HOA Grinch Starts early - Tells homeowner to take down their Christmas Display

[Orville]

Family told to take down their Christmas Display by HOA because it's too soon to decorate

Guess this HOA would really have an issue with a lot of us here since some of us start this process as early as the summer months {very large displays} and others start on November 1 to be ready by Thanksgiving.  And this HOA says November 1 is too early to be decorating!  Say what?

The HOA in this neighborhood are the epitome of a Grinch or Scrooge.  Take your pick.

But when the residents heard about, they backed their neighors and now they are putting up their Christmas Displays to show the HOA, they mean business and don't mess with the "Christmas Spirit!"

 

Edited November 15, 2019 by Orville

[Mr. P]

The bottom line with HOA's is that it all comes down to the written rules. Most Covenants will state if and/or when Holiday decorations can be displayed. If the homeowners do not like the rules they can A.) move, B.) round up their neighbors and fight the HOA, or C.) get elected to the Board and change the rules. Me personally I chose C. I was elected to my HOA back in 2013 because I didn't like many of their rules and thought many were outdated, so I decided it was time for a change.

When you move into a HOA community you sign a contract at closing agreeing to the rules, don't complain if you don't like them.

[dibblejr]

8 hours ago, Orville said:

Family told to take down their Christmas Display by HOA because it's too soon to decorate

Guess this HOA would really have an issue with a lot of us here since some of us start this process as early as the summer months {very large displays} and others start on November 1 to be ready by Thanksgiving.  And this HOA says November 1 is too early to be decorating!  Say what?

The HOA in this neighborhood are the epitome of a Grinch or Scrooge.  Take your pick.

But when the residents heard about, they backed their neighors and now they are putting up their Christmas Displays to show the HOA, they mean business and don't mess with the "Christmas Spirit!"

 

Actually the homeowner(s) would have the issues. The HOA would fine them if the fine is not paid its simple, the place on Lien on the home. This would prevent the homeowner from selling the home without paying the debt. They can also take the home owner to court and most HOA's have more lawyers in their pocket than a homeowner.

As Mr.P said "its all in the contract" you violate the contract that's on you. Sheer numbers alone wont do anything, however if someone runs to take over the HOA council changes can be made to the HOA's contracts, if the community votes them in.

Small communist run town with HOA Napoleon Syndrome. 

That's why I lost a lot of money in the one HOA sub div I ever lived in because the wife loved the house. Lived there one year and took a huge loss in order to move. The day of our closing a citation was left on our door because the grass was 4", max height of grass was 3". If I would have drove by just prior to closing we would not have closed. I went to the HOA and told them it wasn't our home at the time they left the citation. There words "you have 24 hours to cut the grass or we will fine you $50 per day". Hired a company to maintain our yard that day. We ended up with a $200 lien that we had to pay before we sold the home 7 months later.

I did decorate but they would not allow any lights. Only the fancy wreaths, white, gold and silver "tasteful décor". They did not allow any home to stand out from the rest.

JR

[radioguy1007]

Before I moved into my HOA, I carefully went over the rules as I have a somewhat larger display than a typical homeowner.  There was nothing in the rules about holiday lighting, and I verified that it would not be an issue with them.  After about 5 years an issue did arise - and involved my "tune to" message board.  Apparently a resident put up some sort of religious sign and "signs" are prohibited.  So this resident put up a complaint about my "hear the lights - tune radio to 97.7FM" message board made from mini lights that alternated between the two phrases.  Nothing was said about the numerous Merry Christmas, Happy New Year and Peace On Earth signs in my display.  Well because you cannot see the message board during the day (the lights are off), the board gave me an exception as long as I request permission to do it every year.  My neighbor across the street did get a letter from the HOA board last year about his Christmas lights - they told him to take them down.  But that was in July.....

[tlogan]

Guess I've been pretty lucky with my HOA (although, full disclosure,  I AM President now). We're only 45 houses so it's all been pretty friendly. We've only gone the fine and lien route in the most extreme cases. The last one was we had a house that was going to foreclosure and  it was bought by someone who thought they could quickly flip it. New owner had a buyer but the buyer backed out after finding out how much work needed to be done inside. The owner let the grass get over a foot high. We sent several notices that were ignored, so we hired a company to cut it weekly and billed and fined him and it finally started getting taken care of after that. That house is STILL being worked on, but the grass gets cut. Before I was on the board, I used to get those "cut the grass" notices, too and most of the time it was an inch or two too tall. That was usually because it would be high 90-100 degree, high humidity for a week and then rain and grass would shoot up over the next couple of sunny days. Same thing when I knew it needed to get cut but rained every weekend for three weekends in row. Since I've been on the board, I managed to get the management company that sends the notices to take the weather into account when they walk the neighborhood. We've had someone replace the siding on their entire house with non-approved style and color, but decided we weren't going to make them redo it. Instead we worked on the lines of communication required to stop it from happening again. I think one the things that really helps is that we have a social committee and one of the main things they do is sponsor and coordinate deck parties in the summer. Someone hosts on their deck (or inside if they want when it rains). It's BYOB and the host can supply whatever snack or food they want.  Most will fire up a grill for burgers or dogs but some go all out. The thing is , you get to meet and socialize with your neighbors and it's always a good time. That makes it MUCH easier if there IS a problem.

The nice thing is, the only restriction on decorations is that they are supposed to be down two weeks after the holiday. So I stretch Christmas to the actual 12th day of Christmas which is January 6th (don't get me started on ALL the decorations and music down the day after Christmas in the stores and the radio stations that started playing 24 hour Christmas music before Thanksgiving and stop the day after Christmas) . I can usually find a decent weekend day to get everything down within two weeks after that as almost all of my stuff is ground level props and easily reached lights. I can at least haul everything into the garage and pack it up for storage out of the weather.

It seems that EVERY neighborhood has "one." Somebody that is just plain anti-social and angry at something and is never happy unless they're complaining about something. If you live in an HOA, and you don't like the way it is being run, get on the board. You'd probably be surprised to find out how many of the board members would LOVE for someone else to do it. Once you do it, you'll have much better understanding and can work to change things for the better.

[TheDucks]

Gotta love the USA. I am in violation of my (property management co) lease, because I had a US FLAG on display above my Garage door for Veterans day . The real property owner has not said anything.

One (and just about the only one that I will not waive) of my rental site choice rules: NO HOA

[tlogan]

You might want to do some research on the flag issue. I believe there are two things in US law that override anything the HOA can rule on. One is display of the flag and the other is the HOA can not restrict the placement of a satellite dish such that you cannot get service. Most HOAs say the dish can't be in the front of the house, but if that is the ONLY way you can get service, you can do it and they can't stop you.

[TheDucks]

54 minutes ago, tlogan said:

You might want to do some research on the flag issue. I believe there are two things in US law that override anything the HOA can rule on. One is display of the flag and the other is the HOA can not restrict the placement of a satellite dish such that you cannot get service. Most HOAs say the dish can't be in the front of the house, but if that is the ONLY way you can get service, you can do it and they can't stop you.

I don't have the $$$$$$$ to fight this (it was not a actual problem). There are so many ways around those laws. A BUILDING PERMIT is needed for a Flag Pole (this was a real blocking method. Someone els had to REMOVE their unpermitted pole AND pay a huge fine). The Dish wires must be hidden: (Building permit needed to modify structure or HOA needs to approve the mods...Not gonna happen. You might MOUNT the dish, but it is unusable without wires )

I love where I am now. I see more flags flown every day than I saw on Flag day in my old town. 👍

[tlogan]

I was thinking along the lines of research. like the internet. Took me 2 minutes to find this:

"If the flag your HOA is prohibiting is the good old stars and stripes, the HOA is probably out of line. Your right to display the United States flag is protected by federal law. The “Freedom to Display the American Flag Act of 2005” makes it illegal for an HOA to restrict owners from displaying a U.S. flag.

Your HOA can, however, reasonably restrict the time, place, and manner of your flag display (provided the restrictions are to protect a substantial interest of the association). For example, your HOA can ban a U.S. flag that might be a danger, such as one on a rickety flagpole over a public sidewalk. The HOA probably also has the right to prohibit a flag so large it blocks a neighbor’s views.

Check your state’s laws, also. Some states prevent HOAs from banning certain other types of flags, such as Native American flags, state flags, or officialU.S.military flags. As with federal law, however, state laws typically still give the HOA the right to reasonably regulate such things as the location and size of flags."

Link: Link

 

and another 2 minutes to find this:

"In 1996, the FCC adopted the Over the Air Reception Device Rule, or OTARD rule. In short, the OTARD rule prohibits homeowners’ associations and condominium associations from placing restrictions on residents which impede the installation, maintenance, or use of satellite dishes, TV antennas, or wireless cable antennas.

The purpose of this rule is to encourage the free market of cable providers by preventing people from being locked into a single television provider that has been determined by the association in which they live."

Link: Link 2

There is interesting stuff in that link about what HOAs can and can't do about dishes. Most likely, the HOA has no idea about these rules and laws. A little knowledge can go a long way in these cases.

 

[Orville]

This is why I'm glad I DO NOT LIVE IN A HOA, nothing but gestapo brained power mad folks are what are usually in charge of them.  I think ALL HOA's should be OUTLAWED or YOU, the PROPERTY/HOMEOWNER should also HAVE THE RIGHT to NOT BE A PART of one.   Seems that in the USA where we are supposed to have FREEDOM OF CHOICE, there are choices made {er FORCED} on us that should be OUR CHOICE.  And HOA's are one, Auto Insurance is another that should be a CHOICE, NOT A LAW.

If I ever move, I'm making sure there is NO HOA in the neighborhood and if someone tries to start one they're going to be in for one heck of a fight.

Oh and I don't take my Christmas Display down until AFTER January 8, and if some uninformed person complains, that date is 3 Kings Day in the Spanish community, and most folks in my neighborhood are of Spanish descent {Puerto Rico, Cuba} and that's when they take down their Christmas Decor.  When I first moved in I used to take it down by Dec. 31, maybe as late as Jan 3.  But my Spanish neighbors asked me to start leaving my display in operation 'til Jan. 8, so I do that now.

Guess the HOA's would be royally irked at that date and complain my display is up past it's cut off date they'd prefer to set, like maybe the day right after Christmas!    HOA's seem to always have quite a few BAH HUMBUGS in them, and I just can't stand that kind of mentality!

 

[Orville]

6 minutes ago, tlogan said:

I was thinking along the lines of research. like the internet. Took me 2 minutes to find this:

 

 

and another 2 minutes to find this:

"In 1996, the FCC adopted the Over the Air Reception Device Rule, or OTARD rule. In short, the OTARD rule prohibits homeowners’ associations and condominium associations from placing restrictions on residents which impede the installation, maintenance, or use of satellite dishes, TV antennas, or wireless cable antennas.

The purpose of this rule is to encourage the free market of cable providers by preventing people from being locked into a single television provider that has been determined by the association in which they live."

Link: Link 2

There is interesting stuff in that link about what HOAs can and can't do about dishes. Most likely, the HOA has no idea about these rules and laws. A little knowledge can go a long way in these cases.

 

Hmmm, may have to look into this one.  My Manufactured Home Park Office Manager and Personnel say we can't put up an outside TV antenna on our homes in the park.  The reason they give they are an eyesore, other than that reason, no other is given.   And since these are basically "glorified mobile homes", I wonder if this info also pertains to them, which would then allow me to put up an outside TV antenna and they couldn't do anything about it, as long as this law is accurate and encompasses all states and properties no matter where they're located.  Going to have to check this one out.

 

[TheDucks]

41 minutes ago, Orville said:

Hmmm, may have to look into this one.  My Manufactured Home Park Office Manager and Personnel say we can't put up an outside TV antenna on our homes in the park.  The reason they give they are an eyesore, other than that reason, no other is given.   And since these are basically "glorified mobile homes", I wonder if this info also pertains to them, which would then allow me to put up an outside TV antenna and they couldn't do anything about it, as long as this law is accurate and encompasses all states and properties no matter where they're located.  Going to have to check this one out.

 

The problem with these laws is enforcement and retaliation prevention. 

You might get your antenna and a few months later an eviction notice for something else (minor). Just look at age discrimination law. It is very hard to prove that was the reason you were 'let go'

[LOR Staff]

Must be season, time for the annual outrage about the war on Christmas.  I see the same group of people involved.

If I see this thread get out of hand, I will put people on moderation.  If you are about to post about how nothing is wrong, etc you are probably one of the first people to be on that list.

My fuse right now is VERY short.  Be cool.

[Orville]

20 hours ago, DevMike said:

Must be season, time for the annual outrage about the war on Christmas.  I see the same group of people involved.

If I see this thread get out of hand, I will put people on moderation.  If you are about to post about how nothing is wrong, etc you are probably one of the first people to be on that list.

My fuse right now is VERY short.  Be cool.

Perhaps just go ahead and lock down this thread before that happens?  I've stated my piece and that's it for me.