G3 MP3 Director Network Questions

[Obejohnknobe]

Hello everyone!

Hope everyone is preparing their light shows and is going well.  I have one the newer G3 MP3 Directors with the latest firmware (5.16???) and have a network question on the Director as well as the software.  I have a physical cat 5 port as well as a phone port (RJ11 and RJ45 ports) on network 1 and a network 2 with a cat 5 port.  In the HU it asks if you have 1, 2, or 4 ports (I am guessing "network" ports) and I select 2 for 2 networks.  The HU always ask for how many networks in the show.  For now I select 1 network and use the cat 5 port on network 1 and have no issues.  Can you have 2 networks with the same show?  For instance, I would like to "parallel" off the #2 port to support the other side of my house instead of running a couple of long cat 5 cables for a possible "tangle foot" trap.  Do you have to separate the show into 2 portions in order to make it happen or am I making this too complicated and just connect to the #2 port and tell the HU there is 2 networks?

Thanks for taking your time out of your busy lighting schedules to help me out!

John M.

[tomsusie]

It's not as complicated as you think John.  Port 1 is the regular speed network and Port 2 (aux) can be run at as a normal or high speed network.  High speed can be good when running RGB lights.  You can run your program from one sequence.  You specify which network each channel runs in the channel configuration where you indicate it if it is running on the regular network or aux network.  So in your case you could run the left side on the regular network and the right side on the aux network.  And then when you get to the HU you select 2 networks (4 is for future Directors).  Hope that helps.

Tom

[Obejohnknobe]

Thanks Tom,

When in HU, I normally select 500k on port 1 with 2 ports and can be run in enhanced mode (1 M or called 1000k), but it does not let me select anything for port 2.  I run mostly pixels with 1- ctb16 that runs my led trees and Rudolph's nose.  When you say channel config you are referring to SE and will the HU sense there is 2 networks?  I will look and really appreciate the help.  Will let you know how that turns out this afternoon.

John

Edited November 19, 2018 by Obejohnknobe
wording and more info

[Orville]

1 hour ago, Obejohnknobe said:

Thanks Tom,

When in HU, I normally select 500k on port 1 with 2 ports and can be run in enhanced mode (1 M or called 1000k), but it does not let me select anything for port 2.  I run mostly pixels with 1- ctb16 that runs my led trees and Rudolph's nose.  When you say channel config you are referring to SE and will the HU sense there is 2 networks?  I will look and really appreciate the help.  Will let you know how that turns out this afternoon.

John

1M = 1,000,000K, not 1K.   1K = 1,000.  And nothing LOR currently has to my knowledge runs anywhere near 1M, at least not yet. 

But could you imagine LOR Controllers operating at 1 million speed?  Maybe one day in the future, but for now we're limited to 1K or 1,000 speeds and that's only for a Pixie 16 Controller!

[Obejohnknobe]

Hi Tom,

I went to NP the Advanced LOR Network Configuration v4.3.26 and changed the Aux A to 500k to see if there were any changes to the channel configuration selection in SE sequences.  All I see is the network selection is grayed out and cannot select it all.  It appears this is for the computer when I do more research in the LOR forum and YouTube and not the director.  Can you advise?

Thanks,

John

[Obejohnknobe]

Hi Orville,

I am trying to understand where you got that number but when it comes to numbers but 1000k is 1 meg or 1,000,000 is equal to 1000k or 1m.  Now if we are talking bits or bytes, it would be another issue.  If we are talking about 1000kbps or 122kBps (bits vs bytes) then yes, the speed is not quite 1mBps from my formal instruction.  Or do I misunderstand what you are saying?  Please correct me if I misunderstand!

Thanks,

John

[Orville]

The changes WILL NOT BE AUTOMATIC in the SE, you have to go to Tools, then Channel Config to see the Network information, it will not show you the network speed, only the network the controller is assigned too when you first created the sequence.  To change controller info you have to look at the bottom of the Channel Config window and click on Change Controller, a pop up window will open and show all your controllers, click on the one you want to change, now go to the bottom of the window and you'll see 3 boxes, the top one you can't change, the second is Network, there is a little arrow to the right side of the box, click the small arrow, you will see a list of Networks, pick the one you just set in the Network Configuration Utility, the last and 3rd box is the Controller "Unit" #, if the controller unit # has not changed, leave this alone, otherwise change it to the controller you want it to be, then click OK, another pop up will as you if you are sure you want to change this controller, Click Yes, and all network info will be changed for that controller and ONLY that controller.  You will have to do this for each network change made to any controller in the sequence.  And if you ever change the Network configuration again on any of the controllers set in the SE, you will need to repeat these steps again.

[Orville]

I worked in electronics and in explosive devices and even installing data lines for offices, 1M = 1 Million always, no matter what it is, so 1M would always convert to K as 1,000,000K,  1K can not translate to 1M, as 1K is only 1,000 {one thousand} and why it can not be 1M.   It would never correlate, and could cause some disastrous results if you used 1M for 1K in any of these environments, especially electronic components or explosive devices, because if it ran faster than anticipated that electronic fuse may detonate sooner than the user believed and that could end in serious injury or death, in electronic circuitry same thing, depending on type of circuit, voltages and such, one wrong component value and it could cause some serious injury, and again, even death depending on what happens when the circuit gets charged and something possibly explodes on the circuit board.

You have to be extremely careful with numbers and values.   In all my years I have NEVER, not one time ever heard 1K correlate as 1M, they would never be the same.    At least I have never heard of them being identified as interchangeable and I did this kind of work for over 40 years.

[Obejohnknobe]

Hi Orville,

I just did this so if I get this understanding correct, I can put half of my lights on the regular network and the other on Aux A.  I then can see in the HU where I can put half in port one and the other in port 2?

Thanks again for quickly helping me out!!!

John

 

[Orville]

Just now, Obejohnknobe said:

Hi Orville,

I just did this so if I get this understanding correct, I can put half of my lights on the regular network and the other on Aux A.  I then can see in the HU where I can put half in port one and the other in port 2?

Thanks again for quickly helping me out!!!

John

 

Yes, I would think you should be able to do that as long as you use the same comm port for both ports, but sometimes this software dioesn't work as we think it should.   And in that case, you may have to add a second comm port to Aux A, I have Comm3 as my Regular LOR Network and Comm4 as my 2nd Network, in the SE these all work together, in the HWU they don't, you have to select comm3 to test those controllers and then select comm4 to test the 2nd half, if 2 comm ports are required.  I've never tried it using the same comm port for 2 different networks, so I'm not sure how that will work, but in case it doesn't, then you'll need tos et a 2nd comm port up for the other half.  In the HWU, it will ask when you change to the 2nd comm port "is the comm port you wish to use for your show", always say no to this, otherwise, it'll really foul you up when you run a sequence, because for some reason, if you select the 2nd comm port, the SE won't run the first half of the controllers.   I disabled that screen after I got my 2 networks set up because I kept thinking the answer to the question was Yes and then half my display would not operate in the SE.   So in mine Comm3 is the one to run my shows, with comm 4 being secondary on the Aux A network.

[Obejohnknobe]

Hi Oville,

You must be EOD for the military at one time.  Kudos for you as I never would want to be one!  I served 20 years in the active duty AF as Ground Radio tech and worked with EOD in my later years.  Never want to be around any devices like that!!  I know we are probably on the same page but thinking out of sync do here goes,

1,000 = 1k

10,000 = 10k

100,000 = 100k

1,000,000 = 1000k

0.001m = 1k =1,000

0.01m = 10k =10,000

0.10m = 100k = 100,000

1m = 1,000k =1,000,000

Dealt with ohms, multiplexing speeds, bandwidth, frequency and list is long and distinguished when it comes to those numbers.  Just wish I could get the computer software to be that easy when it come to the LOR software.  You have been a great help on this software!

Thanks!

John

[Obejohnknobe]

Hi Orville,

I think I will run a longer cat 5 cable to the others and see if there is any lag.  I have my director in the middle of the light show but it would seem I could use the other port as another way to get it to the other half of my lights.  Seems complicated and time consuming to try this out so I think next year would be trial and error for this.

Thanks a bunch!

John

[Mega Arch]

3 hours ago, Obejohnknobe said:

....I think I will run a longer cat 5 cable to the others and.....

That’s what I do. Bought this kit on Amazon for $15. Buy cat5 at HD or the such. Easy peasy to make 200 ft cable.

https://www.amazon.com/UbiGear-Crimper-Connector-Network-Crimper315/dp/B008UY5WL0/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1542655379&sr=8-3&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&keywords=cat5+crimper+kit&dpPl=1&dpID=51DjZejC9oL&ref=plSrch

Also, trip hazard comment - I use cup hooks under the eaves. No trip & no see. 14” zipties to run down the gutter downspouts.

& 8” zipties to triple tie ends to controller yard stakes. Not gonna trip and pull my connection loose from the card..

Edited November 19, 2018 by Mega Arch

[Obejohnknobe]

Hello Mega Arch!

I have about 200 rj45 connectors and  about 50 Rj11 connectors (and XLR connectors) with the crimpers and tester unit from Amazon (500' for cat 5 cable too) ready to be used, thank you anyway for the thought.  On my eves, all pixels are on pvc pipe with the corostrips from Boysco and have a wiring central point coming down to my card.  10 porch posts use the same central point to get the wires to the LOR cards.  The comment about the tripping hazards is because I do not like cords in the way on the lawn (r. knee was replaced and difficult to lift at times when tired) but will have no option but to have more on the lawn.  What was meant about the trip hazard was the extra cat 5 I have to make to get from my sign to the Candy Canes to the leaping arches to the LED Christmas trees and lastly to the snowflakes.  Between each card is approximately 20 to 40 feet between each other and add in the extra power cords that go to each card (have 100 amp service temporarily put in the yard).   I do zip tie cords to each other when it is practical.  I was hoping someone could guide me to add another network to my G3MP3 director so I can separate half the lawn of props without the added cat5 cable.  Seems Mr Orville has shown me the "light" about programming the network for it.  I am thinking the RF linkers might do the trick but right now, just too much money and not enough time to accomplish it.  What is the saying? Not enough months in the year to get the projects completed in time for Christmas?  LOL  I still have a 16 strip mega tree (half built) and 6 channel pixel star (completed)  as well as adding 4 more snowflakes (need snowflakes and pixels) to my snowflake tree and 3 moving heads (purchased but need domes to protect it from elements) to add to the show. Those will not be in the show this year...rats!!!  Not to mention trying to add another network (programming) to the MP3 director.   Looks like more projects for next year!

Thank you,

John

[Orville]

9 hours ago, Obejohnknobe said:

Hi Oville,

You must be EOD for the military at one time.  Kudos for you as I never would want to be one!  I served 20 years in the active duty AF as Ground Radio tech and worked with EOD in my later years.  Never want to be around any devices like that!!  I know we are probably on the same page but thinking out of sync do here goes,

1,000 = 1k

10,000 = 10k

100,000 = 100k

1,000,000 = 1000k

0.001m = 1k =1,000

0.01m = 10k =10,000

0.10m = 100k = 100,000

1m = 1,000k =1,000,000

Dealt with ohms, multiplexing speeds, bandwidth, frequency and list is long and distinguished when it comes to those numbers.  Just wish I could get the computer software to be that easy when it come to the LOR software.  You have been a great help on this software!

Thanks!

John

Been a while since I've been into electronics {well past 20 years now, so I'm a bit rusty on this} and requiring resistance conversions, but actually that is actually correct.  Sometimes all those darn zeroes can foul up what you think it should be and why I would also ALWAYS confirmed it with a converter to make sure I did it correctly and used the correct resistor.   So I actually got that wrong, so much for my brain cells....LOL

But I had never heard it referenced that way in anything and so I think that's what actually threw me off on this one.   Sure glad I'm NOT working in that field any longer, but then again, if I was, I'd be more up on the newer terms they're using today.  Those things change faster than clockwork it seems.

Tried to serve in the military, but do to having asthma, got kicked out of that, but I worked hand in hand with Military folks in many of the companies they contracted to build those devices to protect our country {USA}.

And glad to be of help, although, on some occasions I may get something not quite the way I thought it worked {and how I ended up with MY signature tag line! 🤣} anyway if I happen to error, one of our other resident experts will chime in and correct my blunder.   I try NOT to make them, but then again, we're only human, and unfortunately we make mistakes at times.   At least I'll own up to mine if I do make a blunder! LOL

 

Edited November 20, 2018 by Orville

[Obejohnknobe]

Hey Orville,

No worries as I have made MANY mistakes over my life and will admit it also.  The bottom line is we try and either succeed or fail and learn from it.  Thank you for your service and appreciate all that you do.  Did my 20 and retired as it was getting too much wear and tear on my body. I always ask if I do not know what I am doing with this hobby and love everyone on this forum.  The help I receive here is outstanding!  I could not ask for a great bunch of people who love what they do and love to assist others in this hobby and that goes for you too!

Again,

Thanks!!!

John

[TheDucks]

John

I use the little wire 'U' for 1/4 in drip line to hold the wires down snug in path areas. Avoid staking AC and the CAT5 in the same hoop. get lots, in some places, you need 1 every foot (eg 3 per narrow pathway)

https://www.amazon.com/Orbit-Total-Stakes-Irrigation-Tubing/dp/B00MFWXSPA/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1542727304&sr=8-8&keywords=drip+stakes+1%2F4

[Obejohnknobe]

Hello "The Ducks",

Great idea/suggestion and just ordered 5 packages of them!  Important safety and interference issue you brought up about keeping the ac and the "information highway" separate.  Unless you have the shielded Cat 5 cable it is wise to keep them separate.  AC extension cords are noisy (from a 60 Hz perspective) and could induce a 60 cycle "hum" on your cat 5 cables.  Nothing is worse than getting AC on DC lines and possibly back to your power supplies in a worse case scenario.

Thanks for the idea!!!

John

[a31ford]

Lol,  just to add to all of this... 

 those cat 5 connectors and cables are actually running the RS-485, 2 wire protocol on them.

RS-485, IS the most robust comm's method around, (as long as BOTH ends of the line are terminated properly (50ohm resister at EACH end center 2 wires in this case)).

The jacks are Cat5, the way it's used is no where near the 6 wires used in 100baseT Cat 5....... shielded cable would be a waste of money (unless it was gotten real cheap).

Greg

Edited November 24, 2018 by a31ford
wording