SuperStar sequencer Smooth effects killing S3 performance

[hdbaird]

Using S3 v3.10,   I'm using the SuperStar Sequencer's smooth effects, which looks to be an awesome feature to the SuperStar Sequencer, however, when trying to run a show, in S3, that was created with the SuperStar smooth effects, when the smooth effect start, it pretty much shuts downt the performance of the PC I'm using.  The music still plays, but the display, when it does show, is very jumpy.   Most of the times, however, there is no display.

I'm using a the SuperStar against a 12 CCR configuration.

 

Is there any minimum requirement to the PC that the "smooth effects" needs? 

When creating the effect, there was not problems running the sequence. 

I'm using the same PC (Laptop) that I used for last years shows, which I used S3 v3.2.4 and had no problems with any of the sequences. 

I've since tried another faster laptop had having the same results.

The non-smooth effects sequences still work fine.

Open to any suggestions since I was planning on having this up and running for a "Friday the 13th" performance.

 

Thanks

Doug

 

[indi]

Using S3 v3.10,   I'm using the SuperStar Sequencer's smooth effects, which looks to be an awesome feature to the SuperStar Sequencer, however, when trying to run a show, in S3, that was created with the SuperStar smooth effects, when the smooth effect start, it pretty much shuts downt the performance of the PC I'm using.  The music still plays, but the display, when it does show, is very jumpy.   Most of the times, however, there is no display.

I'm using a the SuperStar against a 12 CCR configuration.

 

Is there any minimum requirement to the PC that the "smooth effects" needs? 

When creating the effect, there was not problems running the sequence. 

I'm using the same PC (Laptop) that I used for last years shows, which I used S3 v3.2.4 and had no problems with any of the sequences. 

I've since tried another faster laptop had having the same results.

The non-smooth effects sequences still work fine.

Open to any suggestions since I was planning on having this up and running for a "Friday the 13th" performance.

 

Thanks

Doug

I have the same problem, but I did figure out what was causing it. I was told that that does happen in the visualizer, but that the show would be fine. I don't know. I hope so. Hope someone will confirm this.

[Don]

Using S3 v3.10,   I'm using the SuperStar Sequencer's smooth effects, which looks to be an awesome feature to the SuperStar Sequencer, however, when trying to run a show, in S3, that was created with the SuperStar smooth effects, when the smooth effect start, it pretty much shuts downt the performance of the PC I'm using.  The music still plays, but the display, when it does show, is very jumpy.   Most of the times, however, there is no display.

I'm using a the SuperStar against a 12 CCR configuration.

 

Is there any minimum requirement to the PC that the "smooth effects" needs? 

When creating the effect, there was not problems running the sequence. 

I'm using the same PC (Laptop) that I used for last years shows, which I used S3 v3.2.4 and had no problems with any of the sequences. 

I've since tried another faster laptop had having the same results.

The non-smooth effects sequences still work fine.

Open to any suggestions since I was planning on having this up and running for a "Friday the 13th" performance.

 

Thanks

Doug

 

12 CCR's. What type of USB adapter are you using? If it's the USB485 or USB485B and you only have 1, then that might very well be a problem. The recommended number of CCR's on those two adapters is 6.

 

New this year is 500k speed (well, it came out December last year) and the USB485-HS. With these adapters you should have no problems with 12 CCRs. Note that you will also want to upgrade the firmware on the CCR controllers so they can support 500k as well.

[indi]

12 CCR's. What type of USB adapter are you using? If it's the USB485 or USB485B and you only have 1, then that might very well be a problem. The recommended number of CCR's on those two adapters is 6.

 

New this year is 500k speed (well, it came out December last year) and the USB485-HS. With these adapters you should have no problems with 12 CCRs. Note that you will also want to upgrade the firmware on the CCR controllers so they can support 500k as well.

I'm having the same problem, but I'm using the CCP's. Three 16 channel LOR controllers and 6 CCP's on one network and two CCP's on the Aux. network. I am running at 500 speed.

[Don]

I'm having the same problem, but I'm using the CCP's. Three 16 channel LOR controllers and 6 CCP's on one network and two CCP's on the Aux. network. I am running at 500 speed.

 

If it's me, I don't mix the 16 channel controllers and CCP's on the same network.

 

Which USB adapter are you using? 

[indi]

If it's me, I don't mix the 16 channel controllers and CCP's on the same network.

 

Which USB adapter are you using? 

I don't know. I bought them before the high speed ones came out. First one was in 2012 and the other one was in the summer sale.

[BrianBruderer]

I run my lights on a 10 year old computer with 1gb of memory. There is a part in the middle of my Wizards in Winter sequence for the CCP tree where it uses smooth effects. If I have the Sequence Editor open and am looking at it, then I see the screen get real jumpy as others have described. But it is playing the sequence to the CCP tree just fine. All the videos of my sequences are being run from a 10 year old computer with 1gb of memory. I do this on purpose so that I can test if the sequences run fine on a low end computer. Just keep in mind that the sequence editor puts a priority on sending the commands out to the actual lights, and the updating of the screen is a lower priority and may get real jumpy. If you need to see the screen to sequence your other lights in the Sequence Editor, then it would be best to sequence your other lights before pasting in the CCRs and only paste them in at the end.

Also, as someone mentioned, if you play the smooth effects to the visualizer, the visualizer will probably have a hard time keeping up. But again, realize that sending commands to the visualizer is done in a completely different manner than to the actual controllers.

If you do experience lag when playing to your actual lights, realize that it is probably not because your computer is slow. And it is not because the Sequence Editor screen is jumpy. It is because you are running at a slow network speed or running too many CCRs on one network. If you are running 115K speed then you should have no more than 6 CCRs per network. If you have the latest firmware in your CCRs then you can run the 500K speed and you can put up to 24 CCRs on one network. Note that CCP controllers and CCB controllers are identical. 1 CCP/CCB controller runs 2 strings and therefore 3 controllers run 6 strings and 6 strings of CCP/CCBs are equal to 6 CCRs.

As for the USB485 adapters, for me, my old ones that are not rated for 500K work just fine. Again, all of my videos are running from my 10 year old computer on old USB485 adapters that are not rated for 500k. But most people will probably want to get the newer USB485 adapters that are rated for 500k otherwise if you have problems you will always wonder if it is being caused by your USB495 adapter.

Don mentioned about running 16 channel controllers on the same network with CCRs/CCB/CCP. In the past I put my 16 channel controllers on the same network with my CCRs. But now with the new 500K speed I can no longer do that because only gen3 16 channel controllers with the latest firmware will run the 500K speed and I do not have gen3 controllers. So I now put my 16 channel controllers on their own network and run them at 115K. I put my CCRs on their own network and run them at 500k.

[indi]

I run my lights on a 10 year old computer with 1gb of memory. There is a part in the middle of my Wizards in Winter sequence for the CCP tree where it uses smooth effects. If I have the Sequence Editor open and am looking at it, then I see the screen get real jumpy as others have described. But it is playing the sequence to the CCP tree just fine. All the videos of my sequences are being run from a 10 year old computer with 1gb of memory. I do this on purpose so that I can test if the sequences run fine on a low end computer. Just keep in mind that the sequence editor puts a priority on sending the commands out to the actual lights, and the updating of the screen is a lower priority and may get real jumpy. If you need to see the screen to sequence your other lights in the Sequence Editor, then it would be best to sequence your other lights before pasting in the CCRs and only paste them in at the end.

Also, as someone mentioned, if you play the smooth effects to the visualizer, the visualizer will probably have a hard time keeping up. But again, realize that sending commands to the visualizer is done in a completely different manner than to the actual controllers.

If you do experience lag when playing to your actual lights, realize that it is probably not because your computer is slow. And it is not because the Sequence Editor screen is jumpy. It is because you are running at a slow network speed or running too many CCRs on one network. If you are running 115K speed then you should have no more than 6 CCRs per network. If you have the latest firmware in your CCRs then you can run the 500K speed and you can put up to 24 CCRs on one network. Note that CCP controllers and CCB controllers are identical. 1 CCP/CCB controller runs 2 strings and therefore 3 controllers run 6 strings and 6 strings of CCP/CCBs are equal to 6 CCRs.

As for the USB485 adapters, for me, my old ones that are not rated for 500K work just fine. Again, all of my videos are running from my 10 year old computer on old USB485 adapters that are not rated for 500k. But most people will probably want to get the newer USB485 adapters that are rated for 500k otherwise if you have problems you will always wonder if it is being caused by your USB495 adapter.

Don mentioned about running 16 channel controllers on the same network with CCRs/CCB/CCP. In the past I put my 16 channel controllers on the same network with my CCRs. But now with the new 500K speed I can no longer do that because only gen3 16 channel controllers with the latest firmware will run the 500K speed and I do not have gen3 controllers. So I now put my 16 channel controllers on their own network and run them at 115K. I put my CCRs on their own network and run them at 500k.

Thanks Brian. That's what I wanted to hear. I am running my software on a 4 gb window 7 machine. I do have gen 3 controllers and have update the firmware to the latest. Can't wait to get everything set up and running. But I want to do a Halloween show, so I will wait until around the first of Nov. to start setting up. I will run a test before Nov. 26 to see if there are any problems. If so I hope I'll have time to get it figured out.

Thanks again.

[hdbaird]

12 CCR's. What type of USB adapter are you using? If it's the USB485 or USB485B and you only have 1, then that might very well be a problem. The recommended number of CCR's on those two adapters is 6.

 

New this year is 500k speed (well, it came out December last year) and the USB485-HS. With these adapters you should have no problems with 12 CCRs. Note that you will also want to upgrade the firmware on the CCR controllers so they can support 500k as well.

I am using 3 USB485B adapters. One for a CTB16PC/DMX (standard connection) and the other two for the CCR (aux 1 & aux 2) with 6 CCRs per adapter.  I've also downloaded the latest CCR firmware.   I'm not so sure this is a network speed issue.  Even when I select "none" for the AUX 1 & 2 Comm ports, I still get the "jumpy/freezing" Sequence editor screen when the timing-bar comes across any of the "Smooth effects".   And this may not be a SuperStar sequence editor problem, but might be an S3 sequence editor problem (I can't do a normal "cut & paste" of the CCR sequence to combine an exported SuperStar Sequence to an existing S3 sequence.  The S3 will abort every time).

 

Doug

[BrianBruderer]

There is a video tutorial on doing copy/paste to get a CCR sequence into your main sequence. Go to the lightorama main page, click on Support and then click on "Video Tutorials" The superstar tutorials are at the bottom. Look for "Getting Superstar Sequences into main Sequences."

The first part of the tutorial shows how to do a sub-sequence, but I recommend doing the copy/paste method. Note that it is copy/paste and not cut/paste. Each CCR should be represented as 1 row in the exported sequence. You should be able to select all 12 rows and click on the copy button. Before doing the paste, click on the flyout menu that is on the left side and make sure you have "paste by time" selected as your paste mode. Then paste the effects into your main sequence.

When you say "S3 will abort every time" are you saying that when you do the paste the sequence editor crashes? If so, you can try copying a few CCRs at a time and see if that helps.

Also, as I mentioned the "jumpy" screen in the sequence editor does not mean that you will get lag when playing to your CCRs. I get that on my computer but it plays to the CCRs without lag. I have 3 videos of sequences that use smooth effects and all of them are playing from a 10 year old computer that experiences the jumpy screen.

[indi]

There is a video tutorial on doing copy/paste to get a CCR sequence into your main sequence. Go to the lightorama main page, click on Support and then click on "Video Tutorials" The superstar tutorials are at the bottom. Look for "Getting Superstar Sequences into main Sequences."

The first part of the tutorial shows how to do a sub-sequence, but I recommend doing the copy/paste method. Note that it is copy/paste and not cut/paste. Each CCR should be represented as 1 row in the exported sequence. You should be able to select all 12 rows and click on the copy button. Before doing the paste, click on the flyout menu that is on the left side and make sure you have "paste by time" selected as your paste mode. Then paste the effects into your main sequence.

When you say "S3 will abort every time" are you saying that when you do the paste the sequence editor crashes? If so, you can try copying a few CCRs at a time and see if that helps.

Also, as I mentioned the "jumpy" screen in the sequence editor does not mean that you will get lag when playing to your CCRs. I get that on my computer but it plays to the CCRs without lag. I have 3 videos of sequences that use smooth effects and all of them are playing from a 10 year old computer that experiences the jumpy screen.

I put my SS sequences in as a sub-sequence and noticed you think copy/paste is better. I think everything is working find as a sub-sequence, but now I am second guessing it. I can change to c copy/paste if you think it could stop new problems that may crop up.

Thanks

[BrianBruderer]

The only reason I recommend copy/paste is because some people experience a problem where the subsequence is played a little bit out of synch with the main sequence. On my computer I have to start the subsequence at the .4 second mark to get it in synch with the main sequence. The amount that it can be out of synch varies with each computer. If it is out of synch in the easy direction you just have to start it late like I do. But if it is out of synch the other direction then you have to add some silence to the beginning of the audio file using a product like audacity.

 

So to avoid those potential problems I recommend copy/paste, but if your computer is playing the subsequence in synch with the main sequence then use a subsequence.

[indi]

The only reason I recommend copy/paste is because some people experience a problem where the subsequence is played a little bit out of synch with the main sequence. On my computer I have to start the subsequence at the .4 second mark to get it in synch with the main sequence. The amount that it can be out of synch varies with each computer. If it is out of synch in the easy direction you just have to start it late like I do. But if it is out of synch the other direction then you have to add some silence to the beginning of the audio file using a product like audacity.

 

So to avoid those potential problems I recommend copy/paste, but if your computer is playing the subsequence in synch with the main sequence then use a subsequence.

Oh thank you. I think it is O.K. I'll know as soon as I get everything up for real. And if it is out, I'll spend a night changing it.

 

Thanks so much.

[hdbaird]

There is a video tutorial on doing copy/paste to get a CCR sequence into your main sequence. Go to the lightorama main page, click on Support and then click on "Video Tutorials" The superstar tutorials are at the bottom. Look for "Getting Superstar Sequences into main Sequences."

The first part of the tutorial shows how to do a sub-sequence, but I recommend doing the copy/paste method. Note that it is copy/paste and not cut/paste. Each CCR should be represented as 1 row in the exported sequence. You should be able to select all 12 rows and click on the copy button. Before doing the paste, click on the flyout menu that is on the left side and make sure you have "paste by time" selected as your paste mode. Then paste the effects into your main sequence.

When you say "S3 will abort every time" are you saying that when you do the paste the sequence editor crashes? If so, you can try copying a few CCRs at a time and see if that helps.

Also, as I mentioned the "jumpy" screen in the sequence editor does not mean that you will get lag when playing to your CCRs. I get that on my computer but it plays to the CCRs without lag. I have 3 videos of sequences that use smooth effects and all of them are playing from a 10 year old computer that experiences the jumpy screen.

This is off topic, however, When I do the copy/paste from a SuperStar exported sequence to my main S3 Sequence, even with a single CCR that has "smooth effects" in it, I will get a "The Light-O-Rama Sequence Editor has stopped working" error and the S3 Sequence editor closes.  An easy workaround is that I copy the non-CCR effects FROM my main S3 Sequence and paste them into the SuperStar exported sequence and then making the exported sequence my main sequence.

(I think the error is due to saving the old CCR information so that the changes can be Undone and not having enough memory to save the changes.. Just my feeling on it).  

 

As for the "jumpy screen", if that's all it was, then I'd be ok.  The problem is the actual show pauses at the same time, but the music still plays on.  And even when the music stopped, the lights were still going.. trying to catch up.

 

And... I think I may have resolved the problem on one of my laptops (the main one).  I finally just decided to restore the laptop back to it's factory settings and install the S3 3.10.8 and all necessary drivers.  Since that's all this laptop does, it wasn't a big deal.  I haven't yet connected to the actual props yet, however, now when I playback a sequence there's NO pausing or jumping at all.  So, unless I've missed something with the configuration, it looks good right now.  I'll be testing it out early tomorrow and post the results.

 

Doug

[hdbaird]

Results from the initial test are in.

The CCR's are now working as expected and running at the new 500kb rate.

I don't know for sure what was causing the problem, but the fix was to restore the laptop to factory settings and apply all the necessary updates and then install LOR S3 v3.10.x.  The sequence editor is very smooth throughout the entire playback of the shows that have the SuperStar "Smooth Effects".  The CCR's themselves, appear to be running as expected.  It's daylight so I'm not seeing the full effects, but thye do look good (and I noticed a "non-working red pixel" in one of my strings.. Too late to replace this year). 

 

Based on my exepience and what I had to do, I'm suspecting that the drivers for the USB's were out-dated. I don't remember having to install them the last time I put this all together (Drivers found at the bottom of the "firmware" web page)..  But that wouldn't explain the sequence editor slowdown when all USB Comm ports were set to "none". 

 

Bottom line, it now works and I'm happy again.  I'll be uploading the videos of new shows in a few weeks

Thanks for your help.

Doug

 

[BrianBruderer]

Good, glad it is working!