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Light Linking for 2400'


Matt S

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I have new neighbors that want to join the show 2400' away.  It is a very good clear line of sight.  Can I set up easy light linkers at 800' apart and just supply a power to them using a Power over Ethernet (POE) transformer or does each light linker have to be hooked into a controller? 

Or to put it another way, can 1 light linker receive and also transmit the data?   

20221113_094316_resized.jpg

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ELL is NOT a POE (or even Ethernet) device.  Do NOT ever attach it to any Ethernet device.  Voltages and signal lines are on pins that are different from LOR RS485 usage.

Advertise Maximum range (No obstructions in between ) is 1000' (just don't count on it to be bullet proof)

RS485 can go 4000' total, end to end. The ELL must be within 25' of its powering source (controller or the LOR 485B adapter that also does power for some devices.

I suppose, one could build a 9VDC injector (pins 3 and 6. check which is +) That still leaves the problem of distance. 

The notes do not mention what connector the Antenna uses. A pair of Yagi (style) designed for 902 – 928 MHz, aimed at each other might work with a single pair (clear Line of sight)

Something Similar (the connector needs to match without adapters) https://www.amazon.com/Antenna-RAK-Hotspot-Antenna-915mhz-Antenna-Adapter/dp/B0962NV3H6, mounted up high (above 10+' if traffic passes between)

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Page 10 of the manual tells you how to do long range linking.  However, that is showing using a controller for each ELL as a power source.  You do NOT need to use a controller, but it is NOT a "standard" POE adapter.  You can supply 9 volts via pins 3 and 6 of the RJ-45 connector from whatever power supply you have handy.  I am doing that with two ELLs and it works fine.

https://www1.lightorama.com/PDF/RF-V4-V5_Man_Web.pdf

The other note is that I would test the linking distance.  Since you have a clear path, you may get better distance and be able to eliminate one of the intermediate relay locations.  That may also be dictated to where you have access to locations to place them.

TheDucks beat me to some of this....

To answer one of TheDucks comments, the antenna is not removable - at least not without warranty voiding surgery.

 

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So I understand your concerns about making sure I power it correctly via pins 3 and 6.   

But as for receiving and retransmitting a LOR data signal for a stand alone light linker (with no controller attached), do you know if those work that way?  Page 10 of the ELL manual makes it sound like a single light linker can send or receive, not both.    

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No, it would take two ELLs for each repeater location.  An ELL is capable of both transmitting and receiving, but it operates on a single frequency.  That means it would have to receive data, store that data and then re-transmit it.  The Store and Forward is not part of the ELL capability.  Even if it did, that would at the very least delay the data (maybe enough to make the lights out of sync), and worse, it would essentially be jamming the signal that it is trying to receive.

Absolutely, the ELL will operate without an attached controller.  The only thing that the controller is doing is providing power to the ELL.  And that can be done with other power sources.

 

Edited by k6ccc
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On 11/13/2022 at 10:18 AM, TheDucks said:

Well, scratch the Yagi idea

 

On 11/13/2022 at 9:41 AM, k6ccc said:

the antenna is not removable

Yes, the antenna is removable. In fact, you can buy a replacement from LOR for $10 if you contact their support desk. But, they will tell you that when you replace the antenna, you must use silicone sealant at the base to prevent water intrusion. Base on this information, and the fact that I have removed a broken antenna simply by unscrewing it, there is no reason why you can't use a 900 MHz Yagi. This should go 2400 feet with no problem.

19 hours ago, k6ccc said:

An ELL is capable of both transmitting and receiving, but it operates on a single frequency.

You can change the frequency. The Hardware Utility gives you 32 choices. It is not clear how much those channels overlap.

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1 minute ago, Steven said:

You can change the frequency. The Hardware Utility gives you 32 choices. It is not clear how much those channels overlap.

Correct, you can change the frequency to any of the 32, but it only operates on one of those.  It's can't receive on one and transmit on another.

 

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5 minutes ago, k6ccc said:

Correct, you can change the frequency to any of the 32, but it only operates on one of those.  It's can't receive on one and transmit on another.

Right. At each repeater station, as was suggested earlier, you would need 2 ELLs operating on different frequencies.

I would rather use a long-range point-to-point antenna because it's much less complicated.

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21 minutes ago, Steven said:

 

Yes, the antenna is removable. In fact, you can buy a replacement from LOR for $10 if you contact their support desk. But, they will tell you that when you replace the antenna, you must use silicone sealant at the base to prevent water intrusion. Base on this information, and the fact that I have removed a broken antenna simply by unscrewing it, there is no reason why you can't use a 900 MHz Yagi. This should go 2400 feet with no problem.

Removable might be the difference between V4 an V5. I looked at the V5 pictire and it sure looked like the trace side of a SMA/TNC connector.

Could you post which type, so the OP can order the correct cable with the antenna/

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11 minutes ago, TheDucks said:

Removable might be the difference between V4 an V5.

My neighbor across the street, who is part of my display, broke the antenna on her V4 ELL. Since it was already fixed in place, I removed the antenna from my spare V5 ELL and attached it directly to her V4 ELL (with silicone, of course).

So the antennas and connectors on both versions of the ELL are probably identical, and are at least compatible.

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I can only go by what the manual says (https://www1.lightorama.com/PDF/RF-V4-V5_Man_Web.pdf  page 12):

Quote

8. NEVER remove the antenna. It is sealed to
the case with silicone and removing it will
break this seal possibly allowing water to
enter and destroy the transceiver.

 

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