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Katrina

Ring a Bell

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Can anyone help me devise a way to use a servo motor to ring a church bell? This bell is mounted at ground level. The bell doesn't rock, the clappers move. I think it's the type that is supposed to be mounted at an angle. We could do that, but it's pretty loud just hitting the side with the clapper.
I suppose I'll need the servo dog, mainly I need ideas on the connection from the servo to the clapper that will give me the force and the timing control I need.
Thanks for any ideas!


Attached files 206828=11486-Bell.jpg

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Your hurdle is finding a mechanism that can swing those heavy clappers. You can buy electric winches, but they are too slow and too strong. You need to find a motor that can pull a cord that you attach to the clappers, that is weak enough so that it stops when it gets to the end without breaking the cord.

Once you find such a motor, simply hook it up to a channel and experiment with the timing.

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It looks to me like a great application for a pneumatic cylinder to either push or pull the clappers (or hit the bell directly if it wouldn't damage it). Pneumatic cylinders come in all lengths and bores and can produce huge amounts of force and move quite quickly depending on the bore and the psi used. It may be a bit more involved than you'd like with a compressor and hoses, an electric solenoid valve, etc., but other than that it should be quite simple and it'd be a fun project. You'd still need to play around to get acceptable timing. You can pick up a solenoid and pneumatic cylinder on e-bay pretty cheap.

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Actually I don't think they will be as heavy as you would think, you only need to pull them to the side, not lift them straight up.

I can recommend a good site for strong servos. http://www.servocity.com/
Something like this might work. http://www.servocity.com/html/spg785a-5_0_servo_gearbox.html
It has up to 1,573 Oz.in. of torque.
I've purchased from them before and had a good experience.
Depending on how much money you want to throw at it, you can use some pretty strong 1/4 scale servos or a geared motor.

You could also use a linear actuator that would have a latch at the top. They are not very fast, but will have the strength you need.

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Record the clapper hitting the bell, put a speaker inside the bell and then playback your recording.... :)

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Not that there aren't devices that could move the clapper, it does appear that it would be relatively heavy. This could affect how quickly (at what rate) the bell could be rung and rerung. If timing is of importance, could Katrina use a solenoid (of some currently undetermined type and size) to directly strike the bell (or perhaps "kick" a smaller clapper to strike the bell), thus ringing it?

Sorry, I don't know much more than to offer it as a possible solution.

Cray

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I know nothing about this but what about a magnet to catch the clapper and pull it back and release it?

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How about just taking the leads from the controller and attaching them to some kid and when he gets shocked it causes him to ring the bell??

I know...you wish me and my smart ass remarks would just go away...

I just can't help myself sometimes, ya know? :?

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Hi,
I love pneumatics, but you are limited to setting the speed and force. Even with a 5 port 4 way valve, and a double acting cylinder. You can only set two speeds in, out.
with a servo, you can set the speed, and force in the sequence. you could start out hitting soft and slowly hit harder and harder.
I think a 1/4 scale servo with the sail arm would work. like the Hitec 815BB.
you could attach it to the clapper and have it push off the bell. or attach it to the circle the bell is mounted in and have a wire or rod attached to the clapper.
I would try making a small clapper that attaches to the servo, and mounts to the real clapper.
If you know someone with a r/c Car,plane,boat. They could help you test things out before you buy a servodog...
Give yourself lots of time to learn the servodog programing!
Good Luck,
Ron

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jimswinder wrote:

How about just taking the leads from the controller and attaching them to some kid and when he gets shocked it causes him to ring the bell??

I know...you wish me and my smart ass remarks would just go away...

I just can't help myself sometimes, ya know? :?

Do you volunteer for the job??

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rstately wrote:

There is a guy you can hire to ring the bell,
I think his name is Jim W...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_I-4XS3XtZQ

He works cheap.

I thought I had the only copy of that video!!

Will work for LED's... "Every time the bell rings, I GET more LED's for my tree!!
- Zuzu Bailey

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I'm not so sure I'd want to ring the bell after that . . . :shock:!

Actually, I'm certain I wouldn't even want to touch it!

Cray

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Thanks, everyone, for all the prompt replies. Information and entertainment! How can you beat it -- wait, let me rephrase that.
So now I have even more to study and learn. Thank goodness for Google!
By the way, is the servodog programming awfully difficult? Is there any easier way to run servos with LOR components?

Katrina

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No, It's not difficult, It gives you a lot of options and setting's.
when I used it on a talking skull, I had to set stopping points for the eyes and jaw. That took some time. If you set up the bell ringer to run the whole travel of the servo it should be easy? Also when the sequence ends the servo returns to it's default position,very quickly!. you don't want that to be grinding itself into the bell. That could damage the servo. Just things that take some adjusting, learning to make it work smoothly.
You should be fine. I just meant don't wait till the last minute to figure it out.
Good Luck,
Ron

(sorry about the bell ringer, I just like messing with Jim.)

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You know darn well that IS NOT Jim, they did not have video cameras when he was that young. I wonder if they even had cameras way back then.:P

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Servos are used for halloween, more than christmas. This forum is a good one.
http://www.halloweenforum.com/
But they don't always use LOR. For halloween, people use less expensive prop timers. But you can find a lot of info on servos and creative mounting and use of them.

Pete,
They had cameras, but you had to paint the emulsion on to glass plates in the dark. Then when you took the picture, you just took the lens cap of for a second.
Jim got some nasty powder burns from the flash powder!:P

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Also to just add to the mix. That in order to get a good ring, you want the clapper to just very quickly make contact and then back away. For an example the old door bell for the front door. If you were to take the cover off and have someone press the door bell button. You will notice that the striker or clapper if you wish will flash out and then back.

If it was me designing something to make the bell ring. I would get my hands on the old fashion door bell and remove the striker and coil assy. Find a way to mount it so that it is out of the weather and the tune it up and then learn what kind of delay it has and program around that know delay. Now the other half of it. This is not a light. It is an inductive load, meaning that when you turn off the Relay or SCR there is going to be a large induced voltage that will try to burn up relay contacts or blow out a SCR. Take measures to tame that large counter EMF.


P.S. get friendly with the care taker of a large church that have the automated bells. See if that person can and will show you their bell set-up and how it works.

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Yeah know if you had a rope tied to a bell that big and pulled it by hand you wouldn’t yank it all in one shot. You would pull it as far as you could, let it swing back, use gravity and pull it again on the down stroke. Once you got it to ring, it wouldn’t take nearly as much power to keep it going.

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I used to get to ring the bell at Arcola Baptist Church when I was a kid. But I think this bell may be different. I think this bell was made to be mounted solid, and you (sorry) whap the flapper back and forth like a dinner bell or school bell.
At the church, the bell itself rocked and that momentum would carry the rope (and the kid!) up off the floor. So I think it must have had a pulley the rope traveled over. Here, I found a picture.
Notice the flapper in Sarcoxie's bell has a place to attach a rope, in the church bell the rope travels over the pulley and rocks the entire bell.


Attached files 207003=11488-church bell.jpg

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What you have described is all true Katrina of a manually operated bell. Might of fact look to the right of the bell you have put a picture up of just now. There is an eyelet and a pivot point with a hammer on the other side. So it could be slowly swung from side to side or a rope yanked for rapid ringing.

But the automated bells that I spoke of I am sure it has some kind of hammer or striker that is operated off of a solenoid as I was trying to describe in my last post.

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Ok, I keep thinking about this, and I wanted to make sure it could work.
so I rigged up something with the servodog and It does work!
You still need to test it with the real bell, but I could hit this pipe really hard.



I could rig it to a door bell button, so people wouldn't have to knock.;)

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Awesome! Absolutely awesome.
So you have the Showtime software, and the adapter, and then is that card the servodog? The box is the DC power, because the servo has to have its own power, right? And then the sail arm thingy in metal square tubing -- where is the servo located?

I came across this link, most of which I don't understand. One of the comments on it suggests a piano hammer type action, which might be good as far as rebounding off the bell. Besides, I have a piano action down in the basement I could copy from and actually know a little bit about it.
http://forums.makezine.com/comments.php?DiscussionID=2058

But check out this gal's carillon! She's using servos and wooden balls on springs.



Endure the first part of the song -- the next is worth it!

There is a carillon at Southwest Missouri State University, an hour from where I live. I think I'll hunt down their hunchback and see what they use.
Which makes me think -- wouldn't it be cute to set up a hunchback doll with the servo moving his arm to hit the bell? And with just a little costume change he'd work for Halloween. Sorry, turned all girly on you.

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Ok, I thought you already had LOR set up, but yes you need the software, the adapter, and the usb cable that has the ferrite filters on it.
http://store.lightorama.com/usbcausewius.html.
I think that comes with the starter package. The Servodog, The DC power supply,The one here is 3 amps. They suggest you use a Y adapter for the big 1/4 scale servo, and run one set to the power supply,and the other to the controller, but since I wasn't using its full power, I just ran it off the servodog.
If you can measure the clapper on the bell, I will try and set this up so you can zip tie it to the clapper. Here are some pix,

Attached files 207026=11489-Bell-Ringer.jpg

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Sorry,
I just looked at my post.
I don't need the "A" measurement.
Just the "C" measurement (how far apart are your balls?)
And the "B" measurement (how far your balls are hanging down.)

I didn't want to come across as inappropriate!:)

Also, a lot of halloween witches are run with wind shield wiper motors.
They are cheap, but they are not easy to time accurately, there is a delay when the start and stop.

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