What's the max # of pixels for each network on the N4-G4MP3 Showtime Director?

[Gmitch1]

What's the max # of pixels for each network on the N4-G4MP3 Showtime Director? Trying to determine if I have exceeded the number of pixels per network. Thanks

 

[Jimehc]

This is the reply I received from LOR Help Desk Staff ( 02/03/2021 )

Quote

The number we have standardized for the G4 directors is 9000 channels per port. Because the protocol we use involves compression there are no actual absolute maximum numbers for channels. You can run 12,000 on one network (or more). The system will allow it but with experimentation and couple of years of field testing and feedback from customers we have decided that 9000 channels is a good number. Again, sorry for the confusion.

So that would be 3000 Pixels per Network

Edited February 23, 2023 by Jimehc

[k6ccc]

And that would be at 1000K speed Enhanced LOR mode.

 

[Gmitch1]

Ok awesome, thanks!

 

[Jimehc]

Actually it is listed as 4800 Pixels Per Network at 1000K

[k6ccc]

Based on real world reports, 4,800 pixels on a network is likely pushing it unless you have a non-complex show.  Good luck at getting 4800 pixels running a butterfly pattern to look right on a single ELOR network.

PixieLink may be an exception because you can get far faster speed.

 

 

Edited February 23, 2023 by k6ccc

[Jimehc]

Quote

This director controls one or two high speed networks of Light-O-Rama controllers while simultaneously playing MP3 audio files. The two networks can each run up to a speed of 1000K which allows this director to control up to 480 CTB16PC/LOR160x controllers or 9600 pixels in total,

Quote

This director controls one, two, three or four high speed networks of Light-O-Rama controllers while simultaneously playing MP3 audio files. The four networks can each run up to a speed of 1000K which allows this director to control up to 960 CTB16PC/LOR160x controllers or 19,200 pixels in total,

Maybe I misread the LOR Descriptions...

[k6ccc]

The description is a best case scenario.

 

[Orville]

6 hours ago, Jimehc said:

Maybe I misread the LOR Descriptions...

I don't think you did.  The N4-G4 does have 4 ports, but port 1 can only be run at 500K with the newer G3 CTB16PC, but I don't think the G3 CTB16PC units can run any faster than 500K. Older [Pre-Gen 3] CTB16PC units can not be run any faster than 115.4K and must be NON-Enhanced, so that would kill it for Pixels on that port on a Director, if you have older [Pre-Gen3] controllers in your network and using any Director would only allow 115.4K, Regular Network on Port 1. 

I have an older CTB16PC that powers my Director, so Port 1, Regular on my Director is locked in at 115.4K, Regular, NON-Enhanced network, but the other 3 networks I can use at any speeds up to 1,000K Enhanced on all other ports [Net 2, Net 3 and Net4]. 

Fortunately I am nowhere near that number of channels on any network, even though my Pixie16D is set for a default of 150 channels per port, but only 2 ports are actually configured with 150 Channels, all others are set at 100 Channels per port, although a couple of ports only use 8 channels for my LOR Singing Christmas Trees [Ralphie and Zuzu - DUMB MODE] and 2 others only use 4 channels each for my HC 10W Smart RGB Floods.   So I have a lot of room to add a lot more pixels if I want too later on.

Nowhere near the limits, and probably will never have that many pixels in my display.  I do well to place what I have now. LOL

[Jimehc]

960 CTB16PC Controllers = 15,360 Channels at a max supported speed of 500K for the controllers (3840 Channels Per Network at 500k)

Just doing the math on LOR stated specs.... And LOR states 3000 Pixels Per Network at 500k with RGBPlus....

 

[k6ccc]

Again, in a best case situation.

 

[TheDucks]

6 hours ago, k6ccc said:

Again, in a best case situation.

 

Correct. EVERYTHING is running at peak performance. Networks are Terminated. No (EM) noise close to the network cables....

I don't understand the non-emergency need to squeeze every last byte of performance ? This is not the Grand Prix.

You want your show to just RUN... Rain or Snow

 

[k6ccc]

Because of the way that the LOR protocol operates, the max number of channels that will display properly will vary radically depending on the sequencing.  If you have fairly simple sequencing that results in a fairly small number of lighting commands, you can run FAR more channels on a LOR network that a sequence that results in LOTS of lighting commands.  The Butterfly effect in Motion Effects is likely one of the worst case scenarios.  That is because essentially every pixel is getting a new lighting command many times per second.  That effect will push a LOR network very hard.

There are several things that will allow a LOR network to carry more lighting commands.  The first obvious one is higher speed.  LOR networks can be set to several different speeds between 19.2K and 1000K speed.  The higher number, the more lighting commands that can be carried.  The older controllers can only go up to 115.4K speed, and MOST of the newer controllers can go up to 500K speed.  Pixie and Pixcon16 controllers can use the highest 1000K speed.  The second is enhanced mode (or ELOR).  In simple terms enhanced mode allows the show computer or director to continuously send data without having to leave gaps for some other controller to send data.  Older controllers can not use Enhanced mode, and the Pixcon16 requires it (if operating in LOR mode).

So, I have no doubt that the spec of 4800 pixels is POSSIBLE, but unless you have nothing but low commands sequencing, it is almost certainly NOT going to display properly.  You want to make a test with your prop that has a large number of pixels, create a simple sequence with a rapidly changing butterfly effect and play it on the actual lights.  If it runs properly, you should be good to go.  If it can't keep up, plan on splitting the prop or show into smaller networks.

 

[Gmitch1]

Wow! You all are geniuses! Thanks for the breakdowns so fairly newbies like me could follow along and really understand! Now I think I know where I stand with my equipment. I wasn't versed, but from what you described, since I run my pixie controllers at a 500K speed on ELOR on my N4-G4 director, I can have a maximum of 2400 pixels per network if I'm not overachieving with complex sequences...if I understood correctly?  Not sure how to check the generation of my equipment, but I bought all of my pixie controllers, AC controller,  and N4-G4 director in October of 2021, so hopefully it can support the push to 1000K for my pixels this Christmas Show season.

Thanks so much!

[k6ccc]

With that purchase date, the Pixie controllers can handle 1000K speed, but the AC controller can not.  All should be able to handle ELOR mode.  You can check the firmware version and generation from the Hardware Utility.

2400 pixels on a 500K network MAY work OK if the sequencing is not complex.  Should be OK if you push it to 1000K speed.  Try the Butterfly effect test I mentioned in my last post.

No, we're not geniuses - we just have years of experience.  Personally I have been running pixels since 2012.  You learn a few things by doing this for over a decade....

 

[dibblejr]

3 hours ago, k6ccc said:

With that purchase date, the Pixie controllers can handle 1000K speed, but the AC controller can not.  All should be able to handle ELOR mode.  You can check the firmware version and generation from the Hardware Utility.

2400 pixels on a 500K network MAY work OK if the sequencing is not complex.  Should be OK if you push it to 1000K speed.  Try the Butterfly effect test I mentioned in my last post.

No, we're not geniuses - we just have years of experience.  Personally I have been running pixels since 2012.  You learn a few things by doing this for over a decade....

 

Some people just don’t understand what “real world / perfect world “ scenario means.

There are many variables in getting to each persons outcome.

JR

[hasslerk]

I guess my show is not considered complex, and as JR says there are many variables.  On my N4-G4MP3 for Christmas 2022 I had 2600 pixels on Net 2 @ 500K ELOR, 1458 pixels on Net 3 @ 500k ELOR, and 600 pixels on Net 4 @ 1000K ELOR (PPD Wreath).  Net 1 is all my AC controllers.  Counts are based on proximity of controllers for daisy chaining.  I keep all ports at 100 pixels max.  This year I will have to re-map it since I am adding another 3000 pixels.