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Has anyone had any problems with random blinks or fades when viewing a sequence in the sequence editor? I setup my sequence the way I want it. I went to show it to my wife, and if you watch carefully there will be spots where during a fade down it gets brighter for a split second. Or I had spots where a channel should be off, and it clicks REALLY FAST on then off. I've checked the channel and there 's nothing there. Then I'll run it again anticipating the exact error so I can correct it, and it doesn't happen again? I've double checked and my mp3 file was saved as a CBR. Any other ideas? I think I read somewhere that sometimes the show editor will do this, but when you run it as an actual show this will not happen. Any ideas? I know my description isn't that great, but it's hard to explain what I'm seeing.

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jrez wrote:

Has anyone had any problems with random blinks or fades when viewing a sequence in the sequence editor? I setup my sequence the way I want it. I went to show it to my wife, and if you watch carefully there will be spots where during a fade down it gets brighter for a split second. Or I had spots where a channel should be off, and it clicks REALLY FAST on then off. I've checked the channel and there 's nothing there. Then I'll run it again anticipating the exact error so I can correct it, and it doesn't happen again? I've double checked and my mp3 file was saved as a CBR. Any other ideas? I think I read somewhere that sometimes the show editor will do this, but when you run it as an actual show this will not happen. Any ideas? I know my description isn't that great, but it's hard to explain what I'm seeing.

The Sequence Editor is resource intensive. You will see random artifacts on your screen while viewing in the sequence editor. Not often, mind you, but sometimes it just can't keep up.

When you run the sequence via a show in the scheduler, you should have no problems.
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I left 1 part out. I hooked up lights and I was seeing the random blinks in the actual lights not the animation. Does this still hold true?

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Were you running off a generator or inverter? We are all currently testing different ways to power and on fade downs you get that phenomenon that you mentioend with inverters, and often generators.

Maybe your line supply voltage is not clean?

One other thing to check, sometimes when doing fade downs in the sequencer, I change my mind and shorten the fade down, then I forget there's a few cells of residual fade down left at the bottom of the ramp that need to be cleared, so I go in and clean them up.

Also, back to back fades too close to one another can look like a quick blink as one ends and the next one starts.

Do any of these apply to you?

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One night while viewing my display I would notice very quick off-on action at the high point of a fade. In this case, the fade went from about 0% to 50% and back to 0% over a period of about 4 seconds. Right at the 50% mark would be where it did a quick flash off then back on. Reviewing the animation, there was no blank cell that should intentionally cause this blink.

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jrez wrote:

I left 1 part out. I hooked up lights and I was seeing the random blinks in the actual lights not the animation. Does this still hold true?

Anytime you are running off the sequence editor, be it with the animation, or real lights, you can expect some small, minor glitches.

Since you have lights hooked up, it's best to go ahead and load it into a show and schedule. Then enable shows (in the Control Panel.) to see if you get the same result.
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roadnut wrote:

One night while viewing my display I would notice very quick off-on action at the high point of a fade. In this case, the fade went from about 0% to 50% and back to 0% over a period of about 4 seconds. Right at the 50% mark would be where it did a quick flash off then back on. Reviewing the animation, there was no blank cell that should intentionally cause this blink.

I have a sequence that does that with 100% repeatability. A sequence of fade up/downs where I'm getting a micro blink-out at the top and bottom of the fades. I would have complained, but I liked the effect too much. It really gave it some punch.

The new firmware (v4.01) didn't do anything positive or negative regarding this problem.

TO JREZ:

LED lights or regular lights? I'm wondering if a firmware upgrade would do anything for you.
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i may have a fix for you. i had the same prob that when there was a fade down the lights would blink once in a wile. i was told (and yes this sucks) that if you go into your sequence and redo the fade (basically put the same fade over the existing one) it usally clears up the problem. worked for me so far. hope this helps. the problem is sometimes there is a slight chage in timeing due to adding an event or changing the entire lenght of the sequence.:waycool:

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Thanks for the responses everyone. I'll try loading into a show this weekend to see if that solves the problem. I'm using regular 100ct mini lights. I'll also check my fades as I have done some tweeking recently to make some of them longer or shorter. The part that's strange is that when I run the show again, the same blinks may or may not be there. It seems rather random. Like I said I 'll try running it from a show and see how that goes.

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I know I have had that problem before (2005 season) when I would copy/cut and paste a fade to another channel, or when I would split an event. My fades would chop it up. I started to view them as ramps, and that helped me see them a bit better, and then I would redo the problem fades and they went away.

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I've been seeing a similar issue. My halloween display is only about 12 channels, 6 red and 6 orange. I have a 5 min sequence that runs during the week that just fades up the reds over 25 secs, leaves them up for about 3 mins, then fades them down over 25 secs. The oranges do the same thing, but the fade up starts about 2 mins into the seq. The effect is that the reds fade up, then the oranges fade up, then the reds fade down, then the oranges fade down.

At the very end of the seq, when the reds have been off for about 2-3 mins, and the oranges are fading down, in the last 2-3 secs of the sequence, all the red channels blink on at very low intensity for about 2 secs.

So far, I'm not that worried about it, but I've gone over the sequence, and set all the reds to off again from the point they fade down to the end of the seq, and it didn't seem to help. This is a musical seq, but it's just generated silence for Audacity.

The actually musical sequence I run on the weekends (Theme from Buffy the Vampire Slayer TV Show) runs perfectly, so I haven't been too worried about it.

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I don't know if this is the exact same problem you are having but I have confirmed with Dan at LOR that there is a bug issue sometimes when doing quick fades. Try fading up and down between 0%-50% real fast and you will see what I mean.

You can see an example in the video below

http://www.barncow.com/christmas/lorbug3.wmv

You will notice that I have all these lights fade up and down at the same time. You will noticed that it does some wired stuff when I fade up and down to a lower level than 100%. In this example I think I am fading up and down between 0% and 50%. You will notice that some channels don't come up and I was able to find a combination where none of the lights fade up and down.

My problem is that I created a lot of sequences that use Organic type patterns where it depends on fast fades not reaching 100%.

Dan said this issued is resolved in LOR2 and if LOR2 is not released in time for this season, they will release a point release that fixes this bug and a few others.

I am getting a little nervous because all my sequences are on hold until I know for sure I can depend on my quick short fades.

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RichardH wrote:

Dan said this issued is resolved in LOR2 and if LOR2 is not released in time for this season, they will release a point release that fixes this bug and a few others.

I am getting a little nervous because all my sequences are on hold until I know for sure I can depend on my quick short fades.

I wonder what is causing that for you. I've got quick short fades all over the place and I'm not bumping into that fade problem.

In other news... a point release sounds great! Until... now I'm worried. They have a contingency plan in case LOR2 is late? OH NOES! (Must I always find the negative spin to every piece of good news?!?!) :D
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jmccorm (and anybody else that wants to try)

Would you mind running this sequence on your system and hardware and see what you get?

http://www.barncow.com/christmas/lorbug.lms

This is the sequence that I have in the video file and it would be interesting to see if this sequence does the same thing for other people.

I have tried this sequence on two different computers and two different controllers and I get the same result.

Thanks.

-Richard

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Okay, now I see what is going on! Everything ran screwed up until 12.00 into the sequence. It was fine after that.

I remember now! I ran into a very similar situation!

I had an extremely fast cross-fade going that covered an area of 10 seconds, 16 channels, and .05 time slices. Each and every block had its own fade up or down going on (and it would change in a pattern kind of like a chase). And it was the craziest thing. It wouldn't play right at all! I mean, it didn't play anything like the sequence on the screen should. And everything worked okay before and after it.

A bit more playing around and I think I discovered, at least, my explanation for the problem. (Don't know if it is true or not.) I exceeded the bandwidth of the RS232 connection to the LOR unit. 16 channels requiring a constant change, 20 times a second. I assumed that a fade was the most bandwidth intenstive command. So I figured that I had far too much going on for it to keep up with.

I'd have to plug in an RS232 analyzer or something into the connection (which I don't have handy) and snoop the connections to the LOR to confirm it, but that was my best guess as to what was going on. Fades are bandwidth expensive. Too many individual commands too fast, and everything breaks.

It would also explain why LOR II wouldn't have this problem. I thought I read somewhere that they use a more bandwidth efficient communications protocol with the units.

EDIT: I'm willing to be wrong. But that was my speculation at the time. I think I based it off of the fact that the channels on the other controllers in the LOR chain were also acting ill during that part of the sequence.

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It could be a bandwidth problem but you will notice that the fast fades that go from 0%-100% work fine but the fades that go from 0%-30% are having problems. I don't know much about how the protocol works but I am assuming that it would be the same bandwidth since the amount of fades is the same, the only difference is in the brightness of the fade.

It will be interesting to try these same patterns with D-Lights Spectrum software that is suppose to be out next week and see what happens.

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FWIW, my fades that had the problems were micro changes, like fade up from 64 to 65 or fade down from 35 to 34.

What I had done is, over the course of 200 squares or so, made a gigantic fade up and on the next line made a gigantic fade down over the course of 200 squares.

Then I mixed the individual blocks of either the fade up or the fade down into the sixteen squares below in a way that made a really neat pattern. Everything said it should have worked, but it ended up totally failing as in the lights completely not following what was going on.

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There is a known problem with short fades. The exact parameters of "short" are not exact because it depends on a combination of degree of intensity change and the time interval. The effect of this issue is wierd because it can cause problems on different channels or even different controllers then the channel with the short fade.

There is not a bandwidth issue here. We have people with 600+ channel shows with lots of fast fades in them. Granted lots of fades on a 0.05 grid will generate lots of data but with 16 channels that will not be an issue.

While talking about bandwidth, under Edit->Preferences->Network Preferences make sure that the Old-MCP is not selected. That will affect your bandwidth.

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LightORama wrote:

There is a known problem with short fades. The exact parameters of "short" are not exact because it depends on a combination of degree of intensity change and the time interval. The effect of this issue is wierd because it can cause problems on different channels or even different controllers then the channel with the short fade.

There is not a bandwidth issue here. We have people with 600+ channel shows with lots of fast fades in them. Granted lots of fades on a 0.05 grid will generate lots of data but with 16 channels that will not be an issue.

While talking about bandwidth, under Edit->Preferences->Network Preferences make sure that the Old-MCP is not selected. That will affect your bandwidth.




So I have to ask...do we need to adjust our sequences to avoid the problem, or will there be a small patch to fix the issue? It would be helpful to know either way so we have time to rework our sequences. (I have a couple with this issue.)


Thanks Dan!
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LightORama wrote:

There is not a bandwidth issue here. We have people with 600+ channel shows with lots of fast fades in them. Granted lots of fades on a 0.05 grid will generate lots of data but with 16 channels that will not be an issue. .


Interesting! Thanks, Dan.
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Thanks again for all the help. I tried running my sequence as show, and it worked perfectly. There were no random blinks or jumps in my fades.

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contactmike1 wrote:

So I have to ask...do we need to adjust our sequences to avoid the problem, or will there be a small patch to fix the issue? It would be helpful to know either way so we have time to rework our sequences. (I have a couple with this issue.)


Thanks Dan!


OK, I didn't read the whole thing. Running it as a show and not in the sequence editor fixes the problem for me. :)
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Dan,

I have an area that is not fading up properly. It goes from 0 to approx 80% over 8 events that are .1 seconds each. (There are a lot of other fade ups going on at that time.) What is happening is that it seems to not be fading up quick enough and suddenly comes on pretty bright after the fade ends and the next event is a solid 80% intensity block.

I have rewritten that section for channel but it doesn't help. Actually, this same thing happens in two channels (Carport Blue and Left Roof Outline White) at the same time, which are doing roughly the same thing.

Can I send you the sequence to look at, or is this enough to go on?

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