kingfish Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 that's why I am an independent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LOR Staff Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 Performance/Creative rights are a very interesting area of law (or is it tedious?).... Probably tedious, but from my past life in the industry I've been exposed too often. For example, consider this: We all know that music works are copyrighted and RIAA likes to sue anyone who is illegally distributing a work. DJ's (those guys in clubs/etc) that remix songs live are performers who create works using recorded music. If the DJ elects to sell his performance, is it legal? Technically he is the owner of his performance and thus can sell it to whomever he wants. But the medium he is using is copyrighted, making his performance a derivative work -- which requires permission of the original author. ...And the next thing you know is that you are paying lawyers a lot of money, with no guarantee how things will go - since 'fair use' is an affirmative defense. The easiest way to ensure you are on the correct side of things is easy: Don't distribute anything that is not 100% yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Messer Posted June 30, 2015 Share Posted June 30, 2015 I always give back and say thanks for the hard work that someone spent a long time to program. I never mind giving out my number in a message to call me if they are having an issue that I can assist them with. I still think its all in fun dealing with this hobby. I guess I never let myself get down when dealing with Christmas lights. I am blessed just to be able to do a show each year and all the smiles I see when I am there causes me to think I am doing this for the right reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BryanZ Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 (edited) From what I have seen, most, myself included, try to publicly thank the person in advance of receiving the requested sequence. Most, much like myself, are interested to see if anyone has done a song not so much for their specific sequence but for the timing patterns. Let's face facts: our displays and tastes are different. What I think looks stellar you may see as a jumbled mess. Then again, I may have done a pattern which you really like and wish to replicate in your display and vice-versa. It is the sharing of ideas and creativity for the benefit of others who we may never know enjoying what we have done. I do this because I enjoy it. If others benefit from it, fantastic! jstroms with his tutorials has helped me out tremendously. (Truth be told, I rather wish he would show how to sequence a different and longer song than the 30 second 'Batman Smells' so I may better understand how he sequences a longer song. Even so, he was very gracious and kind and did the timings for Sweet Child of Mine for me, which was greatly appreciated!) Asking about a particular song has the added benefit of stirring others creative juices such that they may have never thought of sequencing a particular song to add it to their display or may enlighten them to other artists and styles of music. Thanks to all who have so graciously and generously freely shared their sequences with myself and others. The greatest thanks of all we can never put into words. Rather it is customizing their work to our displays to show the world what they have done. Edited July 1, 2015 by BryanZ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roverdish Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 I too have benefited greatly from shared sequences. I have modified, added too and subtracted from these to make them "my own". I feel free to share what was freely shared with me and what was modified by me. It is the generosity of others on this forum that bespeaks of the Christmas spirit that resides here. I don't share for the "thanks" but I do appreciate it when they come. I have only been asked to not share by one and I honored that request. (not a great sequence either) I don't think I have a single sequence that was shared with me that I have not modified in some way. (Except maybe one that was so excellently put together it would be a shame to alter it). I have over 18 hours of sequences to date. Currently working on "Papa was a rolling stone" by the Temptations. 7 minutes. Not Christmas but great song IMHO. Using SS, sequence editor, audacity and xlights Thanks to ALL for sharing sequences in the past and future.Old Sarge it is nice to see you growing into the hobby with such enthusiasm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Sarge Posted July 1, 2015 Author Share Posted July 1, 2015 give me something to do when I am not working on my honey do list from the boss... and its kinda fun to get a lot of things started on the forums at times like this.... lol...... Got to press some button at times to wake some people up...lol.. plus its fun at times to get a bucket of worms out and go fishing to just see all the different comments you can get people to come up with... I have already been thinking about what the next subject is that I can try to get people started on.. I know some really get upset easy to and at times that makes it even better because so many will jump right in with their opinions and thoughts about it,,, be for it or against it... thats what its all about.. as long as it gets more people talking about things and sharing thoughts,,, agreeable or disagreeable.. it makes no difference as long as they are saying something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orville Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 I have always shared my sequences as well, bad or good, I share them with newbies most often because it gives them at least a starting point to see how it's done. I have never expected thanks or compliments on anything I've shared, I've shared them so folks can "learn" how the Sequence Editor works, then they can change, tweak or do whatever they want to do to those sequences I have shared with them. Nothing more and nothing less. But I have received thanks and some compliments from my sharing my sequences, but have never expected it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Simmons Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 I stopped openly sharing sequences mostly due to rarely receiving even a thank you in return. And I'll be right up front about it. In fact, the straw that broke this sequencer's proverbial back was the day I got ragged up one side and down the other because I wouldn't illegally include a free copy of the audio file along with the sequence. Call me whatever you want, but when I give someone a project I've spent more than a week conjuring, building, and fine tuning - a gift that saves them at least days of their own time while also providing a better finished product than they'd likely come up with on their own - YES, I expect at least a thank-you. Maybe even a thank-you-very-much. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Box on Rails Posted July 14, 2015 Share Posted July 14, 2015 For me I put a lot of time into my sequences especially the singing faces. When I do share my work it is without expectation. For my own sanity I expect nothing and when People thank me that is an added bonus (most people are grateful). I have learned in my life that once I expect a return on any gift I freely share I create an unpleasant expectation of others inside me. I am not responsible for others to be grateful. I am responsible for my own actions of FREELY giving a gift. Come on people, we are giving away Christmas cheer. If you are worried about what someone does with the gift or If you put a condition on the use of the gift, then maybe you need to keep it. Just my 2 cents 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xstein1 Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 I just wanted to say thank you to all of you for all the time and effort you have put into your work, and for offering it to others. This is my second year and without old sarge's generosity due to my november purchase from lor i wouldnt have been able to run the 4 songs i did last year. Thanks again,Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caniac Posted July 15, 2015 Share Posted July 15, 2015 the only issues i have are the folks that seem to think that because they bought a LOR controller they are "entitled" to everyone's sequences! I may be taking it the wrong way and it could just be poor grammar on the part of the other party. I will generally do anything asked of me but nothing you tell me to do. if that makes sense. And then there are those that want everything you have ever sequenced and then a week later you see it on eBay (they didn't even have the common sense to at least rename it). But that's another topic for another time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roverdish Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 the only issues i have are the folks that seem to think that because they bought a LOR controller they are "entitled" to everyone's sequences! I may be taking it the wrong way and it could just be poor grammar on the part of the other party. I will generally do anything asked of me but nothing you tell me to do. if that makes sense. And then there are those that want everything you have ever sequenced and then a week later you see it on eBay (they didn't even have the common sense to at least rename it). But that's another topic for another time.I have also been asked to "just send all the sequences you have". (I have over 18 hours of sequences) I would prefer people chose the sequences they might use instead of asking for all. It takes a while to compress and send large files and my service will not allow more than one or 2 compressed sequences to be sent at a time. I understand the comment made by Caniac. It could also be stated that most everyone likes to give but no one likes to be taken. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1983ss454 Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 I have to say that I hate sequencing, always have. I guess I just can't see how to make the lights flow with the music like some of the really talented people on here do, so I still use borrowed sequences sometimes. Without the work of those other generous people my show would not look anywhere as good as it does. In return I try to share and help when I can. Last year there was a new member struggling to get his show going, I ended up spending about 2 weeks after my show was up and running sequencing songs for his show because he was worried about disappointing his kids. I was glad to help and just as people have have helped me when I needed it. Now the one thing me and my wife have gotten very good at is sequencing singing faces. Last year I built a singing Olaf that I was pretty proud of so I posted it to show how it came out, and by the end of the thread there was probably 3 times more People asking for a copy of the sequence it was running then commented on the reason for the thread in the first place. Have to Admit that was the first time I did help when people asked, I ended up ignoring the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dgrant Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 I use to give out free sequences but lately I've been adding to mine with pixel tree sequencing from Dave and Robert at Holidaysequences.com so now I can't send out sequences as it would violate the agreement with them. I don't have the time to remove the pixel tree data and save to another sequence name for the sake of giving it away. Last year, got a lot of requests for my startup sequence from the Griswolds which was super easy/simple. Must have sent out 50 of it or more. Got a lot of Thank You's too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roverdish Posted August 8, 2015 Share Posted August 8, 2015 Still giving out free ones with pixel tree that I have created.My files are so large I have to upload them to "mediafire" and supply the link so anyone can download them.I am very happy that I do NOT expect any thanks. So far my sequences with their links posted have been downloaded well over 100 times.Two people have replied with a thank you. That's just the world we live in today. I just hope that the downloaders "pass it on".I will continue to post on the sequence sharing forum as long as I see the downloads are happening. (Mediafire tells me how many downloads of which sequence happen)I noticed a lot of Pink Floyd takers, I have more coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dcroc Posted August 10, 2015 Share Posted August 10, 2015 (edited) Performance/Creative rights are a very interesting area of law (or is it tedious?).... Probably tedious, but from my past life in the industry I've been exposed too often. For example, consider this: We all know that music works are copyrighted and RIAA likes to sue anyone who is illegally distributing a work. DJ's (those guys in clubs/etc) that remix songs live are performers who create works using recorded music. If the DJ elects to sell his performance, is it legal? Technically he is the owner of his performance and thus can sell it to whomever he wants. But the medium he is using is copyrighted, making his performance a derivative work -- which requires permission of the original author. ...And the next thing you know is that you are paying lawyers a lot of money, with no guarantee how things will go - since 'fair use' is an affirmative defense. The easiest way to ensure you are on the correct side of things is easy: Don't distribute anything that is not 100% yours. I not only played in a band, I also worked in the music industry. Copyrighted music usually only becomes a problem when someone is making money using it. The DJ may "own the performance", but he does not own the rights to the music. Thus, the one that owns the rights to the music must be compensated when a profit is made from it's use. If they really do not like what you are doing with it, they could cause enough legal trouble to have you stopped, but for the most part....they only care about the money. There was a crackdown back in the late 80's on local clubs that had bands playing covers. The pressure was put on the club owner (who was rarely paying the bands), who was making money from the music being played. In turn, a lot of clubs started banning cover songs. It didn't last long, as it is next to impossible to enforce, but it did show that the industry could be a PITA about it if it wanted to. When using music with LOR sequences, there is no profit for the user (unless they are doing a "pro" show for a "customer", or selling the sequence, in which case...there is money being made). The only concern there is if the music was obtained legally, which is a whole different issue. I am sure that all "bought" sequences from LOR, or other places, have all the legal ducks in a row, or otherwise do not include the music. Edited August 10, 2015 by Dcroc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roverdish Posted August 10, 2015 Share Posted August 10, 2015 I get some music from you tube by using the legal mp3 converter also supplied by you tube.http://www.youtube-mp3.org/ As far as I know that music was obtained legally by me from you tube using their supplied converter. I have found some "hard to find" music that way. It did not cost me a thing.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jerry72 Posted August 10, 2015 Share Posted August 10, 2015 I use to give out free sequences but lately I've been adding to mine with pixel tree sequencing from Dave and Robert at Holidaysequences.com so now I can't send out sequences as it would violate the agreement with them. I don't have the time to remove the pixel tree data and save to another sequence name for the sake of giving it away. Last year, got a lot of requests for my startup sequence from the Griswolds which was super easy/simple. Must have sent out 50 of it or more. Got a lot of Thank You's too.I buy from those guys as well. But i always keep the rest of the sequencing separate, then bring them together in a main final sequence that way i can share if need be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
worksopian Posted August 13, 2015 Share Posted August 13, 2015 I get some music from you tube by using the legal mp3 converter also supplied by you tube.http://www.youtube-mp3.org/ As far as I know that music was obtained legally by me from you tube using their supplied converter. I have found some "hard to find" music that way. It did not cost me a thing..I don't think that is legal or supplied by You Tube!! I don't want anyone here to get into legal issues with the RIAA!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roverdish Posted August 13, 2015 Share Posted August 13, 2015 Gosh I hope that it doesn't go down on my personal record. Guilty of openly sharing joy, cheer and beauty your honor. I'm out of order? This whole courts out of order. Seriously I think those stealing and profiting are the issue, not us Christmas folk. Oh and this same mp3 converter has been around for years. I feel certain it would have been shut down by now if there was a legal issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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