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diagram for 5050 RGB LED setup


dito

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Cracker please stay involved in this discussion... I like the positive & creative input! Im not afraid to test limits on things as long as people do like you have stated.. Check the voltage readings! I could go on about these things! I just want to be factual from what I have read to what folks here have done that is innovating!
I love innovating from ideas I have seen. Sometimes we gotta test some limits but check ALL for safety!
I appreciate everyones input on this matter!
once again thank you all for responding so quickly to my questions!!
Johnny

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thank you all for the replies, it has helped clear things up, especially the photos! one question i still have is why can rope light LED be OK at 150ft runs, but RGB can only be 5-10Meter runs?
and yes, thanks cracker, i will have to test my own double strip to see if i get dimming.

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dito wrote:

one question i still have is why can rope light LED be OK at 150ft runs, but RGB can only be 5-10Meter runs?

I believe the answer would be amperage?? Don't quote me on that, but from my knowledge in electrical I think it would be amperage differances..
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dito wrote:

thank you all for the replies, it has helped clear things up, especially the photos! one question i still have is why can rope light LED be OK at 150ft runs, but RGB can only be 5-10Meter runs?
and yes, thanks cracker, i will have to test my own double strip to see if i get dimming.


It has to do with Ohms law and the resistance of a cable, the voltage and the current.

Rope light is usually 110volt in the US and strip is usually 12vdc and some are 5vdc, so with some calculations we can show the difference the voltage makes to current for the same rated wattage used.



So the current required would be:

Current = power(watts) / Voltage

Current = 100 watts / 110 volts

= 0.91 amps @ 110 volts



Now for the same wattage used but running at 12vdc

current = 100 watts / 12 volts

= 8.3 amps @ 12 volts



The reason that strips are only 12vdc and 5vdc is because an LED has a rated forward voltage that it will run with, so the LEDs are connnected in series.

Example. An LED may have a forward voltage rating of 3 volts, if you connect 3 of theses LEDs in series you will get 9 volts and 3 volts will be required to be dropped through a resistor. This allows the strips to have a much smaller cuttable section than what is found on rope lights. For the same rated LED on a rope light working at 110v would require around 30+ LEDs connected in series to become an efficient LED circuit.



Now the next thing is resistance of a cable which effects the voltage and this as well can be shown using ohms law.

Voltage = Current (amps) x resistance (ohms)

So different cable sizes have a different resistance value, generally the larger the cable the lower the resistance.



20 guage wire has a resitance rating of 1.28 ohms per 100 feet

16 guage wire has a resitance rating of 0.40 ohms per 100 feet

So the voltage drop differences for a 5 amp load over 100 feet would look like this



20 gauge: Voltage = 5 amps x 1.28 ohms = 6.4 volts dropped over 100 feet



16 gauge: Voltage = 5 amps x 0.40 ohms = 2 volts dropped over 100 feet



So by using a lower voltage the % of voltage drop is a much higher with lower voltages than higher voltages over a given distance and this is why cable choice is also very important when using low voltage lighting and why power injection is used to get these extra distances.



I hope that makes it a bit more easier to understand why it is so
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hdracer wrote:

I believe the answer would be amperage?? Don't quote me on that, but from my knowledge in electrical I think it would be amperage differances..

That's part of the answer, but voltage and resistance is in there also!

The big reason is voltage. RGB strips are (typically) 12v, but rope light is (usually) 120v. The usual rule of thumb is that higher voltage can travel longer distances. For an example, your home is wired with 240v, but the distribution lines that power your neighborhood are about 10,000v, and the transmission lines that go across country are in the hundreds of kilo-volts. (Jeff Millard probably has better numbers.)

The other reason is the "wires" in the RGB strips are much smaller, and thus have higher resistance than the wires in rope lights. The tradeoff is that the smaller "wires" make them more flexible, lighter, and lest costly.
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Cracker wrote:

Troy Mann wrote:
hdracer wrote:
What about your end caps?
I have not gotten that for because I am only planning on planning on using each strip individually.

How you plan to attach the ends? You really don't want to connect strips together equaling more 16.3 feet. When you go longer then 16.3 feet you get a power drop and the second strip. Meaning the second strip will be dimmer than the first.




That is not completely true. I actually double up my strips on the same controller for my display and had zero signs of dimming on the second strip. However, I did not double up on every channel...about half. I used the LOR DC board, 30A DC power supply, 18AWG 4-wire for the power feeds and only about 20ft of wire between. I also just recently did the same and the run was like 50ft...I was a little worried, but showed no problems.

Just make sure you do your own testing and take power reading. Hate for you to set up and then it doesnt work.


Does "double up" mean you piggy back two RGB strips on one set of 3 channels on the controller (6 wires into 3 channels) or do you attach a second strip to the end of the first strip to make one really long strip?
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The size of the copper traces in the strip circuit can vary from manufacturer to manufactuer and in some cases you can run 2 strips connected together, but the general rule is to supply each strip with its own supply cable

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Does "double up" mean you piggy back two RGB strips on one set of 3 channels on the controller (6 wires into 3 channels) or do you attach a second strip to the end of the first strip to make one really long strip?

Very good question! I'd like to find out the difference , if any.
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Hmm does this also mean that when you piggy back on those 2 channels the lights do the same on both strips?
Example: like sharing a channel between 2 mini trees.
If so would it be possible to do 4 strips on 2 dc board channels? On the same controller...?:?:?

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imacericg wrote:

I am about ready to buy my first RGB strip, can someone give me a gut check that this strip:
http://www.aliexpress.com/fm-store/701799/209843764-329545582/5m-one-roll-5050-SMD-60LEDs-m-led-strip-waterproof-by-silicon-tubing-and-coating-RGB.html

Will work with LOR's CMB16D-QC controller?


Too much money in my option, they will work with the CMB16D.

This is the same type for half the price http://www.ebay.com/itm/180784140733?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649#ht_5170wt_1110
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Troy Mann wrote:

imacericg wrote:
I am about ready to buy my first RGB strip, can someone give me a gut check that this strip:
http://www.aliexpress.com/fm-store/701799/209843764-329545582/5m-one-roll-5050-SMD-60LEDs-m-led-strip-waterproof-by-silicon-tubing-and-coating-RGB.html

Will work with LOR's CMB16D-QC controller?


Too much money in my option, they will work with the CMB16D.

This is the same type for half the price http://www.ebay.com/itm/180784140733?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649#ht_5170wt_1110


Just be careful with both of those. They both have 60ct led's per meter.

Most people on here I read appear to like the 30ct leds better. Its really a matter of preference. There is a video foating around here that shows an comparison between the 60ct vs 30ct. To sum up the video, the 60ct from a distance almost looks a continuous light. Like a neon light would look like. Where the 30ct looks like separate bulbs with small spaces between them. Kind of like mini lights look like.

It's really all about the effect you going for.

I tired to look for the video, but was unable to find it. But maybe some else can chime in with the link, or video comparing the 60ct to the 30ct. I saw in on the forum about a week or two ago.

Personally before seeing the video. I was thinking 60ct per meter all of the way. Why not. The more the leds the better. But once saw the video, I was glad I did not dump the money into the 60's. I like the way the 30's look better!

Just adding this food for though.
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I just found this video on YouTube. At the 2.56 mark is where they compare the 60ct to the 30ct.

The video shows the the 60ct would be perfect for wall washing! If that's what your trying to achieve.

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Thank you Troy and Yankee!

I just submitted a best offer on eBay for 5 strips and I am planning on using them under my soffit for inexpensive color washing.

To be honest, I am just playing around at this point. Everything seems to be cheap so I am just tinkering :) (I love his hobby).

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ny_yankee_25 wrote:

Personally before seeing the video. I was thinking 60ct per meter all of the way. Why not. The more the leds the better. But once saw the video, I was glad I did not dump the money into the 60's. I like the way the 30's look better!

Last year I used 5-meter strips (8 strips, 24 channels, using 2 CMB-16D controllers), from Ray Wu, in my 12-foot spiral mega tree. Even though these were the 30-per-meter strips, they are almost too bright! The 60-per-meter would be overkill (and probably too much of a load for the power supply).
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I tend to agree here as I only use 30 LEDs per metre strip and find it more than enough. If i was going to wash walls with it then yes the 60 LED/m is the better choice

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do note that ray wu's are IP68 and the ebay ones are IP65. i have been researching the difference in IP ratings, Troy Mann wrote:

imacericg wrote:
I am about ready to buy my first RGB strip, can someone give me a gut check that this strip:
http://www.aliexpress.com/fm-store/701799/209843764-329545582/5m-one-roll-5050-SMD-60LEDs-m-led-strip-waterproof-by-silicon-tubing-and-coating-RGB.html

Will work with LOR's CMB16D-QC controller?


Too much money in my option, they will work with the CMB16D.

This is the same type for half the price http://www.ebay.com/itm/180784140733?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649#ht_5170wt_1110
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my reply got cut off...

what i was trying to say is that IP65 "can" get wet, IP67 can be submersed for a short period of time, and IP68 can be continuously immersed without damage. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IP_Code

to compare the same "product", you'll have to look for IP68 on ebay, http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_nkw=5m+5050+ip68+rgb&_sacat=0&_sop=15&_odkw=5m+5050+150led+ip68+rgb&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3286.c0.m270.l1313

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