section of the show editor (for example in the background tab). 2) You said that there was one channel set to shimmer that was having the same issue. I assume that you mean the "Graveyard" channel at the top of track 1. Since with LOR protocol (rather than DMX) that channel should not be getting any commands except at the very start of the sequence, it should not go off without being commanded to. I originally had the sequence as 30 seconds with show editor to run it the entire time but when the problem started, I thought it may be something with the loop so I expanded it manually over 4 hours. To answer your questions: 1. Yes this is the only sequence running at the time. The DMX 'stuff' is planned for Christmas and there's nothing else running except what you saw in the sequence. 2. That was my understanding as well but looking through the sequence, there is no 'off' command for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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