Seeing some behaviors opening an S4 lms in S5 related to the CCR tree prop

[machtoo]

Brian, I am seeing some behaviors in S5 related to to the CCR tree prop that I can't figure out.

1. I have successfully opened and converted my 36 S4 Christmas sequences to S5 and they playback fine in the preview window.

2. In a couple of the sequences I saw some issue with the  Ribbon channels that were created by the prop.  Decided to "re-insert" the SuperStar sequence.   So I selected the Ribbons+6chStar row and right clicked on the first cell but no Insert SuperStar effect is listed as an option.  It apparently is not recognized as a motion effect row.  It is in some and others it is not.

3. What are the 4 rows created by the prop import?  Expanding them they seem redundant.  Do you keep all of them or do you delete some?

4. As mentioned I now have all of my Christmas sequences working in the preview window but I could not replace the SS sequence in the majority due to the behavior described.

5.  So I started on my Halloween sequences.  Followed similar process opening the S4 into S5 after creating a full preview which also includes the imported CCR prop. 

6. Upon testing in the preview playback I noticed only half of the CCR tree was playing.  The ribbons 1-6 row has a triangle next to it.  In the Halloween sequences the Ribbons+6ch Star did display the Insert SuperStar effect.  After allowing it to open in SS opening the file and closing it saved to the S5 sequencer.  The full tree played back in the preview but I started seeing timing issues or delays between the 2 halves of the CCR tree.

7. Why are the CCR tree prop rows not recognized as motion effect rows in the majority of cases when converting an S4 file?

8. Why is only half the CCR tree displayed during the initial open/conversion in S5 for the Halloween sequences and after a reinsert what would cause the timing issue between the two six ribbon sets?

9.  Any recommendations on a procedure to follow to open an S4 lms file with a SuperStar sequence and have it recognized as SS in the S5 version?

 

Any information you can provide on what is causing the behaviors would be helpful.  Thanks in advance  for any assist and education.
 

Dean

[BrianBruderer]

Lets handle one question at a time.

All motion effect rows are black, but as you indicate, some black rows are not motion effect rows. If you have a Pro license and you right click on a black row and do not see the "insert superstar effect" option then it is not a motion effect row.

Sometimes you don't see the motion effect row until you expand the prop. Usually the row will be labeled something like "Effect 01"

Sometimes you need to add a motion effect row. To do this, right click on the prop and a menu should appear and the bottom option should be "add/modify motion effect row." Click on that option and a dialog box will appear. In that dialog box click on the "add" button to add a motion effect row.

 

[machtoo]

Roger that.  I have attached a sequence that was opened in S5 and converted to an S5.  It plays fine in the preview.  I expanded all 4 ribbon rows the prop import created and do not see any effect rows...they all start with ribbon. 

CaroloftehBells_2014.zip

[machtoo]

I do not see any effects rows in the S5.  The original S4 sequences were created using the export feature from SS to an lms file and then copy and paste method from the sup lms to the main lms ccr rows and star rows.

[PhilMassey]

Right click on the prop in the Grid View and choose add Motion Effect Row.

You might also want to enable channel level, and if you like to see the individual RGB channels, in Tools/Sequencer Preferences/Channel Effects, check the Split RGB channels box.

[machtoo]

Hi Phil, I have never had a need to see individual RGB channels only controller level for the ribbons.  My show is strictly legacy with a 12 ribbon CCR tree, so SS takes care of creating the channels, I just create the animations and export.   But I still have a question on why the Halloween sequences created with the same method above show the 4 CCR tree prop rows as motion effect and the 36 Christmas sequences do not.  

I may get into a Pixel tree next year but have used the original CCR ribbons for 5-6 years.  SS did all the magic during export to lms.

[machtoo]

Brian, once you have grabbed the Christmas sequence above I will delete so I can attach a Halloween sequence created with the same steps yet the ribbon rows show as motion effect rows.  Thanks

[machtoo]

Brian, If the Christmas sequences work without a motion effect row, do I need to add a motion effect row to allow inserting an updated or new SS sequence in the future?  If so, how do you associate the rows created by the CCR tree prop import to the new motion effect row?  

Does the old copy and paste method still work in the new S5 world?...ie export from SS to a superstar lms file and copy from it to the S5 sequence?

Need to be able to update the SS sequences in the S4-S5 sequences going forward.

[BrianBruderer]

Some of these questions would be better answered in the Sequencer forum, but here is what I have observed while using the Sequencer

Stuff that is converted to raw channels does not allow a motion effect row to be added

Props that are in your Preview can have motion effect rows added

You can copy/paste "raw channels" the same way as you did in S4. Realize they just paste in the same order as they were in during the copy.

You cannot copy/paste from or to a motion effect row.

[BrianBruderer]

You asked about associating raw converted channels with existing motion effect rows. Basically you cannot "associate" them. That is you cannot take the "raw channels" and modify them or see them using superstar. They are just raw channels. They can't be put into a motion effect row.

But you can have a motion effect row for a prop that uses the same channels as in the "raw channel" sequencing. The Sequencer should combine them in the Playback.

[machtoo]

So, when  I import the CCRs tree prop into the preview design and set the channels, should it have created a motion effect channel?  When I created the preview design that included the CCR tree prop, I opened the S4 sequence and it seems to populate the channels created by the prop...just no motion effect channel visible  except for the Halloween sequences which is what I cannot figure out.

Did the CCR tree prop come from your site when it is imported? Why does it create 4 rows that seem to have redundant sub rows for the CCR ribbons?  Seems like it would just create on set of rows for 12 CCR ribbons.  I have not found any documentation that explains that question.

Appreciate your patience...I do have two EE degrees and worked with electronics for 40+ years but having used LOR for 13 years, S5 is quite a change...at least it is not as intuitive for me at this point.  I have 360+ legacy channels and the 12 ribbon CCR tree in my show. So the 12 CCR tree is the only RGB device at this point.

Dean, PE, EE

[BrianBruderer]

Matt Brown, the programmer for the Sequencer, was nice enough to make the Previews for me in the "superstar (online)" stuff. 

He found it easier to make the trees in two halves, since they are symmetrical. I would prefer them to be in one group as well but it just means you want to be careful and choose the group that contains everything you want.

I'm still learning about the Sequencer as well. To get better answers you would best post your questions in the Sequencer forum. 

[machtoo]

Roger that, thanks