DMX 12v Vs CMB16D

[WilliamS]

This is working on my year 2 display. Im looking into RGB strips for various effects and will still have strands of M5's everywhere as well. I keep getting the same answers to use a DMX network but Im not finding the advantages of it for my overall purpose. Im not planning on spot lamps, moving lights to that effect. I know the overall cost of the controllers for the channels may be cheaper with the DMX 12v setups but the initial cost getting the DMX protocol seems to outweigh the savings of the setup.



Ive seen people make a Cat5e - DMX cable but how in the heck does that work! I would assume cat5 to the LOR boxes then from the last LOR box to the DMX boxes you need that cable to drop to the 3 pin that those use. Once again how does thsi work if its coming from the LOR USB/CAT5e adapter, or would I be using the DMX protocol adapter and moving forward with addressing from there.



It would seem path of least resistance would be the LOR 12v boards but Im planning 30 channels of RGB dumb strips for 2012 season, could be more next year?



Ive searched and the converstation usually has no specifics to what the end result is. The conversation ends up vague to the effect, yeah once you plug in this adapter the controller is setup and away you go. I dont need a straight answer, just link me to the source for info Ill make it work from there. If Im not mistaken Kevin/Craker is working on a shop for this as well.

[geronc]

I'll answer this somewhat.

To use DMX, you will need to use either another LOR 485 module and set it for DMX with the cat5 cross over or get an Enttec open or pro and use it for DMX. It uses a whole different network and you can't connect it to the end of the LOR boxes unless they are running DMX instead of LOR.

Cost savings is when you spend $6 on a 3 channel DMX module. I can get 48 channels of DMX using the modules for $100 vs 15/16 DC channels for $100.

I'll leave it at that for now.

[Paul Roberson]

I use RGB LED strips on our windows and roof, with LOR DC boards. Here is what I use.

These are the RGB LED strips I use.

I use this wire. I got mine from Ray Wu but cant find a link for it now.

I also use some 4 pin waterproof connectors, but can't find a link to them either.

These are the power supplies I use.

The power supply is wired to both sides of the LOR DC board. You have to power both sided of the board.

The RGB strips are hooked to 3 channels. The black wire I hooked to channel 1 + and the red to channel 1 -, green to channel 2 -, and blue to channel 3 -. The strip gets all its power from the wire hooked to channel 1+. This hook up is for one RGB strip controlled by the first 3 channels from the LOR RGB controller.

Here is a pic showing one power supply and one LOR DC controller in a battery box.



Here is a pic showing 2 power supplies and 2 LOR DC boards.



Hope this helps with some of the information you were looking for.

[WilliamS]

Thats exactly how I planned on setting that all up. Everytime I inquire on it through PM everyone keeps trying to steer me into DMX.

Thank you Paul this is enough for me! Wonder if the boards are in stock. Your links for wire and power supply both lead to wire, but I get it.

[WilliamS]

geronc wrote:

I'll answer this somewhat.

To use DMX, you will need to use either another LOR 485 module and set it for DMX with the cat5 cross over or get an Enttec open or pro and use it for DMX. It uses a whole different network and you can't connect it to the end of the LOR boxes unless they are running DMX instead of LOR.

Cost savings is when you spend $6 on a 3 channel DMX module. I can get 48 channels of DMX using the modules for $100 vs 15/16 DC channels for $100.

I'll leave it at that for now.

So let me put this in writting that I understand. Run from the MP3director to the LOr controllers, at the last controller attach the output of that final LOR controller to the LOR485 input, then output to a rj45-DMX 3 pin to the DMX controllers? I understand the cost of the DMX controllers being cheaper as there is a 27 channel controller for something like 60 bucks.

[Paul Roberson]

GoofyGuy wrote:

geronc wrote:

I'll answer this somewhat.

To use DMX, you will need to use either another LOR 485 module and set it for DMX with the cat5 cross over or get an Enttec open or pro and use it for DMX. It uses a whole different network and you can't connect it to the end of the LOR boxes unless they are running DMX instead of LOR.

Cost savings is when you spend $6 on a 3 channel DMX module. I can get 48 channels of DMX using the modules for $100 vs 15/16 DC channels for $100.

I'll leave it at that for now.

So let me put this in writting that I understand. Run from the MP3director to the LOr controllers, at the last controller attach the output of that final LOR controller to the LOR485 input, then output to a rj45-DMX 3 pin to the DMX controllers? I understand the cost of the DMX controllers being cheaper as there is a 27 channel controller for something like 60 bucks.

The only way (that I know of) to run DMX from a LOR MP3Director is to use the LOR iDMX. It is daisy chained with the rest of your LOR controllers.

These DMX adapbers/dongles need to have a PC running the show.

[Paul Roberson]

Here are the power supplies I use.

[bdeditch]

Paul Roberson wrote:

Here are the power supplies I use.

Now Paul, how many strings can that power?

[WilliamS]

ok so far its looking better and better for LOR equipment. The good news theres only so much I can do. I can see how the larger channel counts would be better on DMX but Im in a townhouse I only have so much room to play with.

[WilliamS]

bdeditch wrote:

Paul Roberson wrote:

Here are the power supplies I use.

Now Paul, how many strings can that power?

Im betting a few. A good amount of my channels will be shorter than a yard as they will be in or on props. Now I have to wrap my head around that many more controllers!

[Paul Roberson]

bdeditch wrote:

Paul Roberson wrote:

Here are the power supplies I use.

Now Paul, how many strings can that power?

"Strings" of what?

How many watts does said 'string' draw?



The RGB flexible strip mentioned above says it is 14.4 watts per meter. So this power supply should power just over 24 meters (just over 79') of it.


However with these DC strips, extension cords and length of strip you are powering plays a big part. It is recommend you don't use strips over 5 meters long. I have a strip that is 8 meters long and if you power it from one end and turn on RGB to make it white it will be pink on the opposite end. I have this 8 meter piece powered from both ends ( from the same 3 channels).

[WilliamS]

Paul Roberson wrote:

bdeditch wrote:

Paul Roberson wrote:

Here are the power supplies I use.

Now Paul, how many strings can that power?

"Strings" of what?

How many watts does said 'string' draw?



The RGB flexible strip mentioned above says it is 14.4 watts per meter. So this power supply should power just over 24 meters (just over 79') of it.


However with these DC strips, extension cords and length of strip you are powering plays a big part. It is recommend you don't use strips over 5 meters long. I have a strip that is 8 meters long and if you power it from one end and turn on RGB to make it white it will be pink on the opposite end. I have this 8 meter piece powered from both ends ( from the same 3 channels).

You read my mind on that follow up question how to keep power to the strip. Also 12v does not travel like 120AC. What would you consider too long a lead in wire for a 12v setup.

[bdeditch]

GoofyGuy wrote:

Paul Roberson wrote:

bdeditch wrote:

Paul Roberson wrote:

Here are the power supplies I use.

Now Paul, how many strings can that power?

"Strings" of what?

How many watts does said 'string' draw?



The RGB flexible strip mentioned above says it is 14.4 watts per meter. So this power supply should power just over 24 meters (just over 79') of it.


However with these DC strips, extension cords and length of strip you are powering plays a big part. It is recommend you don't use strips over 5 meters long. I have a strip that is 8 meters long and if you power it from one end and turn on RGB to make it white it will be pink on the opposite end. I have this 8 meter piece powered from both ends ( from the same 3 channels).

You read my mind on that follow up question how to keep power to the strip. Also 12v does not travel like 120AC. What would you consider too long a lead in wire for a 12v setup.

So basically what it sounds like is that 2 power supplies for anything longer than 5 meters. one on each end.

[WilliamS]

same power supply, 2 cables coming from it to the strips ends.

[Paul Roberson]

bdeditch wrote:

So basically what it sounds like is that 2 power supplies for anything longer than 5 meters. one on each end.

Sorry for the misunderstanding or my misunderstanding.

Not 2 'power supplies' to power a RGB strip longer than 5 meters, but 2 power inputs (extension cords)

Take my garage for example. I have a total of 12 meters around it. They are all powered by the same power supply from the same 3 channels on a LOR DC board. BUT there are 3 "extension cords" coming from those 3 channels. One is connected at the bottom right of the garage and one at each top corner.

[Paul Roberson]

GoofyGuy wrote:

You read my mind on that follow up question how to keep power to the strip. Also 12v does not travel like 120AC. What would you consider too long a lead in wire for a 12v setup.

I really don't have the technical answer for you on that one. I am sure there is a formula for it.

Having said that I have a 7 meter RGB strip running on a 10' extension cord (4 pin wire). This is my longest extension cord used. My controllers are fairly close to what they are controlling.

How long can you actually get away with? I don't know the answer to that.



For anyone else reading any of this. The setup of these RGB strips takes allot of work and time. These strips may need to be cut to length and the 4 pin wire (or water proof connectors) have to be soldered to the RGB strips, then the strips have to be sealed back up.
I am not trying to discourage anyone from using them. Just trying to be honest on how much work they are.:cool:

[WilliamS]

Paul Roberson wrote:

GoofyGuy wrote:

You read my mind on that follow up question how to keep power to the strip. Also 12v does not travel like 120AC. What would you consider too long a lead in wire for a 12v setup.

I really don't have the technical answer for you on that one. I am sure there is a formula for it.

Having said that I have a 7 meter RGB strip running on a 10' extension cord (4 pin wire). This is my longest extension cord used. My controllers are fairly close to what they are controlling.

How long can you actually get away with? I don't know the answer to that.



For anyone else reading any of this. The setup of these RGB strips takes allot of work and time. These strips may need to be cut to length and the 4 pin wire (or water proof connectors) have to be soldered to the RGB strips, then the strips have to be sealed back up.
I am not trying to discourage anyone from using them. Just trying to be honest on how much work they are.:cool:

The work part Im already jumping into it so no big deal there. The sequencing is also in the works as well already mapped out the channels and S3 Visualizer. The next part is how to make it right, Im almost sold on the Lor 12vDC setup. The controllers if Im not mistaken can take upto 18 volts correct. So if I test resistance in the wire for the length I can just add the extra needed power to the strip.

[edvas69]

If your just using the standard dumb 3 channel strip and your already using LOR then the only reason you would want to go to DMX is to save some money of cheap chinese controllers or because you want to mix DMX controllers in the same network as LOR controllers. My thoughts are if your happy using LOR then stick with LOR.
For large pixel channel counts E1.31 is best (DMX over ethernet) which LOR currently does not support but should be supporting in 2012.
No need to use DMX if your requirements dont need it.

And the comment above about the strips being extra work, this is correct but one of the things i love about the strips is if one LED blows you dont loose a a whole section, you only loose that one colour in that 100mm section so its not very noticeable. To repair is harder as you have to cut out that section and solder in and seal the new section in.

How long a distnace you can get away is based on the current being carried and the guage of the cable used. Every cable has a resistance per metre rating and the smaller the guage usually means the higher the resistance. The lower the voltage used the higher the % of total voltage drop that will occur across the same distance of cable.

[Paul Roberson]

GoofyGuy wrote:

The work part Im already jumping into it so no big deal there. The sequencing is also in the works as well already mapped out the channels and S3 Visualizer. The next part is how to make it right, Im almost sold on the Lor 12vDC setup. The controllers if Im not mistaken can take upto 18 volts correct. So if I test resistance in the wire for the length I can just add the extra needed power to the strip.

The following was copied from here.


[align=left]Each 8-channel bank can handle a[/align]
different DC voltage between 5 & 60 V

I do not know enough about resistance and the voltage drop to say if it would work or not. I know I wouldn't try it.

[bdeditch]

Paul Roberson wrote:

bdeditch wrote:

So basically what it sounds like is that 2 power supplies for anything longer than 5 meters. one on each end.

Sorry for the misunderstanding or my misunderstanding.

Not 2 'power supplies' to power a RGB strip longer than 5 meters, but 2 power inputs (extension cords)

Take my garage for example. I have a total of 12 meters around it. They are all powered by the same power supply from the same 3 channels on a LOR DC board. BUT there are 3 "extension cords" coming from those 3 channels. One is connected at the bottom right of the garage and one at each top corner.

OK I understand now, basically the power from one end just seems to peter out when it gets to a certian point of the strip, there fore you are really "boosting" the power so it gets to all sections of the strip, but same power source and on the same channel that you have programed it on.