Updating the Preview after updating a Prop Motion Effects.

[Obejohnknobe]

Greetings Everyone!!

Hope everyone is doing well  and hard at it for getting their sequences completed.

Question, I have updated a few props with new motion effects lines in prop definition box.  For example, I have a a Boscoyo Spider updated to 14 lines of motion effects.  Some will say that is way too much but have been able to make the spider look like it is climbing or using different features of the spider (hour glass, eyes) on it for effects in the sequence.  The problem is after updating the prop, it does not reflect in the group.  I have clicked out of the sequence and reopened it, no go on updating to the new motion effect.  Looked at sequence file info and it shows I am using the current preview design.  Tried resetting the prop under the groups tab in sequencer and still no update.  My next idea is to assign a new preview but am at a loss(cannot remember how) on how to export the preview into the new preview design box so I can assign the sequence to the new preview design.  Also at a loss to where the preview designs are stored in S6

Any help is appreciated. 

Thank you,

John

[Jimehc]

if you updated the Preview Props... When you open an existing sequence > right click the Prop in prop list > manage motion effects > edit > merge defaults....  You will have to do this with every existing sequence and every edited prop to see the updated motion effect row changes.... Creating a New Sequence will have the updated motion effect rows....  Older sequences do not update automatically as they will use the older motion effect rows, until you tell the sequence (Prop) to update to New Rows..

Edited June 29 by Jimehc

[Obejohnknobe]

Thank you, that worked to perfection!

Do have one more request, how do you import a saved preview?  For example, I am working off of Halloween 2023 Preview Design with 2024 Sequences and need to make  Halloween 2024 Preview Design from the 2023 one.  Also, Have gone thru the S6 software and cannot find where the Preview Designs are stored.

Thank you,

John

[PhilMassey]

Hey John.

Previews are stored in a single file LOR Previews.xml in the commondata folder. If you have a new preview you apply it to the old sequence using the Assign command in the Sequence menu. It will then walk you through the changes to the sequence.

There is a LORPreviews.bak file which is a copy for emergencies but I always make a frequent backup copy of the Commondata folder, just in case. I also suggest exporting all your previews using the Import/Export button on the slide out Preview tab at top right of the sequencer window. 

Any sequence will create its own Preview when opened, if one does not exist on your machine. It will list as "Imported from..........." 

I also suggest working on copies of sequence and preview files when making changes.

[Obejohnknobe]

Found it and thank you!

Since I have been working on this most of the year, some portions of the software I have not touched for a while and I loose what knowledge I had on it.  After your info, made a few copies (stored them in S6 and computer LOR file I have for backups) and updated the preview designs to 2024.

Thank you for the info!!

John

[k6ccc]

1 hour ago, Obejohnknobe said:

After your info, made a few copies (stored them in S6 and computer LOR file I have for backups)

Good advise from Phil.  Take it one step further - keep backups OFF-SITE.  Too many situations where backups at home can get lost / destroyed.  I'm still working, so when I back up my file server every week, the external drives used get taken into my office (26 miles away).  Once I retire, I expect that the backup disk drives will get put into a bank safe deposit box.  I also upload stuff to Google Drive as an off-site backup.

 

[Box on Rails]

5 hours ago, Obejohnknobe said:

I have a a Boscoyo Spider updated to 14 lines of motion effects.  Some will say that is way too much but have been able to make the spider look like it is climbing or using different features of the spider (hour glass, eyes) on it for effects in the sequence.

Don't listen to those people who say 14 Rows is to many. I bet the animation of the spider looks great. I have found a way to use ME rows for animation that looks way better then using Picture files.  I have a Christmas preview that has 135 Motion effects rows in each of three 50x50 Matrixes. That's 405 ME rows total just on the Matrixes alone. I believe S6 can handle 1000 ME rows with out issue. The 3 matrixes have characters I made in the Custom ME rows. There is no picture files used on all of the Talking and singing Characters. Here is what 400 plus Motion effect rows looks like in the preview window. I can't wait to see on the house this year.  

 

[Jimehc]

That took a lot of time and effort to create all those face effects without images...

 

[Obejohnknobe]

Jim,

Correct on Back Ups.  Have a portable SSD HD that I use to store and load to my laptop as a 2nd and 3rd backup source.  Yes, very good advice from Phil that I heed!

Box on Rails,

You are correct, I do not listen to the naysayers as I do what makes sense to me.  Your Matrix's are very impressive and it probably took forever to make those characters.  May I ask what size of matrix's you are using??  Looking at using 1 next year.

Thank you everyone!

John

[Box on Rails]

28 minutes ago, Jimehc said:

That took a lot of time and effort to create all those face effects without images...

 

Not that much time once I convert the image to a 50x50 jpg using https://www.piskelapp.com/ then it's just turning on the right pixel in each Motion effects row. I would say I spent about 1 to 2 hours on each Character. and each character has about15 ME rows each. Timely? Yes. But the out put is stunning. 

 

19 minutes ago, Obejohnknobe said:

You are correct, I do not listen to the naysayers as I do what makes sense to me.  Your Matrix's are very impressive and it probably took forever to make those characters.  May I ask what size of matrix's you are using??  Looking at using 1 next year.

Thank you everyone!

John

For this up come season i will be using three 50x50 Pixel matrix.  Last year I used one 50x48 framed with 1"x2" wood and a 50x100 Using 2"x4" wood frame. The latter was to heavy to hang from my eves on the house. I put it on the ground and it did not look good there. I would say don't go bigger then 50x50 pixels. I split the 50x100 into 2 50x50 for this year. If I go bigger then 50x50 I will look into using p5 or p10 Matrix panels. They are much lighter. In addition last year I ran 150 pixels per port and for the most part the show ran well but on the songs with Motion effects that were very busy,  I got a little lag. Last year I was using 1 Pixie 16 with 150 pixels per port on the 50x48 matrix and 2 pixie 16 at 150 pixels per port with one CCP2  at 100 pixels per port to round out the last 200 pixels on the 50x100 Matrix This year, to try and help the lag, I will be only using 100 pixels per port on all the Matrixes. so each matrix will consist of one Pixie 16, one Pixie 8 and one port on a CCP2 that is a total of 25 ports per matrix. Each Matrix will be on it's own dedicated High speed network. Each Matrix has a total of 2500 pixels witch should be just right to keep the lag at bay. I will also keep each controller within one to two feet of the matrix. using longer extensions can cause lag. All of these changes should help my show run smoother. 

If you go with a smaller matrix keep in mind you are going to probably want to use a Pixie 16. with 50 pixels per port. So this will start off simple with multiples of 16 and 25/50. so you would start with 16 ports and use 50 pixel strings could make a nice 50x16 matrix or a 32 x 25 is a pretty good sized Matrix to start with. If you use 100 pixels per port I would go with a 50 across x 32 down. That way if you want to add a pixie 8 later you could turn the Matrix into a 50x48 by adding 16 rows( 8 ports). There are many ways to make a matrix big or small. I know I get a little over the top with my animation for my Matrixes but I enjoy doing it and that what this hobby is all about. Having fun with it. John If you have any issues when putting your Matrix together just message me and I'll help you out. just remember. Have fun with it. 

Kenny

[Obejohnknobe]

Kenny,

I have a 3 X 4 P5 panels (128 X 64, I think) with a Raspberry Pi 4B but am stuck with getting the Pi to work with the panels.  Working with the matrix's seems a better solution since I am familiar with LOR programming.  I do love this hobby and since I am now retired, it makes me work my brain and keeps me active.  Will probably have lots of questions about it once I have obtained what you have suggested, probably next year for the questions.

Thank you,

John

[k6ccc]

John, Feel free to ask questions about getting the P5 panels working.  I've been using them for years.

I currently have a 3W x 2H P5 matrix (192 wide x 64 pixels high) and a 4W x 3H P10 matrix (128 x 48 pixels high).  I use them as my Tune To signs for the most part.  The down side is that the aspect ratio for the two is not the same so sequencing is just a little different - annoying.  However I just order the parts to rebuild the P10 as 6W x 4H which will make it the same number of pixels as the P5 matrix.  That means that the sequencing for them will be exactly the same.  That also will get the P10 matrix 50% larger than it currently is - which will be a good thing since the audience is as much as 120 feet from it and it can be a little hard to read.  The P5 matrix is in a different direction and much closer to the audience (if they are on the sidewalk, then can touch it).

The existing 12 P10 panels will get re-purposed for something else.  I THINK it will be two "columns" with six panels in portrait orientation.

 

[Obejohnknobe]

Jim,

Got to looking at my P5 panels and it is 3 Panels wide X 4 Panels tall, 12 total.  I have a Raspberry Pi 4B connected to a Color Light distribution to the panels and is a stand alone system.  The idea is to have the panels about 6' from the sidewalk and would display the tune to info, list of songs and advertisement about our FB page and YouTube channel.  Our light display is in a neighborhood so the lightly traveled road is about 10' from the panels.  The problem is following directions to get the Pi OS on the Pi itself and then FPP loaded on it.   After several tries and a few hours, got frustrated after following directions and did not go correctly.  About 5 years ago, have 4 P10 Panels with a wireless Pi and was able to get it to work with 1 major problem.  The darn thing would display everything from R to L instead of L to R.

I would love to do away with the Pi but from what I understand there is no LOR hardware that would drive the P5 panels.  Also, not a computer network person but do have some very basic knowledge about it.   Would love some guidance on getting it working either via the Pi or on the LOR system.  Do have a pixielink (6 outputs), will be trying to replace my MP3Director (4 outputs) with it this year. 

Thank you,

John

 

[k6ccc]

On 6/30/2024 at 12:51 PM, Obejohnknobe said:

The problem is following directions to get the Pi OS on the Pi itself and then FPP loaded on it. 

First of all, you don't load the RasPi OS first.  The FPP image contains everything needed.  Download the correct image file, use a image writing program to write the image file to the uSD card, and plug it into the RasPi.  You do NOT need a monitor, keyboard, or mouse connected to the Pi (and doing so causes more confusion than it solves).  Everything after that for FPP is done via a web browser.  The ColorLight requires a direct connection to your computer (for setup only).  Then you run the LEDVision program to configure the ColorLight.

On 6/30/2024 at 12:51 PM, Obejohnknobe said:

I would love to do away with the Pi but from what I understand there is no LOR hardware that would drive the P5 panels.

Unfortunately yes, we have no choice other than to run FPP.

On 6/30/2024 at 12:51 PM, Obejohnknobe said:

Would love some guidance on getting it working either via the Pi or on the LOR system. 

You have my phone number as I recall.

On 6/30/2024 at 12:51 PM, Obejohnknobe said:

Do have a pixielink (6 outputs), will be trying to replace my MP3Director (4 outputs) with it this year. 

Unless I mis-read what you meant to say, there is some confusion.  PixieLink and Directors are completely different animals.  One does not replace the other.  Also note that if you are going to use a PixieLink, you can not run the show from a Director.  PixieLink requires E1.31 (DMX over Ethernet) data on the input and Directors only output RS-485 serial data.

 

[Obejohnknobe]

Thanks Jim!!!

No one has explained the FPP as is its own system on the Pi.  Do know the ColorLight has to be directly connected the computer and load LED vision before anything can run.  Just have not done it yet due to the confusion of the Pi.  It on my to do list for July to hopefully get it running .

I am replacing my Director with the PixieLink and computer.   If everything goes well, the set up will be from my main computer to PixieLink, then to the cards.  Unless I cannot figure it out, then the director will go in its place, minus the computer.   This one is also on my to do list for July.

Also,  have your number but will give you a text ahead of time to see when you can be available if help is needed.

Thank you,

John

[Vince4xmas]

I too plan to replace my 4 port director with a mini-pc and pixie link. Is there any tutorial that can assist?

Thanks

 

[Obejohnknobe]

Vince4xmas,

The only place I found anything is on LOR website and it is just the picture of the way everything is supposed to be connected.  I went to the forum to ask questions on it a few months back and was advised to get a usb to RS485 jack (I call it a cat 5 jack, $15 on Amazon) to connect from the computer to the PixieLink.  The PixieLink goes to the rest of the cards.  Other advice I was given was not to overload the outputs from the PixieLink, thinking it was a max of 32 (2 - Pixie 16s) per output.  My display has all 4 outputs on the Director maxed out.  Also, you will have to use the computer to program in your show and play it from there (see schedule and I think there is 1 video on their website for it).  In my instance, the pressure is mounting to get the PixieLink working before September as our show is both Halloween and Christmas.

Hope this helps some, but ask on the forum if you need more help.  Suggestion to the experienced ones, maybe a video on how the PixieLink is connected on your display and showing how it works thru the computer might help.

John

[Steven]

On 7/4/2024 at 5:28 AM, Obejohnknobe said:

and was advised to get a usb to RS485 jack (I call it a cat 5 jack, $15 on Amazon) to connect from the computer to the PixieLink.

The input to a PixieLink is E1.31 (Ethernet). (Its 6 outputs are RS485.) To connect from a computer to the PixieLink an Ethernet (not RS485) connection is required.

Nearly everything you see on Amazon with USB on one end and a "cat 5" jack on the other end is an Ethernet adapter, so you're probably good there, just make sure it's Ethernet, not RS485 (or DMX).

By the way, there's no such thing as an "RS485 jack." RS485 is the electrical specification.

[Don]

4 minutes ago, Steven said:

The input to a PixieLink is E1.31 (Ethernet). (Its 6 outputs are RS485.) To connect from a computer to the PixieLink an Ethernet (not RS485) connection is required.

For what it's worth there *are* USB to Ethernet adapters (as you know) that would give them the ability to create the Ethernet adapter they need to connect to the Pixie link. That might be what they are referring to here.