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Time for a second network?


eurbani
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Maybe a second electrical meter          :)         That has to be quite a display.

I will be 90% LED this year and somewhere between 50-60K lights.  I just like the ability to micro manage the lights and control everything independently.

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Are there any guide lines out there to help  you decide if you are exceeding what a network can handle and when to think about setting up a new network?

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Are there any guide lines out there to help  you decide if you are exceeding what a network can handle and when to think about setting up a new network?

Inquiring minds want to know.   :)

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Last two years I used 10 networks.  I have two of these 10 port hubs, for everything usb.    I break networks down by speed and how they are used.  Several old AC controllers on regular speed.   All the CCx on highest speed with 200-400 pixels per network.  An arch can miss a few commands and you wont notice.  But a pattern on a matrix missing a command will draw your eye right to it.  Matrix get few pixels per network. 

 

How hard you push your CCx will definitely impact your need for a dedicated network. If you set all 50 pixels to white (r + g + B) at the same time that is a lot of commands 150. You can set resolution to 1 and pixel 1 to white and get the same effect with 1/50th of the commands.  

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817397019

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Last two years I used 10 networks.  I have two of these 10 port hubs, for everything usb.    I break networks down by speed and how they are used.  Several old AC controllers on regular speed.   All the CCx on highest speed with 200-400 pixels per network.  An arch can miss a few commands and you wont notice.  But a pattern on a matrix missing a command will draw your eye right to it.  Matrix get few pixels per network. 

 

How hard you push your CCx will definitely impact your need for a dedicated network. If you set all 50 pixels to white (r + g + B) at the same time that is a lot of commands 150. You can set resolution to 1 and pixel 1 to white and get the same effect with 1/50th of the commands.  

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817397019

Thanks Bob.  You can't set resolution on the go, right?  Like in the middle of a sequence.  That is something with the hardware utility, correct?

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Found this ......seek and ye shall find http://forums.lighto...-more-channels/

OK, I'm an idiot (apparently), I have searched the forums and can't find this post.

 

Could you please (pretty please) post title of the post so I can find it.

 

I'm seeking, but not finding.   :(

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how many channels can lor handle - LOR S3 Software Suite - Light-O ...
forums.lightorama.com/index.php?/topic/26444-how...channels...‎Cached

 

http://forums.lightorama.com/index.php?/topic/26444-how-many-channels-can-lor-handle/

 

 

hope this helps

 

 

check out James Campbells thread.....(2nd one)

Edited by ezimnow
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There are many choices which impact this.  And many areas where improvement is needed. Sometimes people cross topics and obscure some positive things while discussing an issue.    I cant speak to the mega displays as I dont have one.  Just a measly 2400 pixels (all LOR) & 12 AC controllers about 7350 controlled channels.  

I am satisfied with my 2013 show results on network response to all my pixels.  But I had to expend extra effort with network setup to achieve it.  

 

One of the major snags people have is the visualizer favoring LOR controllers over DMX. It limits and imposes setup issues on DMX pixels which people are choosing due to cost. Upgrades are promised but uncertain.   I have not been impacted by this since I have at this time only LOR controllers.   There are lots of software options people are trying and switching to with success.   

 

There seems to be a lot of worry about the upper limits of S3.  Most people are not there and LOR can handle it.  If you are just adding your first pixel tree it will all work very well. There is a whole other topic about diy versus pnp.   If you are going with LOR plug and play controllers, then you have lots of breathing room to expand and have a successful show by adding networks with each batch of pixel controllers. 

 

 

 

 

how many channels can lor handle - LOR S3 Software Suite - Light-O ...
forums.lightorama.com/index.php?/topic/26444-how...channels...‎Cached

 

http://forums.lightorama.com/index.php?/topic/26444-how-many-channels-can-lor-handle/

 

 

hope this helps

 

 

check out James Campbells thread.....(2nd one)

 

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You can change the resolution on the fly.   Its the first macro channel (151) on LOR pixel controller setups.  Its very useful and often ignored.  Not sure but I think this is due to the mixture of pixel types and controllers people use and also the effect generators including SS are generic.

 

 

Thanks Bob.  You can't set resolution on the go, right?  Like in the middle of a sequence.  That is something with the hardware utility, correct?

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You can change the resolution on the fly.   Its the first macro channel (151) on LOR pixel controller setups.  Its very useful and often ignored.  Not sure but I think this is due to the mixture of pixel types and controllers people use and also the effect generators including SS are generic.

 

 

Thanks Bob.  You can't set resolution on the go, right?  Like in the middle of a sequence.  That is something with the hardware utility, correct?

Honestly I've done a ton of research on that, and the problem I ran into is that if your not computer tech savvy then the paperwork they give you that explains the macro channels you almost need to be an engineer to figure it out. Everytime some one asks people just say "oh it's easy, read your documentation". I gave up trying to use them because after weeks of trying I couldn't make them work. There should be videos on the LOR website explaining it, if so more people I'm sure would use it.

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Last two years I used 10 networks.  I have two of these 10 port hubs, for everything usb.    I break networks down by speed and how they are used.  Several old AC controllers on regular speed.   All the CCx on highest speed with 200-400 pixels per network.  An arch can miss a few commands and you wont notice.  But a pattern on a matrix missing a command will draw your eye right to it.  Matrix get few pixels per network. 

 

How hard you push your CCx will definitely impact your need for a dedicated network. If you set all 50 pixels to white (r + g + B) at the same time that is a lot of commands 150. You can set resolution to 1 and pixel 1 to white and get the same effect with 1/50th of the commands.  

 

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817397019

So forgive this dumb question: Let's say I currently have 3 usb ports on my computer (I'm running parallels on a mac to get to the PC side) with 3 networks (regular for my six 16 channel controllers, Aux A for 6-CCR's and Aux B for the other 2-CCR's, 12 dumb pixel strips and 400 CCP's.   Lets say I was to buy the hub as you suggest and plug it to one of the three USB ports on the mac- will that just expand that Com port for example or will it give me 10 discrete usb outputs that each will correspond to their own Com port?

 

Any clarification would be great. Thanks!

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I use the 485 to usb to control over 360 channels of ac channels. I have networked one switch to all my e1.31 stuff. I have three switches in the yard this year and I do run from switch to switch. The show ran great last year with only network issues on the ac channels that I created myself. I have 12 cards on one network carrying almost 10,000 channels this year.

 

Lats year show was over 500  ac channels with 5 cards of either a j1sys or sandevice on a single network. All my cables are buried and this does cause me an issue but I did install enough to break it into two networks if I need to.

Edited by Jeff Messer
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So forgive this dumb question: Let's say I currently have 3 usb ports on my computer (I'm running parallels on a mac to get to the PC side) with 3 networks (regular for my six 16 channel controllers, Aux A for 6-CCR's and Aux B for the other 2-CCR's, 12 dumb pixel strips and 400 CCP's.   Lets say I was to buy the hub as you suggest and plug it to one of the three USB ports on the mac- will that just expand that Com port for example or will it give me 10 discrete usb outputs that each will correspond to their own Com port?

 

Any clarification would be great. Thanks!

It would give you 10 discrete outputs. Note that on a PC, you may very well need to shuffle a bit to git the ports straightened out. Windows tends to not understand that a USB device is the same when plugged into different USB ports. For example if the USB adapter that is your regular network happens to be Com3:, it may have some other comm port number when plugged into a different port (either on the hob or directly into the computer. Granted that later versions of Windows handle that better than earlier versions, but it's still not perfect. With you running parallels on a mac, I cant imagine that it will be any better.

In any case, I strongly recommend a powered hub (which is the case with the one BobO suggested).

BTW, for what it's worth. I turned up my second network today for my year round landscape lighting. My Aux A network will have a single 8 port AC controller on it that will have a maximum of 3 channels on it that for the most part will go fully on, and stay that way overnight and then go off in the morning. About the lightest loading ever on a LOR network! Now you may ask why I'm running a separate network for that one controller? That one controller is in a completely different direction, so although I could run my network cable over there and back to start the rest of the network, it's just easier to use a separate network. I connected my third network today as well, although it won't get used except for Christmas. It will have 300 nodes of CCBs on it.

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Honestly I've done a ton of research on that, and the problem I ran into is that if your not computer tech savvy then the paperwork they give you that explains the macro channels you almost need to be an engineer to figure it out. Everytime some one asks people just say "oh it's easy, read your documentation". I gave up trying to use them because after weeks of trying I couldn't make them work. There should be videos on the LOR website explaining it, if so more people I'm sure would use it.

 

I am in the same boat. I have read and tried to use macros and could never make them work.

And I am a computer geek!

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I am in the same boat. I have read and tried to use macros and could never make them work.

And I am a computer geek!

I will start a new thread on this topic.  Maybe we can get a little team viewer meeting going.   My sequences use macros heavily, especially the resolution. 

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Now you may ask why I'm running a separate network for that one controller? That one controller is in a completely different direction, so although I could run my network cable over there and back to start the rest of the network, it's just easier to use a separate network.

The USB485B has 2 RJ-45 sockets on it. Why didn't you use one socket for one direction and the other for the other direction?

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The USB485B has 2 RJ-45 sockets on it. Why didn't you use one socket for one direction and the other for the other direction?

 

Yea, I could have done that if I were using USB485Bs - but I'm not.  As I'm not powering anything from the USB, I never had a reason to even look at the USB485B.  Did not even think about it having multiple outputs.  Besides, I already had a USB485 as a spare so that became network Aux A.  I did recently buy 2 USB-RS485-HS as I wanted the high speed for my CCPs, and figured I would buy 2 so I have a spare HS adapter.  I realize that a spare RS485 adapter is one of the most important spare parts since it would take out the entire show for most people if it crapped out...

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Yea, I could have done that if I were using USB485Bs - but I'm not

Here's a little-known fact: You can make your USB485 into a 2-jack  device with one of these:

RJ45-Cat-5-6-Ethernet-Splitter-Connector

You use a very short(!) cable between the USB485 and this splitter.

This does not make the network into a 'Y' network (as long as the cable is short). It's still a straight-line daisy-chain.

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I plan to build a 16 CCR tree, do you recommend one or two networks for this? Only one LOR1602W, and three CMB24D so a total of 20 controllers in my setup plans.

Edited by eravndal
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