Tim Fischer Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 Well, since you asked:What makes these more dangerous than a BBQ grill? Two things (at least): One, my BBQ doesn't shoot flames out 3-4' in the air, unless I'm doing a REALLY bad job of cooking. Secondly, I don't grill unattended -- at worst I'm 20 feet away in the house, with a clear patio-door view of the grill.What makes these more dangerous than a tiki torch? My tiki torches, and any that I've seen, don't shoot flames 3-4' in the air, they don't "shoot" flames at all, and their flame height is only a few inches tall. And again, I don't run these when I'm far away, or even not at home.What makes this dangerous other than the fire? Well, uhm, what makes a sniper dangerous other than his gun? What makes a cliff dangerous to climb other than the fact it's so high up?Are these cool? Certainly. Do I find them Christmassy? Not at all, but that's just my personal opinion, I guess... Would I use them in my display? Absolutely not. Why? Because I need to run the show completely unattended. I can't be certain that someone (or the wind) doesn't knock one of these down when it's not running, and then have it kick in and burn something down. I can't be sure that some drunk teen doesn't grab one and try to use it as a flamethrower. I can't assume that a big plastic bag doesn't float by, get torched, then float over on my shrub, starting my house on fire. In short, regs or no regs, I'd never use one of these unless myself or someone else was physically sitting there any time they were live and ready to go off...Just my opinions...-TimP.S. melwelch, I've seen your video, and it's really cool. But you appear to have NO physical barrier between your audience and these devices? You have bigger nads than I do Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iresq Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 Are these devices safe in your hands? Perhaps. Another hazard to consider is Joe sixpack seeing it and thinking he can do the same thing. Next thing you know, he yells "Hey Y'all, Watch This!" and you know what happens after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Roberson Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 iresq wrote: Are these devices safe in your hands? Perhaps. Another hazard to consider is Joe sixpack seeing it and thinking he can do the same thing. Next thing you know, he yells "Hey Y'all, Watch This!" and you know what happens after that.Now that is funny right there I don't care who you are!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texan78 Posted October 29, 2008 Author Share Posted October 29, 2008 I am not using the tiki torches. The ones I am using are on the first page. They are designed for this purpose. They will be encased in a box that will look a present. The top of the projectors have a 2" lip around the nozzle and that lip will stick out of the top of box, so the units won't fall over. They will be placed on top of the front of my metal carport at the front that is 10' in height and at least 20' from the street. There are no obstructions around of above them at all and nobody will be able to get close to them at all except for maybe in under them if there were standing in the driveway, but that will not be possible. I will also only be using these on the weekends while I am present and outside. They will not be used in high winds as I noted on the first page as requested by the fire dept.These were mostly bought for my Halloween display for next year but I have a small place for them in my Christmas display. Fire is fire no matter if it is just a BBQ or a flame projector. The excellerant is the same so I am not sure what makes these any more unsafe then a BBQ in that sense, the danger is the same. You are just shooting flames into the air, what is really unsafe about that from a device that is made to do that if they are properly placed and procautions are taken? What makes a sniper dangerous other than his gun? Nothing. What makes a cliff dangerous to climb other than the fact it's so high up? Nothing. What makes a BBQ gril dangerous other then fire? Nothing. What makes these flame projectors dangerous other then fire? Nothing. Not sure what the point was you were trying to make, but I guess I missed it.I can not be held accountable for others peoples actions. If Joe sixpack sees this and wants to try it so be it. He could see this at a theme park, or haunted house, on TV and decide it wants to do the same thing. Seeing this in my display should not be held against me for his actions though. Same could be said about someone with no knowledge of electrcity and seeing a display with 50,000 lights dancing to the music and trying it and overloading a circut and burining is house down, or not using GFI and someon stepping in the yard. What makes lights dangerous other then electrcity? Nothing. Does that mean you are going to stop doing your display because of those dangers? No, I don't think you will.I didn't mean for this to start into a debate and I appreicate the concern. I have and will be taking the apporiate percautions and have had these apporved to use by my FD. So whether or not these are safe to use is not open for debate because I am using them anways. All I was asking was if LOR could control these? Through testing these have not misfired yet when flashing the DMX circuit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Fischer Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 Texan, it sounds like you've covered all your bases, and for that I applaud you. I'm not trying to attack you-- you asked "why is this more dangerous than a BBQ grill"... I mentioned why I thought that (grills don't shoot flames high in the air, nor should they be operated unattended. If you feel these are as safe as a BBQ, then we disagree. If you, rather, are saying that both BBQ grills and these fire-shooters require proper precautions, which if followed, renders them safe, then we do agree after all.I was speaking from my perspective. I wouldn't have a place to run these that wasn't too close to the house, or a tree, or something flamable, plus I wouldn't want to sit outside and supervise these every night. If you can accommodate that, and can get the proper regulatory approval, etc. then more power to ya -- I'd love to see the video!-Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melwelch Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 Well....For one thing unless I am home the sequences that are fire enhanced cannot run.. I have to change my show schedule to use the fire... Second unless I light the torches there is no fire... Third the height of mine lessons the danger. Forth I have security cameas and I am able to to watch my display. So I have a virtual barrier..The danger of knocking over Tiki torches (which by the way is used at parties where drunks suddenly appear) and spilling the kerosene is the most dangerious component. Hence I have rebar rods driven into the ground to help. Each torch has only approx. 1lb of gas.... I am burning gas and not liquid propane....Are my flame projectors 100% safe... no. Safe enough for home use... yes. Kids buy fireworks at Sam's club that are more dangerious.... Stage quality no... But I did not pay $160 each plus $250 for DMX interface...Lighten up and enjoy what I thought was a nice addition to my Halloween display... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Fischer Posted October 29, 2008 Share Posted October 29, 2008 melwelch wrote: Lighten up and enjoy what I thought was a nice addition to my Halloween display...Pun intended? Like I said, you're video is really cool. I enjoyed it...-Tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melwelch Posted October 30, 2008 Share Posted October 30, 2008 Thanks Tim....I did not catch the pun lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texan78 Posted October 30, 2008 Author Share Posted October 30, 2008 Tim Fischer wrote: Texan, it sounds like you've covered all your bases, and for that I applaud you. I'm not trying to attack you-- you asked "why is this more dangerous than a BBQ grill"... I mentioned why I thought that (grills don't shoot flames high in the air, nor should they be operated unattended. If you feel these are as safe as a BBQ, then we disagree. If you, rather, are saying that both BBQ grills and these fire-shooters require proper precautions, which if followed, renders them safe, then we do agree after all.I was speaking from my perspective. I wouldn't have a place to run these that wasn't too close to the house, or a tree, or something flamable, plus I wouldn't want to sit outside and supervise these every night. If you can accommodate that, and can get the proper regulatory approval, etc. then more power to ya -- I'd love to see the video!-TimWell technically I asked "What makes these flame projectors "unsafe" to use? Not dangerous, but unsafe to use?" I already know the potential dangers but I just don't see what the big deal if used properly with the proper safety measures. Yes I have all my bases covered and then some. Pretty much the point I was trying to make and this was told to me from the Captain at the FD. A flame is just as dangerous at 6 inches as it is 3-4'. Mine are not constantly lit like the torches so that is where I have the advantage. They are on demand flames via DMX. Also it just releases a flame ball into the air which dissipates very quickly. Not really giving it time to really do any damage anyways.These will only be used on Halloween Night as well as on the weekends during Christmas and on Christmas and Christmas Eve. I am taking extra steps as well. One being a friend of mine who is in the Fire control business is going to help me install in each box self contained fire suppression systems. So with that, the one way valves on each device, not running them during high winds, which it would probably ruin the effect anyways, and having them placed away from people and with no obstructions I am pretty good to go. I am not saying things can not happen from these devices. What I am saying is they are just as safe to use as a BBQ grill. They are pretty simple device. People still burn down houses yearly with BBQ grills both attended and unattended. Also what about the guy at the local circus and carnival who blows flames? Anything can happen on any given day with anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyC Posted November 6, 2008 Share Posted November 6, 2008 Mine is better i posted ages agohttp://au.youtube.com/watch?v=U1zrLb13GPo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melwelch Posted November 6, 2008 Share Posted November 6, 2008 I do not know why you say better..... Yours are $200 each ($64 + $140 each shipping) plus $250 for iDMX Mine $60 each.... period. I only made 4 this year for proof of concept... I do not see yours outside in the weather... Mine are water proof... Yours uses a fuel that is hard to find in the USA.. Mine uses common fuel found even at Walmart... Plus my tanks are refillable....So yes you can spend a lot of money for the same effect.... Better??? Its a matter of opinion.... Next season stand by for the next evolution in flame projectors... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iresq Posted November 6, 2008 Share Posted November 6, 2008 melwelch wrote: I do not know why you say better..... Yours are $200 each ($64 + $140 each shipping) plus $250 for iDMX Mine $60 each.... period. I only made 4 this year for proof of concept... I do not see yours outside in the weather... Mine are water proof... Yours uses a fuel that is hard to find in the USA.. Mine uses common fuel found even at Walmart... Plus my tanks are refillable....So yes you can spend a lot of money for the same effect.... Better??? Its a matter of opinion.... Next season stand by for the next evolution in flame projectors...Speaking of which, how's that how to coming? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melwelch Posted November 6, 2008 Share Posted November 6, 2008 I want be able to get to it till after Christmas... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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