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jimswinder

LOR Prices for NEW Items

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Max-Paul wrote:

Sorry guys but the CCB will NOT have a cat 5 cable going to it. Communication to the CCB is via PLC (power line comm). This is the new way that LOR has come out with dealing with communication to the controllers. From what I have been reading the Cat 5 will plug into a injector. The injector will plug into the wall outlet (not controlled). And an extension cord will then plug into the injector and the far end of the extension cord will have the CCB controller plugged into it. At the controller the signal will be extracted from the AC Power supplying the controller.

At this time I am confused as to how many controllers can be controlled off of one injector. For some reason I was thinking that I had heard something about 2 units. But please do not take that for gospel.



Max, see Dan's post in this thread on Wed Jan 19th, 2011 10:44 am

LightORamaDan wrote:

You will need the injector only if you use the Power Line Control option for the strings. You can wire them via CAT5 as well.

The injector will handle around 10 strings.

Dan

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rwertz wrote:

The injector will handle around 10 strings.


So where do these injectors go? Especially if you have more than 10 strings?

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If you pay the extra $$ for the injectors, they would go between your CAT5 cable and the power cable to the CCBs

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jimswinder wrote:

rwertz wrote:
The injector will handle around 10 strings.


So where do these injectors go? Especially if you have more than 10 strings?


If you have more then 10 strings, then you buy more injectors.

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JBullard wrote

If you have more then 10 strings, then you buy more injectors.

I understand that...but where do they go?

Are they daisy chained one on top of one another?

Plug into each other?

Go onto the end of a CCB string?

Plug into your computer via a USB port?

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JBullard wrote:

If you pay the extra $$ for the injectors, they would go between your CAT5 cable and the power cable to the CCBs


You plug your CAT5 cable into the injector. The injector has an output socket (120 VAC) that you plug your regular extension cord (SPT) into, run the extension cord to your CCB controller to power (120 VAC) the controller.

The data signal that was on your CAT5 cable then piggy backs to the controller via the extension cord

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I believe these connect to your LOR network the same as any other controller would. They are on the RS-485 bus so you could connect to another controller or to the USB adapter. My guess is that it would have two RJ-45 jacks, just like most current items. you could then daisy chain these at the end of your current controller network. Or buy another USB adapter and connect to that. The newest version of S2 supports up to 16 of the USB adapters.

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JBullard wrote:

JBullard wrote:
If you pay the extra $$ for the injectors, they would go between your CAT5 cable and the power cable to the CCB

Sorry...I missed your post where you said that...

Not to be dumb (or dumber) if you don't need any LOR controllers for your CCB's, and
you plug your CAT5 cable into the injector, are there multiple CAT5 plugs in the injector (in and out like an LOR Controller) so you can daisy chain your next 10 strings and the injector you will need?

EDIT:

Whoops...I see it was already answered in the post above mine...

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Yes

Dan in an earlier post said it had all three jacks, just like a regular controller has, 2 RJ-45 and 1 RJ-11

In my opinion, I can buy a lot of CAT5 cable and just run it straight to each CCB rather then paying the extra cost for the injectors. I also have a concern (my opinion only) about noise on the injected power lines in a large installation.



EDIT: Jim, Looks like Jeff made a post while I was typing my answer, and now I see that you edited your post that I was replying to

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JBullard wrote:

Yes

Dan in an earlier post said it had all three jacks, just like a regular controller has, 2 RJ-45 and 1 RJ-11

In my opinion, I can buy a lot of CAT5 cable and just run it straight to each CCB rather then paying the extra cost for the injectors. I also have a concern (my opinion only) about noise on the injected power lines in a large installation.



EDIT: Jim, Looks like Jeff made a post while I was typing my answer, and now I see that you edited your post that I was replying to


Yes...the CONTROLLER has multiple jacks...but will the injector??

Guess it will have to, huh?

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jimswinder wrote:

JBullard wrote:
Yes

Dan in an earlier post said it had all three jacks, just like a regular controller has, 2 RJ-45 and 1 RJ-11

In my opinion, I can buy a lot of CAT5 cable and just run it straight to each CCB rather then paying the extra cost for the injectors. I also have a concern (my opinion only) about noise on the injected power lines in a large installation.



EDIT: Jim, Looks like Jeff made a post while I was typing my answer, and now I see that you edited your post that I was replying to


Yes...the CONTROLLER has multiple jacks...but will the injector??

Guess it will have to, huh?

How else would you daisy chain them?

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One thing to keep in mind is that as the number of channels go up.. you may need to split into several networks. I split into 4 this year because I had about 2800 channels (400 traditional and 2400 RGB (800 rgb pixels)).
I believe that's one reason the last release of software supports 16 networks. There has been much speculation about how many channels can be handled per network on various posts. It seemed like the recommendation was to stay under 1,000 per network.

To use these additional networks you just configure the channels to use another USB adapter (called Aux A, Aux B, etc)

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Seems strange then if you need to use a CAT 5 cable to use the injectors..like Mr Bullard suggested, why not just save the money and use the CAT5 ports in the controllers??

What is the advantage of the injectors?

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jimswinder wrote:

heystew wrote:
One thing to keep in mind is that as the number of channels go up.. you may need to split into several networks. I split into 4 this year because I had about 2800 channels (400 traditional and 2400 RGB (800 rgb pixels)).
I believe that's one reason the last release of software supports 16 networks. There has been much speculation about how many channels can be handled per network on various posts. It seemed like the recommendation was to stay under 1,000 per network.

To use these additional networks you just configure the channels to use another USB adapter (called Aux A, Aux B, etc)

Seems strange then if you need to use a CAT 5 cable to use the injectors..like Mr Bullard suggested, why not just save the money and use the CAT5 ports in the controllers??

What is the advantage of the injectors?



BINGO! (in my opinion)

I wondered why you were so hung up with 20 questions about the injectors- lol

One example that Dan mentioned was a mega-tree, say 10 strings at the same location area, then only one CAT5 cable would be needed.

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Jeff Millard wrote:

thebiggkm wrote:
Jeff

Do you realize the CCB are LEDS not incandescents?

Karl, it's all a matter of symantics. They're not LEDs per se, but rather "RGB Pixels." I'm getting "Pixels" lots and lots of "Pixels"

Jeff

Yes, what Jeff said.

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Jeff Millard wrote:

thebiggkm wrote:
Jeff

Do you realize the CCB are LEDS not incandescents?

Karl, it's all a matter of symantics. They're not LEDs per se, but rather "RGB Pixels." I'm getting "Pixels" lots and lots of "Pixels"

Jeff

Yes, what Jeff said.

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jimswinder wrote:


Seems strange then if you need to use a CAT 5 cable to use the injectors..like Mr Bullard suggested, why not just save the money and use the CAT5 ports in the controllers??

What is the advantage of the injectors?




I may not know what I am talking about, BUT. ; )

I would think the injector would plug into a wall outlet around your show computer with a cat5 (or maybe just USB) cable plugged into it from a aux LOR network from your computer. All your CCB controllers would just be plugged into an outlet/extension cord and the communication would take place thru your homes wiring. Communication to up to 10 CCB controllers thru setting up the injector and controller id's??

Otherwise whats the point?? If the injector has a cat5 cable from it to the computer AND you have to plug your CCB controllers into the injector. I don't see any savings or anything easier about this set up.


Can someone who knows (Dan?) post a link to an injector (if there is one) and exactly how it would hook up.

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JBullard wrote:

I also have a concern (my opinion only) about noise on the injected power lines in a large installation.


That was a thought I had too. I also wondered if the load on the power line would have any affect on the transmission--for example, would a SPT line carrying 95% of its capacity have more problems than a similar line at 10% capacity? Or would a 14g outdoor extension cord act different than 18g SPT1? Both speed and/or quality (noise). I am sure it would be minuscule but is there any potential for differences? I know noise/speed was an issue on home computer networks that used power line transmission years ago, but I assume that the technology has improved somehow.

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Paul Roberson wrote:

jimswinder wrote:

Seems strange then if you need to use a CAT 5 cable to use the injectors..like Mr Bullard suggested, why not just save the money and use the CAT5 ports in the controllers??

What is the advantage of the injectors?




I may not know what I am talking about, BUT. ; )

I would think the injector would plug into a wall outlet around your show computer with a cat5 (or maybe just USB) cable plugged into it from a aux LOR network from your computer. All your CCB controllers would just be plugged into an outlet/extension cord and the communication would take place thru your homes wiring. Communication to up to 10 CCB controllers thru setting up the injector and controller id's??

Otherwise whats the point?? If the injector has a cat5 cable from it to the computer AND you have to plug your CCB controllers into the injector. I don't see any savings or anything easier about this set up.


Can someone who knows (Dan?) post a link to an injector (if there is one) and exactly how it would hook up.


You can see in the following video the design that the CCB's are based on:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAh1gg0u8Xk

That black box that is plugged into the power strip is the injector. Note the CAT5 plugs, they take the DMX/LOR signal and inject it onto the wire. I think once you see it in the "real world" you'll see some real advantages to PLC. Anything that gets rid of half your wires can't be all that bad - no?

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dmoore wrote:

Paul Roberson wrote:
jimswinder wrote:

Seems strange then if you need to use a CAT 5 cable to use the injectors..like Mr Bullard suggested, why not just save the money and use the CAT5 ports in the controllers??

What is the advantage of the injectors?




I may not know what I am talking about, BUT. ; )

I would think the injector would plug into a wall outlet around your show computer with a cat5 (or maybe just USB) cable plugged into it from a aux LOR network from your computer. All your CCB controllers would just be plugged into an outlet/extension cord and the communication would take place thru your homes wiring. Communication to up to 10 CCB controllers thru setting up the injector and controller id's??

Otherwise whats the point?? If the injector has a cat5 cable from it to the computer AND you have to plug your CCB controllers into the injector. I don't see any savings or anything easier about this set up.


Can someone who knows (Dan?) post a link to an injector (if there is one) and exactly how it would hook up.


You can see in the following video the design that the CCB's are based on:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAh1gg0u8Xk

That black box that is plugged into the power strip is the injector. Note the CAT5 plugs, they take the DMX/LOR signal and inject it onto the wire. I think once you see it in the "real world" you'll see some real advantages to PLC. Anything that gets rid of half your wires can't be all that bad - no?


So the injector does not 'inject' the DMX/LOR signal into the homes wiring thru an outlet. It injects the DMX/LOR singal into an extension cord that has to plug into the injector?

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JBullard wrote:

I wondered why you were so hung up with 20 questions about the injectors- lol

One example that Dan mentioned was a mega-tree, say 10 strings at the same location area, then only one CAT5 cable would be needed.

Because I had NOOOOO idea how they worked!!

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rwertz wrote:

Max-Paul wrote:
Sorry guys but the CCB will NOT have a cat 5 cable going to it. Communication to the CCB is via PLC (power line comm). This is the new way that LOR has come out with dealing with communication to the controllers. From what I have been reading the Cat 5 will plug into a injector. The injector will plug into the wall outlet (not controlled). And an extension cord will then plug into the injector and the far end of the extension cord will have the CCB controller plugged into it. At the controller the signal will be extracted from the AC Power supplying the controller.

At this time I am confused as to how many controllers can be controlled off of one injector. For some reason I was thinking that I had heard something about 2 units. But please do not take that for gospel.



Max, see Dan's post in this thread on Wed Jan 19th, 2011 10:44 am

LightORamaDan wrote:

You will need the injector only if you use the Power Line Control option for the strings. You can wire them via CAT5 as well.

The injector will handle around 10 strings.

Dan



Thanks for the heads up. Appears that I missed that post. About a week ago I heard about the PLC and nothing I remember was mentioned at that time that there was still the option to plug in directly to the CCB controller. Thanks for pointing out my miss.

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Paul Roberson wrote:

dmoore wrote:
Paul Roberson wrote:
jimswinder wrote:

Seems strange then if you need to use a CAT 5 cable to use the injectors..like Mr Bullard suggested, why not just save the money and use the CAT5 ports in the controllers??

What is the advantage of the injectors?




I may not know what I am talking about, BUT. ; )

I would think the injector would plug into a wall outlet around your show computer with a cat5 (or maybe just USB) cable plugged into it from a aux LOR network from your computer. All your CCB controllers would just be plugged into an outlet/extension cord and the communication would take place thru your homes wiring. Communication to up to 10 CCB controllers thru setting up the injector and controller id's??

Otherwise whats the point?? If the injector has a cat5 cable from it to the computer AND you have to plug your CCB controllers into the injector. I don't see any savings or anything easier about this set up.


Can someone who knows (Dan?) post a link to an injector (if there is one) and exactly how it would hook up.


You can see in the following video the design that the CCB's are based on:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAh1gg0u8Xk

That black box that is plugged into the power strip is the injector. Note the CAT5 plugs, they take the DMX/LOR signal and inject it onto the wire. I think once you see it in the "real world" you'll see some real advantages to PLC. Anything that gets rid of half your wires can't be all that bad - no?


So the injector does not 'inject' the DMX/LOR signal into the homes wiring thru an outlet. It injects the DMX/LOR singal into an extension cord that has to plug into the injector?



That would be correct - that is why Dan says no issues with X10 and other PLC devices - they are filtered out of the power before that power goes onto your CCB's.

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