jerryb721 Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 sorry double post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimswinder Posted January 23, 2011 Share Posted January 23, 2011 Surfing4Dough wrote:Please post back here if you find it.I found one...but I don't think it was the latest and greatest. I have added it to my website. Just click on the link in my signature...the one for the sequences. The calculator link is at the top of the page in GREEN letters:Spiral Tree CalculatorEDIT:Whoops...did not see someone else had already posted it...Guess I was a little behind on my email notifications... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shanta Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 It's a great calc, but I have a couple of suggestions if some industrious mathematician wants to take on developing the next generation. First, it seems to me that what you'd want to solve for is how tall your tree can be based on the length of strands you want to use (and the height:width ratio and number of wraps) rather than the other way around. Also, it seems that to build the tree you need to know how far down the guys to attach the spirals as they cross... otherwise you might not get the pitch right. It starts to get complicated when you have more strands than guys. But hey, I know some of y'all really enjoy such challenges! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimswinder Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 Shanta wrote: It's a great calc, but I have a couple of suggestions if some industrious mathematician wants to take on developing the next generation. First, it seems to me that what you'd want to solve for is how tall your tree can be based on the length of strands you want to use (and the height:width ratio and number of wraps) rather than the other way around.**This is ONLY an approximation as it is IMPOSSIBLE to have totally straight and taut guy wires. As you add the strings, the guy wires will begin to collapse into itself, so each additional string you add, will become "longer", as it is having to go around a smaller and smaller circumference. Also, it seems that to build the tree you need to know how far down the guys to attach the spirals as they cross... otherwise you might not get the pitch right.**The picture on the right of the calculator shows you this**EDIT: If you are looking at the one from my website...It starts to get complicated when you have more strands than guys. But hey, I know some of y'all really enjoy such challenges!**It shouldn't be complicated...you have where they cross at the four guys (0 Degrees, 90 degrees, 180 degrees and 270 degrees). Depending on your number of guy wires, you should be able to determined the guy wires in between those main points. If you are crossing at 2' at 90 degrees and 5' and 180 degrees and you have two more guy wires in between, then they cross at 3' and 4' respectively Plus..if you just string the lights at your four main guys, the string will fall where it needs to be naturally. Don't try and make your tree perfect..you will drive yourself NUTS...becasue as I stated above..with every string you add, it begins to fall into itself, making any accurate measurements obsolete.** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeA Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 The calculator that Jim and Jerry posted look similar but they give 2 completely different answers.I just built a mock up in the basement and it is way off...this is harder that I thought it would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimswinder Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 MikeA wrote: The calculator that Jim and Jerry posted look similar but they give 2 completely different answers.I just built a mock up in the basement and it is way off...this is harder that I thought it would be.I beleive the creator of the calculator corrected some known errors in a later revision...but that is the one that apparently is no longer posted...To which calculator did you mock too?I THOUGHT I had the latest calculator on my computer..but I could not find it the other night...I will look again this evening when I get home.And don't make it harder than it is...what length of strings are you wanting to use?I used 33' strings of C6 and found I needed about a 21' tree with a 20' circumference base for it to come out right..with a 1-1/2 revolution spiral.Even if you were to mock it up...the actual one would not turn out the same...like I said...every time you add a string, the guy wires start collapsing into itself form the weight of the strings, making the distance for the spiral shorter and shorter...there is just no way to calculate for that.But don't be too picky about the spiral....even if it is close it will be FANTASTIC!!!EDIT:I do have a copy of the calculator here at work...looks like I downloaded it last month, so it might be different than the one I posted (but not sure) PM me your email and I will send it to you and you can see if it calculates differently than the one you have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rjnitto Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 I'm not sure I have the time to get overly involved in this thread, but since I was overly involved in the original Chrisl1976 PC thread one year ago including working on the calculator I may be able to give some insight. I also built two identical spirals for 2010 which should give some validity to my opinions. A video sample can be seen here. http://vimeo.com/17620901I believed the original length calculation was too long and Chris after some review agreed that the length calc might not be accurate (he said so in that thread). Now in this thread, I believe that the calculator on jimswinder's website is more accurate than the one posted by jerryb721. To know whether you have the latest calculator, plug in 10' height, 6' base diameter, and 1.5 revolutions. 30.14' is way long and incorrect. If you get 17.57' that is closer to the actual number. The rest of the calculations should be right on.There are too many variables to expect Excel to give an exact answer. When you hook the lights at the top, are they exactly in the center of the pole or are they 6 to 8" out? Is your base diameter exactly 6' or 6'4" (20'/3.14)? Do you want your light string to end at the edge of the tree or do you run it towards the center pole (to hook into your controller)?I suggest you only use the spreadsheet to get an approximation of what to do. For example, I took the calculated 5.22 inch support line string spacing and used 5" instead. It made measuring easier and NO ONE can see the difference. Make sure your support lines are taut. Try to get your light strings as close to exact opposite sides of the tree for symmetry. Use lots of zip ties to keep things tight.I totally agree with Jim when he says "But don't be too picky about the spiral....even if it is close it will be FANTASTIC!!!". Mine were the talk of the show.Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sysco Posted January 26, 2011 Author Share Posted January 26, 2011 rjnitto wrote: I'm not sure I have the time to get overly involved in this thread, but since I was overly involved in the original Chrisl1976 PC thread one year ago including working on the calculator I may be able to give some insight. I also built two identical spirals for 2010 which should give some validity to my opinions. A video sample can be seen here. http://vimeo.com/17620901I believed the original length calculation was too long and Chris after some review agreed that the length calc might not be accurate (he said so in that thread). Now in this thread, I believe that the calculator on jimswinder's website is more accurate than the one posted by jerryb721. To know whether you have the latest calculator, plug in 10' height, 6' base diameter, and 1.5 revolutions. 30.14' is way long and incorrect. If you get 17.57' that is closer to the actual number. The rest of the calculations should be right on.There are too many variables to expect Excel to give an exact answer. When you hook the lights at the top, are they exactly in the center of the pole or are they 6 to 8" out? Is your base diameter exactly 6' or 6'4" (20'/3.14)? Do you want your light string to end at the edge of the tree or do you run it towards the center pole (to hook into your controller)?I suggest you only use the spreadsheet to get an approximation of what to do. For example, I took the calculated 5.22 inch support line string spacing and used 5" instead. It made measuring easier and NO ONE can see the difference. Make sure your support lines are taut. Try to get your light strings as close to exact opposite sides of the tree for symmetry. Use lots of zip ties to keep things tight.I totally agree with Jim when he says "But don't be too picky about the spiral....even if it is close it will be FANTASTIC!!!". Mine were the talk of the show.RichardRichard tried what you said i clicked on the first thread in this posting it came out to 17.57 feet so it must be the correct one Blair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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