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Ralph A

CCR Durability

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I would like to here how others have faired with the durability of the CCR'S. If they failed on you, how long did you have them and were they repairable? Were you able to fix them or did LOR fix them or were they wasted?



I like how they perform and love the effect however, I had five CCR's mounted on EMT conduit which were mounted new last year and this year three of the five all failed in the exact same spot and the same color (3 blue). They were mounted on a smooth surface and attached at the "cut points' with zip ties. Sent them to LOR, they stated they were not repairable. Now they must be replaced or I step away from them. This failure rate is much to high for me and wanted to see what what others had to say about your experiences with them.



Thanks for your input, Ralph

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I've only had my hands on 2 CCRs... both of them had issues.

I don't intend on purchasing any CCR in the future... I've turned to China for pixel/chip hardware (for the time being).

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I have two CCR’s purchased last summer. For Christmas display both were attached to 1" lath (loose zip tied at about every 4 cut points), keeping them straight and covered with 4” heater vent hose (point is NO FLEX.) both have been stored in the original box’s rolled as originally received. One had a 3 pixel section fail (red only), and another section the blue no longer has the intensity of the others. String was sent back to LOR for repair/replacement.
I also have (4) 5 meter 5050 RGB ribbons (dumb) from China, 2 of the 4 have more silicone (?, waterproof) , 2 are non-waterproof with very little silicone covering. (CSR’s are about in the middle between the 2 types as far as thickness of silicone covering) the chips and 5050's. The waterproof seem more durable (but can’t confirm yet). Definite difference in the waterproof and non- waterproof type as far as durability feel)

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Thanks Ace and Jerry! Also for all the others that PM me.

We continue to hear about how fragile they are and much care is needed in handling the CCR'S. Mine were mounted right out of the box to the EMT on the arch. No movement! However, In all fairness they were stored in a storage shed (inside) but in Lubbock the summers can get very hot 110-115 at times, and this was a hot summer. They may not be able to take the heat either. Has anyone experienced heat problem?


Thanks

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It would actually be nice if the CCR could be offered in both silicone tube, which is the curent CCR strip and also offered in the solid silicone coating.
I find the solid silicone is stronger than the tubed silicone and as well it disperses the light better with a higher IP rating.

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Ralph A wrote:

Thanks Ace and Jerry!  Also for all the others that PM me. 

We continue to hear about how fragile they are and much care is needed in handling the CCR'S.  Mine were mounted right out of the box to the EMT on the arch.  No movement!  However, In all fairness they were stored in a storage shed (inside) but in Lubbock the summers can get very hot 110-115 at times, and this was a hot summer.  They may not be able to take the heat either.  Has anyone experienced heat problem?

 
Thanks


Im in Australia and my lights face the west so they they deal with a lot of heat during the aussie summer. I must say that i have found the CCR strip to actually be very reliable after 2 years of use. I store my stuff in my garage which also faces the west and can get hot so I havent seen any heat realted issues.
One of the things that must be taken into account is the CCR is a printed circuit baord and the best way to deal with it is to mount it to something like electrical conduit or corex, something to give it some structural integrity. If you do this you will not have too many issues in most cases
Ultimatly nearly all if not all RGB strip comes from China anyway

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OK now I am worried. Buy CCR's or not? That is the question !! I would like 8 srings but reading about them make me worry of the fail rate.

Jeff

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For most people, most of the time, the CCR's hold up very well. The returns on them (in my business only) has been due to failures right out of the box (bad pixels, etc.).

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Thanks.. A poor man like me could not stand a lost like this. LOL

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Thanks Eddy. I am looking to find the problem so it dose not repeat. I really like the CCR and want to get many years out of them. I understand that from time to time you will have a problem. However since these were mounted on a smooth surface (EMT Conduit) I am puzzled, but may have a possible answer.

Trafficman, the CCR's have a great effect and I too have a very limited budget. This is a big loss for me as well and do not want to see it repeated. Keep in mind what Don stated in his above post;

"For most people, most of the time, the CCR's hold up very well. The returns on them (in my business only) has been due to failures right out of the box (bad pixels, etc.)"

The full story on these are as follows, 2 CCR'S purchased 2009 (tested on arrival,OK) 2 CCR's purchased 2010 (tested on arrival.OK) 1 CCR'S purchased 2011 (tested on arrival, OK) Now I had the five I needed for my aches. I purchased them this way due to budget restraints. I built and mounted 4 of the arches in 2010, and stored them (in storage shed) until Christmas 2011 and finished the fifth one 2011. In the future I will not buy them this way.

It may be that Don has a good point, that is, Three of the five that failed, all went out in the same place on the ribbons and the same color. If I would have used them right way I may have detected the problem and it would have been under warranty. My bad. Live and learn. My advise Trafficman is use them as soon as you get them. I will in the future.

On a side note I have spoke with LOR on the heat issue and they are going to run some heat test on the ribbons to determine safe temperatures for them, or at what point they breakdown. I will let you know when I get the results. As usual LOR has been great and their customer service and have been very helpful!!

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Ralph A wrote:

Thanks Eddy. I am looking to find the problem so it dose not repeat. I really like the CCR and want to get many years out of them. I understand that from time to time you will have a problem. However since these were mounted on a smooth surface (EMT Conduit) I am puzzled, but may have a possible answer.




If you had it already mounted to conduit you must be cautious that when you move it around that you dont hold it from the end and allow the conduit to bend too much as this can 'stretch' the CCR and cause damage. Always hold the conduit with the strip attached in the middle and not from the ends.

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Hi All,

I have 16 CCR 15 in service one is a spare. So far I've had 1 segment fail and replaced it from my spare. One dead pixel not replaced yet. lost one segment on the spare unit because I stepped on it. :(

Considering there are 50 segments per unit (so 16 * 50) = 800 segments so the failure is 3/800 (even if I count the one I stepped on) so not even 1%

The powers supplies I've lost 3 so that is 3/16 a much more significant number but it's much easier to fix! :)

Take Care
M.

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Thanks !! I am moving forward as planned with CCR's then. I will buy 9 when they go on sale which I hope soon. 8 will be for the tree and 1 for spare. I guess EMT is the best way to mount them? Due to the number of channels I have I will be updating software with S3 and 24 CCR's just to help me program them.. Going to be fun this weekend as I get started. So be ready for some dumb questions. LOL. Once again thnaks for all the help.
Jeff

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I don't chime in much but do read alot. So there are alot of CCR's out there and I think there is a ton more CCR's in operation with no problems than just the few you see reported here that have problems. It's kinda like watching ther news, you only hear about the bad stuff.

With that said I have two CCR's that make 4 arches and have two "crucial" bends in them. I handled these things like they were dynamite when installing and taking down. I even waited until a warm day so they would be more flexible when taking them down and coiled them up, putting them back in the original box. "Knock on wood" I have not had any problems, but I don't think I will purchase anymore of these in the future unless the durability changes.

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Ralph you mentioned these are being used for arches. Are they being stored in the shape of the arch or are you flexing them into the arch shape at the beginning of the season and then straightening them out at tear down? That could cause some stress on the ribbon.

I have my CCRs mounted to white PVC with no problems so far. One has been through two seasons and three more were new this past season. They are cut in half with a Molex connector in the middle to make them easier to handle.

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The CCRs are more fragile than regular rope light. In almost all cases damage is done by over flexing them.

They do come with a 2 year warranty so any electronic problems will likely be found during the warranty period. We have had ribbons running 24/7 for over 2 years without issue.

Dan

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Is anything being done to address the problems with the power supply's failure due to cold temperatures?

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yurevn wrote:

Is anything being done to address the problems with the power supply's failure due to cold temperatures?


Yes, that problem was an isolated instance. There was a batch of the power supplies that did not have the correct low temperature capacitors. The power supplies are special ordered so that they operate in an extended temperature range. In the past we did not test the power supplies at low temperature. We had tested the original samples to make sure that the worked down to -30 which was the lowest temp version we could order at a reasonable price. We have always tested each one briefly to make sure that it works but we did not have a "batch" test to verify the operating temperature range. We now perform low temp (-30F) testing on a random group in each lot received.

We have plenty of replacements if people have any power supplies that they want replaced.

Dan

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edvas69 wrote:


If you had it already mounted to conduit you must be cautious that when you move it around that you don't hold it from the end and allow the conduit to bend too much as this can 'stretch' the CCR and cause damage. Always hold the conduit with the strip attached in the middle and not from the ends.

Eddy, Thanks for the reply. My arches are constructed the following way. Picture an upside down capital T. I use 1 1/4'' angel iron for the bottom and middle upright then I bend EMT to make the arch and weld them in place, paint them and attach the ribbon in place with zip ties at the cut points. When I handle the arch I do so by the upright center section.

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rwertz wrote:

Ralph you mentioned these are being used for arches. Are they being stored in the shape of the arch or are you flexing them into the arch shape at the beginning of the season and then straightening them out at tear down? That could cause some stress on the ribbon.

I have my CCRs mounted to white PVC with no problems so far. One has been through two seasons and three more were new this past season. They are cut in half with a Molex connector in the middle to make them easier to handle.



Hey Reg,

I'm trying to make my display easier to set up and breakdown each year. Therefore, when I build my props I keep my lights on them. So yes I did keep the ribbon attached to the EMT (in the arch shape) and stored it that way in the storage shed.

From everything I'm reading and all the people I'm talking to about this, it's a very unusual set of circumstance and is very rare!

Thanks for your advise!!

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Hi all,

I will be a future user of CCRs as soon as they come back in stock and have been thinking about setup.

I was thinking of just leaving them up all year round, permanently mounting them to the exterior of the house with stainless steel clips. I have brick siding.

Are they resilient enough to be left up all year round? I live in the northeast...so there is plenty of snow, rain, etc. 90 degree days, 0 degree days

Another possibility was mounting them underneath my gutters. If they are mounted on the gutters will there be issues with being able to see the light? Since the LEDs are pointed down will the light be diminished since LED viewing angle is not 360 degrees?

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Quad wrote:

Hi all,

I will be a future user of CCRs as soon as they come back in stock and have been thinking about setup.

I was thinking of just leaving them up all year round, permanently mounting them to the exterior of the house with stainless steel clips. I have brick siding.

Are they resilient enough to be left up all year round? I live in the northeast...so there is plenty of snow, rain, etc. 90 degree days, 0 degree days

Another possibility was mounting them underneath my gutters. If they are mounted on the gutters will there be issues with being able to see the light? Since the LEDs are pointed down will the light be diminished since LED viewing angle is not 360 degrees?
If you edit your profile maybe we can help you assess the weather conditions in your area as we may have members residing close by with the same equipment .

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Quad wrote:

Hi all,

I will be a future user of CCRs as soon as they come back in stock and have been thinking about setup.

I was thinking of just leaving them up all year round, permanently mounting them to the exterior of the house with stainless steel clips. I have brick siding.

Are they resilient enough to be left up all year round? I live in the northeast...so there is plenty of snow, rain, etc. 90 degree days, 0 degree days

Another possibility was mounting them underneath my gutters. If they are mounted on the gutters will there be issues with being able to see the light? Since the LEDs are pointed down will the light be diminished since LED viewing angle is not 360 degrees?


If mounted under your gutters you will have a nice wash effect on the house, and should be able to leave them up all year, as long as they are shaded from direct sunlight.

I would not leave any of our lighting products on exposed surfaces year round, due to the effects of UV, despite the claims that some products have about being UV resistant.

Talking about UV resistance is similar to comparing water resistant items to water proof, which as most folks know is very different. (or IP 64 vs IP68)

Greg

Nice to see another new local on the forums. I live a little south of Buffalo.

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I think this is a good place to ask this. I'm putting CCRs along my rooflines, but they're vaulted, going from a straight line to a 45 degree incline. Anyone have pointers as to how to run the CCR from a horizontal line to a 45 degree incline without damaging them ?

These are my first CCRs, but I imagine everyone that makes circles has to have come up with something. :shock:

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I don't chime in much but do read alot. So there are alot of CCR's out there and I think there is a ton more CCR's in operation with no problems than just the few you see reported here that have problems. It's kinda like watching ther news, you only hear about the bad stuff.

With that said I have two CCR's that make 4 arches and have two "crucial" bends in them. I handled these things like they were dynamite when installing and taking down. I even waited until a warm day so they would be more flexible when taking them down and coiled them up, putting them back in the original box. "Knock on wood" I have not had any problems, but I don't think I will purchase anymore of these in the future unless the durability changes.

 

I just go my first 2 CCR's and open one to take a look at it.  I plan on doing arches but need to know how to mount them to the actual arch. I know you use zip ties at the cut points but how to you actually arch the ribbon?  You would want the led's to face forward, but that would require bending the ribbon on it's side, not on the flat part where how the come rolled.  

 

Also, you said you made 4 arches out of 2 CCR's.  Did you cut them or just loop from one to then next continuous. 

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